I went to a poolroom to play in a tournament and the tournament had been cancled, but the APA had 9 Ball on that day and a buddy of mine needed someone to play on his team. So I started as a 4 and in 1 Month I was ranked an 8 and can't play on the team very much anymore because we can't stay under the 23 rule if I play. I really enjoy the league when I get to play, and expect that I will be a 9 next week and I can quit then because if you don't have 3-4 SL2's on your team and your a 9 you can't play.
Sl7
- Thread starter 8corneronbreak
- Start date
That is very interesting! I was completely unaware of an APA Master's league. Other than no call shot 8-ball the format sounds very cool. All they need to do now is add straight pool. Good luck;-)DoomCue said:
Too bad it isn't advertised more. I don't know if they have this league near my home or not but I would definitely play in a league like this.
I have to say though, the idea that the (normal) APA is just for amateurs, and so should not encourage a high level of play, is horrible. A path to higher level play should be a concern for any amateur organization. You cannot say that you are trying to grow pool as a sport, while at the same time creating an environment that does not encourage people who want to to get better. This pushes people away from the sport. Ok, there is a Master's league, but how many of these leagues are actually operating? Clearly not enough if all the serious players complain about how much sandbagging occurs in the league.
Handsumm
Banned
IMO, an APA skill level is an inaccurate description of a person's skill level (especially with all the sandbagging that supposedly doesn't go on anymore). The "so called" 6's and 7's are sometimes not even as good as the 4's. New players start as 4's and may very well be 7 speeds. 4's and 5's tend to not want to increase in skill level too quickly for their team's sake, etc.
Play BCA.
Play BCA.
The US Amateur is singlesl; Masters is a team format. You can have up to a maximum of 4 players on your team. Three players will play each night. The format is race to 7 per set, a combination of 5 8-ball games and 8 9-ball games. Each game won counts as a point. If you win all three sets, you can max out at 21 points. The emphasis is on the points (each game). It's possible to win 2 out of 3 sets, but still lose the match, so the emphasis is on a team effort. For the session, all points are cumulative. We have a city tournament twice a year (winners qualify for Vegas) - top 32 teams from the session play in the city tournament.Koop said:
The Raleigh area has done very well with this format - not only do the better players have a reason to play league, a lot of the lower-ranked players join Masters, in addition to the regular 8- and 9-ball league formats, so they can play better opponents.
The Raleigh area is home to the reigning national champions, Play2Win (and my team placed 5th last year). Play2Win took out Jason Kirkwood's (I'm sure you've heard of him) team in the finals last year.
Here is an example of the Masters scoresheet - notice there are no innings, defensive shots, etc.
There isn't really much information about Masters on the APA site, so definitely check with your LO.
-djb
That's a shame.Icon of Sin said:
I know there are a lot of good players in Baltimore, and the APA has a fairly large presence there. That seems to me to be an ignorant move on the part of your LO. Most of the better players refuse to play in handicapped leagues, so a non-handicapped league is an untapped market for your LO. I know in the Raleigh area, there were a lot of players who would never have considered playing in a league before our LO started Masters.
-djb
DoomCue said:
Well, i think that they do it different here than there. I joined the masters a month or so ago and although there is no handicap when you get to vegas, there is one now. It goes by the last SL you were rated. So, in a race to 7, the 8 still spots the 5, 3 games on the wire so then you have to win 7 to 4. And if the 5 has been out of league play for a while and has improved quite a bit, he still a 5 with no chance of going up.
Now that's just plain stupid. That's totally opposite of the intent and design of the Masters league. I'm guessing that your LO determined there wasn't a big enough demand for Masters league, and so he came up with a handicapped format to get more players involved. If so, that ain't Masters.PROG8R said:
How does your league determine who goes to Vegas?
-djb
Banks
Banned
APA7 or bust
I've been a 6 for a little over a year, but even having had some really good matches I still haven't made it to 7 yet, so don't worry about that too soon. The way I was improving I thought it would be a snap, but it's not that easy if you aren't already close to that level of play. Just keep your head up and fight for each rack every damn step of the way.
As far as the other goes..
I can only take so much APA-bashing with the same things that people always say and never take into consideration the facts.
First off, if you play in the APA.. guess what.. you're already agreeing to the rules, so quityer*****in.
Secondly, it is for Amateurs.. I was told that anyone who makes the majority of their income playing pool is not allowed (I know, hard to prove in some cases).
