Shafts

[jtrombetta]

I recently posted a reply about my opinion on shaft weights in the "ask the cuemaker" section. I said that I saw a lot of pro's, men and women playing with different shafts than the originals that came with their cues. You can tell by looking at the joint collars. Agree or disagree. All you professionals out there lets hear your opinion....:smile:

 

[Johnnyt]

I don't have an opinion yet...but I'm about to buy a low deflection shaft and find out. If I find out it's a con I'll be on here dogging low deflection shafts like a pit bull. They ain't cheap. Johnnyt

 

[Rod]

I don't have an opinion yet...but I'm about to buy a low deflection shaft and find out. If I find out it's a con I'll be on here dogging low deflection shafts like a pit bull. They ain't cheap. Johnnyt

Johnny if you asked me I'd say don't do it. I just bought one a short time ago. I have never owned one and I never will again. I don't know what the hell these guys are aiming at that make them think the shafts are more accurate but they ain't.

It doesn't matter whether I use a pred or my stock shaft, I still aim the exact same way. No improvement realize here what so ever.

These things ain't cheap as you said. So why would I pay more for a spineless smaller shaft that has the same deflection? Not to mention its not near as lively as my stock shafts. I have no clue, I must have been on drugs. I'm am gonna buy a longer stock shaft though. Sorry to hijack the thread but I had to vent.

PS I forgot, I tried one of these shafts years ago with the same results. I only need to get hit twice with a brick to know I don't like it.

Rod

 

[jtrombetta]

Rod, I agree- had good friend who is a BCA and VNEA national champ warn me about those shafts. He even showed me inside english shots that reacted way different and like crap. Oh yeah, had to be stupid and find out myself. JUNK!!! IMO

 

[mikepage]

Rod, I agree- had good friend who is a BCA and VNEA national champ warn me about those shafts. He even showed me inside english shots that reacted way different and like crap. Oh yeah, had to be stupid and find out myself. JUNK!!! IMO

Joe -- that's 'cause he--our mutual friend--is accustomed to playing with higher-squirt shafts.

A player can in time get accustomed to either one. The relevant question becomes who is better off in the long run,

--champion player A who is fully accustomed to a 12-inch pivot point stick,

or

--champion player B, who is fully accustomed to a 25-inch pivot point stick

Clearly the difference, if it exists at all, is small: we can point to champions in either camp. The argument of the low-squirt proponents is that the aim compensations for the low-squirt shaft are smaller, and in the end it is easier to do a small compensation accurately than a large compensation accurately.

 

[mreightball]

I am not a very good salesman because I sell cues and shafts (and many other items), but I tell my customers that they don't need to buy a low deflection shaft to reduce the amount of squirt they get by using right or left hand english just by using back hand english. I prove it to them by shooting a
cue ball straight up the table not using BHE and they can see the squirt by where the ball hits the cushion then I use BHE and they see how straight the ball goes. I hope this might help your decision.
Thanks
Ron

 

[jtrombetta]

Joe -- that's 'cause he--our mutual friend--is accustomed to playing with higher-squirt shafts.

A player can in time get accustomed to either one. The relevant question becomes who is better off in the long run,

--champion player A who is fully accustomed to a 12-inch pivot point stick,

or

--champion player B, who is fully accustomed to a 25-inch pivot point stick

Clearly the difference, if it exists at all, is small: we can point to champions in either camp. The argument of the low-squirt proponents is that the aim compensations for the low-squirt shaft are smaller, and in the end it is easier to do a small compensation accurately than a large compensation accurately.

Mike, you have a valid point, but I didn't like the smaller diameter shaft on the older models, the new ones might be better, they seemed a little mushy, not whippy, I could play with whippy before mushy. On a brighter side when are you opening the "SUPER ROOM", not being sarcastic folks, word on the street is this will be one of the nicest pool rooms anywhere!!
Hope to see you soon Mike, always a pleasure to see ya.

Joe T

 

[Rod]

Joe -- that's 'cause he--our mutual friend--is accustomed to playing with higher-squirt shafts.

A player can in time get accustomed to either one. The relevant question becomes who is better off in the long run,

--champion player A who is fully accustomed to a 12-inch pivot point stick,

or

--champion player B, who is fully accustomed to a 25-inch pivot point stick

Clearly the difference, if it exists at all, is small: we can point to champions in either camp. The argument of the low-squirt proponents is that the aim compensations for the low-squirt shaft are smaller, and in the end it is easier to do a small compensation accurately than a large compensation accurately.

Hi Mike,

I don't think it makes any difference. What ever either chooses works for them. But why change if what you use works well? I think people think there will be so little deflection it will be a big improvement. That simply is not the case.

