Szam Tribute

skins

Likes to draw
Silver Member
Fuuny how some people see the world.... they sit on the sidelines and pontificate.......bellowing expertise and opinions
crafted by their own prejudicial thinking regardless of how arrogant and stupid stupid it makes them appear.....Tsh...Tsh....Tsh.

Gonzo...great friggin' pool cue.......Bob Owen is a gentleman and extremely talented cue-maker. When you get home later,
check out the shaft design we discussed earlier today. Bob's design is ingenuous and the hit and feel is as great as my EP cue.

On the sidelines??? Another ignorant statement... I'm knee deep in the business of making cues for 25 years my friend... What do you do FOR/IN the business but buy a few cues and watch us out here doing the work.... YOU are the side-liner!... You have nothing but opinions based on partial participation. At least I get in there and put out my ideas for all to see. I haven't heard many negatives...

You can call it arrogant all you want. That's because you don't know the difference...

I never said a bad word about Bob's work. He is a member of the ACA. I respect him and his work. I just stated the fact that this cue is not a tribute but a direct copy. AND IT IS JUST THAT. Color differences and all...

If you cant handle that then YOU need to go back to "cue school"...

Now let's hug and makeup... LOL:grin:
 
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skins

Likes to draw
Silver Member
I don't give a crap if it is a copy or a tribute or whatever stupid name you
want to call it. It is a nicely constructed billiard instrument that I'm certain
plays as well as it looks. Congrats on the new cue. Ignore the idiots who
think it is an unforgivable crime to "copy" a damn pool cue. :rolleyes:

Idiot's is a strong word my friend. Answer me this; Is there anything, in your mind, that is not fair to copy?

I think I'll just go record a new song using the music from another band and heck I like the lyrics too so I'm gonna use some of those THEN I'm gonna sell the song out of the back of my trunk... Is that fair? Ya know, I saw this colored puzzle cube the other day that I really like. Now I have access to a manufacturing facility so I think I'm gonna make those with different colors than what I saw so it's not a copy ( at least how Bava figures it :rolleyes: ) Then sell those out of the back of my car... Is this ok? Do you draw the line at pool cues?? Is that where you stand?

Gonzo, you have a nicely built cue from Bob. It's just not what I would have done out of respect for the maker... Enjoy your cue none the less..
 
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JoshStodola

My stroke is garbage
Silver Member
Idiot's is a strong word my friend. Answer me this; Is there anything, in your mind, that is not fair to copy?

There's a stronger word "copyright" and it is defined as legal right created
by the law of a country that grants the creator of an original work
exclusive rights to its use and distribution, usually for a limited time
.
All of this stuff has been exhausted centuries ago. If you don't want
something copied, there are simple legal measures that you take to
prevent it! What I find ridiculous and humorous is the idiots that
make a big deal out of work being copied, when it is not even their work!
It's one thing to disagree with it, but to step up and say it is wrong, is
really wrong.

I think I'll just go record a new song using the music from another band and heck I like the lyrics too so I'm gonna use some of those THEN I'm gonna sell the song out of the back of my trunk... Is that fair?

What the hell are you rambling about? Songs are remade all the time,
exactly word for word. And the kids that hear the new version have
never heard of the original. But sometimes the remake is what causes
them to find out about the original. Get it?

Ya know, I saw this colored puzzle cube the other day that I really like. Now I have access to a manufacturing facility so I think I'm gonna make those with different colors than what I saw so it's not a copy ( at least how Bava figures it :rolleyes: ) Then sell those out of the back of my car... Is this ok? Do you draw the line at pool cues?? Is that where you stand?

More rambling. I think you might be referring to a Rubik's cube.
Your answer is here, please read!

It's just not what I would have done out of respect for the maker...

What you would have done? You mean if in some fantasy land you
spent 32 years making pool cues like Bob Owen has, then you would
make a different decision? Out of respect for someone that you have
never even met? Just stop it already. :confused::confused::confused:
 

skins

Likes to draw
Silver Member
There's a stronger word "copyright" and it is defined as legal right created
by the law of a country that grants the creator of an original work
exclusive rights to its use and distribution, usually for a limited time
.
All of this stuff has been exhausted centuries ago. If you don't want
something copied, there are simple legal measures that you take to
prevent it! What I find ridiculous and humorous is the idiots that
make a big deal out of work being copied, when it is not even their work!
It's one thing to disagree with it, but to step up and say it is wrong, is
really wrong.