Btw, I don't hear anyone hollering up a storm about Masters being split out in BCA now from the other teams. That's a form of handicapping, too.
I was also told the ratings system were screwed up for a while between different areas.. this doesn't appear to be the case any more from what I saw in Vegas. No, 4s are not better than 6s, 7s are not 4s.. the only way this can come close to being true is by cheating, and it will never be fixed unless it is reported or your LO is cheating, too (which can also be reported). If a "7" joins and his team lets him start out as a 4, that can also be construed as cheating. They should be starting out at whatever the closest skill level is that they are known to be.
If you're a short-stop, why the hell would you be playing APA? Come on, seriously.. maybe I would play the minimum number of matches to be eligible for singles competition, but that's about it.
The APA built a good business model that forces teams to multiply and thereby getting more players involved. You know this coming into it, so again, complain elsewhere unless you planned on your entire team not improving.
I've been a 6 for a little over a year, but even having had some really good matches I still haven't made it to 7 yet, so don't worry about that too soon. The way I was improving I thought it would be a snap, but it's not that easy if you aren't already close to that level of play. Just keep your head up and fight for each rack every damn step of the way.
As far as the other goes..
I can only take so much APA-bashing with the same things that people always say and never take into consideration the facts.
First off, if you play in the APA.. guess what.. you're already agreeing to the rules, so quityer*****in.
Secondly, it is for Amateurs.. I was told that anyone who makes the majority of their income playing pool is not allowed (I know, hard to prove in some cases).
Btw, I don't hear anyone hollering up a storm about Masters being split out in BCA now from the other teams. That's a form of handicapping, too.
I was also told the ratings system were screwed up for a while between different areas.. this doesn't appear to be the case any more from what I saw in Vegas. No, 4s are not better than 6s, 7s are not 4s.. the only way this can come close to being true is by cheating, and it will never be fixed unless it is reported or your LO is cheating, too (which can also be reported). If a "7" joins and his team lets him start out as a 4, that can also be construed as cheating. They should be starting out at whatever the closest skill level is that they are known to be.
If you're a short-stop, why the hell would you be playing APA? Come on, seriously.. maybe I would play the minimum number of matches to be eligible for singles competition, but that's about it.
The APA built a good business model that forces teams to multiply and thereby getting more players involved. You know this coming into it, so again, complain elsewhere unless you planned on your entire team not improving.
Actually this can not happen...
"...If a "7" joins and his team lets him start out as a 4, that can also be construed as cheating. They should be starting out at whatever the closest skill level is that they are known to be."...
My understanding unless the person changes their name they will be automatically picked up by the software that all LO's must use ! When I switched locales they had all of my history player numbers and handicap the second week I played!
"...If a "7" joins and his team lets him start out as a 4, that can also be construed as cheating. They should be starting out at whatever the closest skill level is that they are known to be."...
My understanding unless the person changes their name they will be automatically picked up by the software that all LO's must use ! When I switched locales they had all of my history player numbers and handicap the second week I played!
It took me 16 years. Played in the BUSCH League in 1991. Was a decent 4. The team was a bunch of dope heads and wanted me to sandbag. After that session I quit. Started up again in 2006. First match I played I was a 4. Lost the lag but ran the first rack when it was my turn. Broke the next and came up dry but ran out the next turn at the table. Next rack broke and made the 8. The other team was crying and complain that there was no way that I was a 4. The rules state that all new players start as a 4. They lost my records but it didn't matter. I talked to the other captain and player and told them that I wasn't trying to sandbag. If I was would I play like that. The player said it didn't matter anyways because if we played 10 games he couldn't beat me. Next week I was a 7. I told my captain that there is no way that I will ever sandbag and if he ever told me to I would quit. I play against a lot 5 and 6 that should be ranked higher. They sandbag but it doesn't do them any good, they never win the City Cup. Our team doesn't either but we all try our best.
I was going to ask my L.O. last night about the possiblity of a Masters division in our area but I had to leave early after shooting and never got the chance. Then I logged on to our league web site and wow he posted a new section today trying to get a masters division together for the June session. I don't know if I am ready for this (I am a strong five and fully expect to be a six by the end of this session) but I think that I am ready to get around some more serious players. Not that I don't have fun now it has been great learning but there are to many people that don't want to get better they are there just for a reason to go out drinking and pool is a side efect of that not the other way around which is what I believe most of the more serious players do.