I'm quite a distance from a champion player these days but I ain't no slouch. The first series Predator shaft had to much flex for me. Years Later I tried a 314 series. Recently I tried a 314-2 and in all cases it does not change the way I aim from my conventional shaft.

The 314-2 is the only one I owned or spent much time experimenting with. The others I just tried out for maybe 2 hours max. As mentioned earlier all I got was a smaller shaft, that feels to soft and did not change my aim point. BTW I use the same tip on all shafts.

Without going into a long story there are some very minor differences but giving up feel just was not worth it. I suspect a lot of champion players probably feel the same way.

Rod

 

[themack]

I guess it's just what you are used to. You can learn to adjust (if you want to change from what you have been shooting with.)

Now, the last poster said he tried a predator and recently a predator 314-2 and it doesn't change the way he aims. I am going to have to disagree a LOT here, especially on inside english. I have tested so many times with a normal shaft and a low deflection shaft. I set up the cueball on the head spot and put the object ball in dead center of table and cut the ball into the right corner pocket with high inside english to go around the table 3 rails. If i were to pocket the ball with the predator 314-2 then go the the normal non low-deflection shaft, the ball will overcut by at LEAST 1 diamond possibly 1.5 diamonds.

I learned to shoot with the predator shaft and inside english is very easy to pocket any shot, no matter the distance. I'm sure people can use their own shaft and do the same if they are used to it.

I would recommend you do try a predator or other low-deflection shaft. It's not for everybody, but i feel it is the best way to be the most consistent.

 

[Rod]

I guess it's just what you are used to. You can learn to adjust (if you want to change from what you have been shooting with.)

Now, the last poster said he tried a predator and recently a predator 314-2 and it doesn't change the way he aims. I am going to have to disagree a LOT here, especially on inside english. I have tested so many times with a normal shaft and a low deflection shaft. I set up the cueball on the head spot and put the object ball in dead center of table and cut the ball into the right corner pocket with high inside english to go around the table 3 rails. If i were to pocket the ball with the predator 314-2 then go the the normal non low-deflection shaft, the ball will overcut by at LEAST 1 diamond possibly 1.5 diamonds.

I learned to shoot with the predator shaft and inside english is very easy to pocket any shot, no matter the distance. I'm sure people can use their own shaft and do the same if they are used to it.

I would recommend you do try a predator or other low-deflection shaft. It's not for everybody, but i feel it is the best way to be the most consistent.

I think one of the key words is -- you learned to play with a predator. Some of the shots I tested many times was with inside english. With either shaft the cue ball deflects very close to the same amount. I was near the same distance as a spot shot. I tried other distances as well and they compare as I said very close to the same.

For me if there was a difference it was to small to make it worth the change. I played for years easily as a A+ player, so I know what works. Others mileage may vary so I thought it good to hear or see both sides of the coin. Like I said there are some minor differences, so if your a good player and feel lucky give one a try. I still have the shaft but most likely it will go up for sale unless I hear something magical I overlooked.

Rod

 

[Kurida]

While its very true that the most important thing about our cues is how well we are familiar or used to it....most of us is forgetting that low deflection shafts are not only valuable whenever we put english on the ball, but more importantly when we are not putting english on the ball. A low deflection shaft is more simply MORE FORGIVING PERIOD! Imagine trying to hit the cue ball at the center but at the moment of impact you failed to hit the cue ball accurately at the center missing it by a millimeter. The low deflection shaft will certainly help you in maintaining your line of aim and probably still pocket the object ball. You certainly can't expect this on a higher deflection shaft. For those who don't believe that low deflection shafts exists, I don't know if we are playing the same game.

 

[jtrombetta]

I think we got a little off track here. When I originally posted this thread my intent was noticing that top notch world class players were using different shafts than originally came with their cues. Not even thinking about low deflection, I was wondering if they just found new shafts somewhere else they thought hit better. I grew up playing in a town of about 40,000 and nobody in town even had a cue lathe to put tips on with. A guy who would put the old original french champion tips on would leave them full size. I would have a tip put on 6 months before a big tournament because it would take that long to get the tip shaped right. No kidding, it was a nightmare, no offense to my friend who put them on, he is a good guy. My point I guess was that I used to be so picky about putting a new tip on my cue that I would never have even considered a new shaft. I believe, when you hit a couple of balls with either a new cue, different style tip, or a new or different shaft, you either like it or you don't, and you don't grow into it. You pretty much know immediately.

 

[Kurida]

I agree that there are times "you just know" its the right cue/shaft instantly. I experienced that also. I have been playing with a 314 for a couple of years already and after shooting a couple of shots using a new shaft(mezzHPII), I knew instantly that I will never go back to my 314s. Don't get me wrong, 314's are great also. But what if a player doesn't have the luxury of changing shafts? The best thing to do I suppose is to play with what you have and learn all the shots with it.