What the hell are you rambling about? Songs are remade all the time,
exactly word for word. And the kids that hear the new version have
never heard of the original. But sometimes the remake is what causes
them to find out about the original. Get it?



More rambling. I think you might be referring to a Rubik's cube.
Your answer is here, please read!



What you would have done? You mean if in some fantasy land you
spent 32 years making pool cues like Bob Owen has, then you would
make a different decision? Out of respect for someone that you have
never even met? Just stop it already. :confused::confused::confused:

First off blowhard, you've never met me either and TRULLY have no clue... I've been involved in making cues for over 25 years. Look who's the IDIOT now. ALL of my work is either original, reworked from inspiration outside the cue word, or "tweaked" with the ok from the original maker..Many hundreds, maybe closer to a thousand looks. In 25 years I have never seen a cue and THEN copied it's look. WOW how can that be done you say? Because I actually think and try and make sure I don't do it. Not hard to do when you put your mind to it.. YOU must not have that capability of grasping that concept...

Contrary to what you may think, "I" respect any maker/artist for "their" vision and their decision to make/create what they want. If you can wrap your short sighted mind around that you might get what I'm saying. My point is to focus on creating and not copying. Many in all fields of manufacture recreate all the time. It's called inspiration. That's how I think it should be done.. Recreate not repeat...

As for your other comments, I've been in the music industry 36 years and know all about "remakes".. The difference is that they're released publicaly with permission from the owner of the music rights be it the original artist or the rights holder. Either way they get paid for their "leasing" of their work... I'm talking about taking without consideration of compensation to the artist. THATS what happens all to much in the Billiard industry... Still confused? If you are than you're hopeless...
 

JoshStodola

My stroke is garbage
Silver Member
First off blowhard, you've never met me either and TRULLY have no clue... I've been involved in making cues for over 25 years. Look who's the IDIOT now. ALL of my work is either original, reworked from inspiration outside the cue word, or "tweaked" with the ok from the original maker..Many hundreds, maybe closer to a thousand looks. In 25 years I have never seen a cue and THEN copied it's look. WOW how can that be done you say? Because I actually think and try and make sure I don't do it. Not hard to do when you put your mind to it.. YOU must not have that capability of grasping that concept...

You're right I have no clue who you are. You have a name of "skins"
and no signature. You are just an alias! And I looked at some threads
you started and don't see anything about your work. Just a bunch of
compliments for Keith Josey! I am guessing that by knowing him you
think you are some kind of master cuemaker. But after 25 years I
probably should've heard of you by now...? Where can I see your
work? You seem proud of it, so where is it? I've known about Bob
Owen for a long time, how's come I know about him and not you?

with permission from the owner of the music rights be it the original artist or the rights holder. Either way they get paid for their "leasing" of their work

Ahh so you do grasp this concept! Incredible. Do you have
the same rights to your aforementioned "original" works? If you
actually cared about someone copying them, you would!
 

skins

Likes to draw
Silver Member
"You are just an alias!"

"Where can I see yourwork? You seem proud of it, so where is it?"

then call me "AliASS"

As for my work:

Josey Custom Cues; every cue since 1999, I've been his design and code writing partner since then.....Cognoscenti; many of Joe's designs, other makers I've done work for/with;... Kikel, Bludworth, Colorado, Carolina, Tascarella. more to come...
 
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Bavafongoul

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Skins is someone you should ignore....he bullshits and likes to stir up trouble. He tried to do that after I got my Jerry R. cue this past April
with his "well intended" PM messages......the man speaks with forked tongue........in one of the PM I received from skins he wrote........
."I hope you don't take my "questioning" negatively. I'm only looking out for a fellow players/collectors interest.".

You can see from his tone and overall demeanor that's he's an asshole that has some constipation issues and is highly prone to condescend
whenever he doesn't agree with you......personally, he's just someone to avoid.

Matt B.
 

JoshStodola

My stroke is garbage
Silver Member
Josey Custom Cues; every cue since 1999, I've been his design and code writing partner since then.....Cognoscenti; many of Joe's designs, other makers I've done work for/with;... Kikel, Bludworth, Colorado, Carolina, Tascarella. more to come...