Puck
ctapa.com
From CT
In the Connecticut APA the masters division is just starting to gain popularity. The format became available to us last year, but we only have about 3 divisions at this point. However, it seems like we could have as many as 6 divisions by the end of this year.
I think the LO started to offer the format in response to sandbagging. I'm not sure how successful it will be though, as "A" and "B" level players in my area prefer BCA or in-house leagues.
I recently moved up to a 8-ball SL7 after six years in the league. The first thing I did was tell the captains of each of my teams that I wanted to stay as an SL7. It's been a lot more fun for me since I went up; no longer having to worry about my handicap going up. Now I focus more on teaching myself and my teammates how to play and enjoy the game. I don't play as much as I used to because of the 23 rule, but I understand that I'll have to play in a different league if I don't like it. Besides if I left the APA, who would teach my teammates how to improve their games?
It might not get me to the Nationals at Vegas, but right now I'm having more fun with it. If I can have a good year as an SL7 then next year I might try to qualify for the US Amateur.
In 9-ball, I'm still ranked an SL6 and my team has qualified for the States this year. Hopefully I can go to Vegas with them.
In the Connecticut APA the masters division is just starting to gain popularity. The format became available to us last year, but we only have about 3 divisions at this point. However, it seems like we could have as many as 6 divisions by the end of this year.
I think the LO started to offer the format in response to sandbagging. I'm not sure how successful it will be though, as "A" and "B" level players in my area prefer BCA or in-house leagues.
I recently moved up to a 8-ball SL7 after six years in the league. The first thing I did was tell the captains of each of my teams that I wanted to stay as an SL7. It's been a lot more fun for me since I went up; no longer having to worry about my handicap going up. Now I focus more on teaching myself and my teammates how to play and enjoy the game. I don't play as much as I used to because of the 23 rule, but I understand that I'll have to play in a different league if I don't like it. Besides if I left the APA, who would teach my teammates how to improve their games?
It might not get me to the Nationals at Vegas, but right now I'm having more fun with it. If I can have a good year as an SL7 then next year I might try to qualify for the US Amateur.
In 9-ball, I'm still ranked an SL6 and my team has qualified for the States this year. Hopefully I can go to Vegas with them.
Puck said:In the Connecticut APA the masters division is just starting to gain popularity. The format became available to us last year, but we only have about 3 divisions at this point. However, it seems like we could have as many as 6 divisions by the end of this year.
I think the LO started to offer the format in response to sandbagging. I'm not sure how successful it will be though, as "A" and "B" level players in my area prefer BCA or in-house leagues.
I recently moved up to a 8-ball SL7 after six years in the league. The first thing I did was tell the captains of each of my teams that I wanted to stay as an SL7. It's been a lot more fun for me since I went up; no longer having to worry about my handicap going up. Now I focus more on teaching myself and my teammates how to play and enjoy the game. I don't play as much as I used to because of the 23 rule, but I understand that I'll have to play in a different league if I don't like it. Besides if I left the APA, who would teach my teammates how to improve their games?
It might not get me to the Nationals at Vegas, but right now I'm having more fun with it. If I can have a good year as an SL7 then next year I might try to qualify for the US Amateur.
In 9-ball, I'm still ranked an SL6 and my team has qualified for the States this year. Hopefully I can go to Vegas with them.
Good luck with your "states".
Im a 7 in 8ball and a 9 in 9ball. I started as a 7 in 9ball and then went to an 8 the next week and stayed there for almost a year. I took some flack for it because I played the 9s even but I did not lay down in league play.
I guess my average was just an 8.
I am living proff that you can play on an honest team and make nationals.
A couple years ao my 8ball team won our regionals and went to nationals.
We were correctly rated and nobody sandbagged. We all agree that its stupid. Theres no signals or secret phrases for playing safe or any other form of cheating. I really dont understand people that can pay money each week to not play their best.
Every team I have been on has had to change due to people increasing. I understand this and so do they. They want to improve and thats why people play. You just splinter off and start another team or others leave and start another team. They are still friends and pool players so why quit.
There is a level of frustration sometimes with the handicaps and not being able to stay on a team with friends but thats the nature of the beast.
I understand where I stand in the big picture of the pool world but many of the players in the APA just dont get to see the top regional or pro level players enough to understand the gap between.
My advie to everyone is to focus very very very little on the APAs SL and just concentrate on improving. The SL number will change on its own.