You are an idiot. I asked you to SHOW me some of your work.
Not rattle off a bunch of names, as if anybody will believe you!
25 years you should have something to show. Just because
you are Keith's shop custodian and/or grunt work programmer, does
not make you any kind of definitive source for cue design theft
guidelines or the ethics behind making a tribute/copy/remake/etc.
Also, you like to chime in and willfully criticize other people's work
(like Rauenzahn) without reason, assuming that your opinion on the
subject has any merit at all. You're just another high-horsed big
mouth that thinks his opinion is superior to anyone and everyone.
Good luck!

I am sure all of the names you listed above really enjoy being
associated with all the crap you've spewed in this post. :wink:
 

DrGonzo

As your attorney...
Silver Member
You are an idiot. I asked you to SHOW me some of your work.
Not rattle off a bunch of names, as if anybody will believe you!
25 years you should have something to show. Just because
you are Keith's shop custodian and/or grunt work programmer, does
not make you any kind of definitive source for cue design theft
guidelines or the ethics behind making a tribute/copy/remake/etc.
Also, you like to chime in and willfully criticize other people's work
(like Rauenzahn) without reason, assuming that your opinion on the
subject has any merit at all. You're just another high-horsed big
mouth that thinks his opinion is superior to anyone and everyone.
Good luck!

I am sure all of the names you listed above really enjoy being
associated with all the crap you've spewed in this post. :wink:

I can say that my experiences with Dave Kikel have been nothing but excellent in the past. :thumbup:
 

skins

Likes to draw
Silver Member
Skins is someone you should ignore....he bullshits and likes to stir up trouble. He tried to do that after I got my Jerry R. cue this past April
with his "well intended" PM messages......the man speaks with forked tongue........in one of the PM I received from skins he wrote........
."I hope you don't take my "questioning" negatively. I'm only looking out for a fellow players/collectors interest.".

You can see from his tone and overall demeanor that's he's an asshole that has some constipation issues and is highly prone to condescend
whenever he doesn't agree with you......personally, he's just someone to avoid.

Matt B.

Matt, you are seriously a wannabe of the biggest sort. You know nothing about cues and when called out you resort to spewing trash like this with no source of truth.

What I said to you in the past I meant. What I sadly now have to say today, I mean as well.

YOU are the "voice" NO ONE should listen to... Every Kingdom has its "fool" ... YOU are AZB's...

As for Josh, here ya go.... Just a sample.. If you want more references just look at any JOSEY cue and most Cognoscenti's and you'll find me...

[/URL

[URL=http://s36.photobucket.com/user/quemast/media/59C505C6-7004-4D22-9143-FFADB745ACE4_zpsfipob90l.jpg.html]













[/URL

[URL=http://s36.photobucket.com/user/quemast/media/Shared%20Cues/Flame3_zpsd7abb069.jpg.html]





 
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JoshStodola

My stroke is garbage
Silver Member
Josh,

Here's a folder I have on Photobucket with just another sample.... I guess I don't have to throw around names anymore huh?

http://s36.photobucket.com/user/quemast/library/Josey 2?sort=3&page=1

Those are some nice cues by Keith Josey. I have
heard of him before, a long time ago! His designs
are unique and his cues are easily identifiable. He
is on the board of directors of the American
Cuemakers Association. My question is, why in the
hell are you taking credit for his work? What the
hell do you have to do with these cues? When
I go to his web site I don't see anything on there
about "skins", or anybody else besides his wife Sheri.
This is how masters of the custodial arts get fired! :cool:
 

skins

Likes to draw
Silver Member
Those are some nice cues by Keith Josey. I have
heard of him before, a long time ago! His designs
are unique and his cues are easily identifiable. He
is on the board of directors of the American
Cuemakers Association. My question is, why in the
hell are you taking credit for his work? What the
hell do you have to do with these cues? When
I go to his web site I don't see anything on there
about "skins", or anybody else besides his wife Sheri.
This is how masters of the custodial arts get fired! :cool:


I designed, drew, created the CAD drawings, created the CAM files for his machines for ALL of his cues so he can reproduce them, which I've stated already, since 1999.

Do I take credit for the work? I'll tell you what, you call Keith and Sherri and ask them who gets credit.. Then you can call Joe at Cognoscenti and ask him as well... Thank You for the nice words about my work...

I work with Keith because his construction and attention to detail are top notch. Same with Joe.

I'm not on the Josey web site because "I" choose not to be...

Now, once again, Bob builds nice cues. I never said he didn't. Just built a cue I wouldn't have done... THATS ALL END OF STORY

As for Bava, well he'll be hard to ignore...;)
 

JoshStodola

My stroke is garbage
Silver Member
I designed, drew, created the CAD drawings, created the CAM files for his machines for ALL of his cues so he can reproduce them, which I've stated already, since 1999.

Do I take credit for the work? I'll tell you what, you call Keith and Sherri and ask them who gets credit.. Then you can call Joe at Cognoscenti and ask him as well... Thank You for the nice words about my work...

I work with Keith because his construction and attention to detail are top notch. Same with Joe.

I'm not on the Josey web site because "I" choose not to be...

Now, once again, Bob builds nice cues. I never said he didn't. Just built a cue I wouldn't have done... THATS ALL END OF STORY

As for Bava, well he'll be hard to ignore...;)

So he took someone else's design and put his name on it?
Is that not exactly what you came here to complain about?
This is just too funny. I've had enough! I am out. Very
nice cue Gonzo and top notch work as usual from Bob Owen.
 

skins

Likes to draw
Silver Member
So he took someone else's design and put his name on it?
Is that not exactly what you came here to complain about?
This is just too funny. I've had enough! I am out. Very
nice cue Gonzo and top notch work as usual from Bob Owen.

No. You just don't get it do you... I WORK with Keith to build cues. We are partners of sorts. I just do it from outside the shop... Geez it's like pullin' teeth around here...

I'm glad you've had enough. Though now you more aware as well...

Enjoy your cues and good rolls...:smile:
 

Bavafongoul

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Anyone thinking of getting a cue from Shurtz......please ignore the inane remarks posted by skins.

Bob Owen builds a cue that based upon appearance will compete with any cue-maker you know.......but the part you want to hear more about.....
you need to hear more about......is the way Bob Owen made cues play.........."SENSATIONAL"........my Owen cue plays as sweet as my
Ed Prewitt that costs twice as much......Gee, that kinda makes my Owen cue a bargain.

Do yourself a favor and when it is time to order a custom pool cue, call Bob and discover for yourself what a sweetheart of a guy he is to
speak with.....just to discuss cue designs with and if and when you get around to discussing a cue you want him to build, then get ready for
the treat of your life......not only during the building of your cue but when it arrives.

If you doubt me, just ask Gonzo how much he loves his new cue.....send him a PM.......I screwed up my design by trying to be way too creative
but in terms of the hit and feel, my Owen cue successfully competes with any cue made.......and I do mean any........and that can turn into big
savings too......why pay for a expensive custom cue via the resale market when you can get a better pool cue made for less money with Bob Owen.

Matt B.


p.s Gonzo, what weight on your pool cue? Have you examined the conical shaft taper shape we discussed.
 
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DrGonzo

As your attorney...
Silver Member
Anyone thinking of getting a cue from Shurtz......please ignore the inane remarks posted by skins.

Bob Owen builds a cue that based upon appearance will compete with any cue-maker you know.......but the part you want to hear more about.....
you need to hear more about......is the way Bob Owen made cues play.........."SENSATIONAL"........my Owen cue plays as sweet as my
Ed Prewitt that costs twice as much......Gee, that kinda makes my Owen cue a bargain.

Do yourself a favor and when it is time to order a custom pool cue, call Bob and discover for yourself what a sweetheart of a guy he is to
speak with.....just to discuss cue designs with and if and when you get around to discussing a cue you want him to build, then get ready for
the treat of your life......not only during the building of your cue but when it arrives.

If you doubt me, just ask Gonzo how much he loves his new cue.....send him a PM.......I screwed up my design by trying to be way too creative
but in terms of the hit and feel, my Owen cue successfully competes with any cue made.......and I do mean any........and that can turn into big
savings too......why pay for a expensive custom cue via the resale market when you can get a better pool cue made for less money with Bob Owen.

Matt B.


p.s Gonzo, what weight on your pool cue? Have you examined the conical shaft taper shape we discussed.

I asked for 18.5 and it came in spot on 18.5 on my home scale. I couldn't be happier with it. It feels lighter than it is, but somehow more solid than the steel jointed cues I own. The hit is impossible to describe...solid as hell, but soft with the ivory joint.

I did check out the conical taper of the shaft. I'm sure this is what goes a long ways in the cues solid feel. The combined with the ivory joint and ivory ferrules is nothing but sweeeeeeeeeeeeet!
 

Bavafongoul

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Well, your specs are the exact same as mine......if you don't mind my presumptuous approach.......please add me to your list of beneficiaries ......one helluva cue ,,,,,,it really does dazzle with the veneers you selected.
 
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