I have seen people cheat so that they move up a SL and that I will never understand. The SL is just an indicator of your play in short races over a brief time. Its not 100% accurate.
Good luck again
Well put a big rep for you!
I have played since the bush days (no not george!) I played on one team for years and then when the captain got win crazy after making the nationals and was pressuring folks instead of letting them just play their games I left and started my own team we play to have fun ! and the result is we are in a in house league out of Mr Cues II with about 65 - 70 teams on 4 nights playing and we are 10 points out in first with 2 weeks left! We do not sandbag when a player raises his or her level we just try and match up and we just continue to find a way! I have made many good friends over the years that share the love of pool and would never give this up!
One thing that many do not seem to realize is that a six in say my league will and in most smaller leagues should be a 7 ! and depending on the size and talent of your particular division handicaps really are only relative to your competition since it is a measurement of how you play against those individuals only ! When you make the Nationals (Vegas ) you will have a much better view of yours and others true ratings IMO!
frankncali said:
I have played since the bush days (no not george!) I played on one team for years and then when the captain got win crazy after making the nationals and was pressuring folks instead of letting them just play their games I left and started my own team we play to have fun ! and the result is we are in a in house league out of Mr Cues II with about 65 - 70 teams on 4 nights playing and we are 10 points out in first with 2 weeks left! We do not sandbag when a player raises his or her level we just try and match up and we just continue to find a way! I have made many good friends over the years that share the love of pool and would never give this up! One thing that many do not seem to realize is that a six in say my league will and in most smaller leagues should be a 7 ! and depending on the size and talent of your particular division handicaps really are only relative to your competition since it is a measurement of how you play against those individuals only ! When you make the Nationals (Vegas ) you will have a much better view of yours and others true ratings IMO!
PKM said:
I say yes and no.
Its taken me a while to understand why some people play APA(or any league) yet dont try to improve or do the things required to move up.
As for going to another league I dont agree with that. The APA is basically a small part of a persons pool world. Or at least it should be.
Why stop? Its the same thing that seems to happen to many good players as they gain notoriety for being good. Many drop their old friends and seem to look down upon them for being lessor of a pool player.
The APA is a social gathering that still has competition. Its not solely about winning and not solely about meeting and socializing.
One of the biggest mistake people and teams make is only playing on league night or adding another night. I find it better to play socially on other nights together. PLayers tend to improve faster and are more receptive to trying to improve. In a league night setting the players are more likely in competition mode and will question help more.
Also playing on other nights keeps the team together and theres less negativity.
Mr Lucky -- I see your from Atlanta. The first APA league I took part in was in Athens Ga. I played regionals in Atlanta at the original Mr Cues years ago and have spent many nights around pool rooms in the Atl area.
I cant deny that I would like to go back to Nationals. I feel fortunate to have made it when I did. I had only been back in the APA for 2 years. The first year back my team lost in the finals of regionals so it was sweet to win it.
I have an extra motivator for returning as well.... I lost the last match for
my team when I was there the first time. I was not happy with my play at all. There was some team issues as well but I was happy with my teammates play. I lost one match and won a 3 but that loss really hurts. I should not have lost.
This year I am on 2 teams and hopefully one of them will make it. Both are okay or average teams but we have a chance if the rolls go right. You have to get a break or two along the way.
I also play the Triple play in Vegas and have gotten 5th 3 times(all three times playing)!! Those top teams are tough.
A bad APA ruling was made last year involving the Triple Play. All players must be from the same league operators area. I dont quite get this one.
I played each year with some buddies from Alabama that I have known forever. We met each year in Vegas after I moved to SoCal and played pool and socialized. Thats what the APA should be about. Cant believe they took that from me. I understand what they were trying to accomplish but it was the wrong and lazy way to try and prevent some
certain teams.
good luck to your teams -- you have a nice room there in Atl to play out of.
I'm sure we have bumped heads ..
at some time or the other I have played out of Cues since Richard first opened in Duluth and moved over to CuesII when he opened there! and Yes its a great room with a lot of excellent players we even have Johnny Archer as the house Pro He comes in on thursday league nights when he is in town and does "play Johnny " matches with us for prizes!
at some time or the other I have played out of Cues since Richard first opened in Duluth and moved over to CuesII when he opened there!
and Yes its a great room with a lot of excellent players we even have Johnny Archer as the house Pro He comes in on thursday league nights when he is in town and does "play Johnny " matches with us for prizes!