Telling player she needs better cue?

Billy_Bob

Billy_Bob

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I know a lady who recently started playing in pool tournaments (after not playing for many years). She has been playing with the cue she has always used and has steadily been improving. Her cue has a small diameter shaft like 11mm, but this is what she has played with in the past.

So this guy who is an excellent player tells her she needs a 13mm cue! And so she gets a 13mm cue and her game of course goes down the tubes.

If she is playing well with the cue she has played with in the past, why on earth would anyone advise her to get something totally different? (If it works, don't fix it.)

I have seen a few excellent players hand out advice to other players which makes their playing get WORSE, not better.

I know one guy who did not like it one bit that I was getting information about playing on the internet and that I would not listen to anything he had to say. I did this because I did not ever see one of his "students" ever win a tournament. Actually they all played worse after listening to his advice. I'm playing much better after listening to the advice I find on the internet - I'm always improving.

So is it your experience that *some* players will deliberately give out wrong information/advice? Maybe to keep the other players from winning tournaments or whatever?
 
I don't know of anyone giving out bad info on purpose, but I do know of a lot of people who think their way is the best way. And, as most of us know, what works for one person doesn't necessarily work for other people.
 
Billy_Bob said:
I know a lady who recently started playing in pool tournaments (after not playing for many years). She has been playing with the cue she has always used and has steadily been improving. Her cue has a small diameter shaft like 11mm, but this is what she has played with in the past.

So this guy who is an excellent player tells her she needs a 13mm cue! And so she gets a 13mm cue and her game of course goes down the tubes.

If she is playing well with the cue she has played with in the past, why on earth would anyone advise her to get something totally different? (If it works, don't fix it.)

I have seen a few excellent players hand out advice to other players which makes their playing get WORSE, not better.

I know one guy who did not like it one bit that I was getting information about playing on the internet and that I would not listen to anything he had to say. I did this because I did not ever see one of his "students" ever win a tournament. Actually they all played worse after listening to his advice. I'm playing much better after listening to the advice I find on the internet - I'm always improving.

So is it your experience that *some* players will deliberately give out wrong information/advice? Maybe to keep the other players from winning tournaments or whatever?
Click to expand...

I can say that many pool "players" are overly willing to spread their knowledge because one application works for them. Its like teaching 2 different people the same stroke...one person is 6'7", the other is 5'4". It just doesnt work and if that "player" had any sense he would have told her to play with several different cues in the room and find a diameter that fits her, instead of her just going on heresay. In other words...some folks cant shop off the rack, they need a custom fit...just my opinion!!
 
Adding to your game

Any time you make a change, it takes time to adjust. Changing the grip, bridge, stance, stroke, or equipment. I went to Randyg's school twice to become a certified instructor. After the first time, it took about 5 months for it all to kick in. They say, " You have to give the medicine time to work ". I believe it!
Purdman :cool:
 
Billy_Bob said:
I know a lady who recently started playing in pool tournaments (after not playing for many years). She has been playing with the cue she has always used and has steadily been improving. Her cue has a small diameter shaft like 11mm, but this is what she has played with in the past.

So this guy who is an excellent player tells her she needs a 13mm cue! And so she gets a 13mm cue and her game of course goes down the tubes.

If she is playing well with the cue she has played with in the past, why on earth would anyone advise her to get something totally different? (If it works, don't fix it.)

I have seen a few excellent players hand out advice to other players which makes their playing get WORSE, not better.

I know one guy who did not like it one bit that I was getting information about playing on the internet and that I would not listen to anything he had to say. I did this because I did not ever see one of his "students" ever win a tournament. Actually they all played worse after listening to his advice. I'm playing much better after listening to the advice I find on the internet - I'm always improving.

So is it your experience that *some* players will deliberately give out wrong information/advice? Maybe to keep the other players from winning tournaments or whatever?
Click to expand...


I know people hate it when I say this but, it's just a cue! I mean we're talking about a straight stick hitting a ball, right? I'm sorry but I honestly believe that if a person can trust their ability, they can be competent with anything.

With that said, changing cues, even if it's a widely-agreed upgrade, can take time. The basic formula is you need to give yourself 24 hours of playtime to adjust to a new cue. Put simply, you need to learn to trust your new equipment. Performing full-table draws and inside english requires absolute trust, otherwise the execution simply isn't there.

I'm not saying that your friend shouldn't go back to her old cue. Perhaps she should. However, I wouldn't necessarily discredit the advice she was given outright. There is a chance that with a little patience, her game will return and she just might be a little better because of it.
 
The fact that this lady was improving with her 11 mm needs to be discounted here. Anyone who works hard at it will improve, regardless of what equipment they use.

Still, there is a reason that most cuemakers and professionals recommend a tip size in the 12 1/2 to 13 1/2 range. A tip that's too big makes it a little harder to generate english, and one that's too small overexposes you to the risks associated with unintended english. Years and years of expereince of players, instructors and cuemakers seems to validate the claim that the 12 1/2 to 13 1/2 range is where most players ought to be.

What would you have told Allison Fisher, Karen Corr, or Kelly Fisher if they had asked you what tip size to use when they had just begun to play pool? Would you have told them to try a small tip of about 10 mm, since it was what they were used to? Or would you have advised them what the conventional wisdom is in the community of serious pool players, instructors and cuemakers. After all, the right tip size is more a function of the size of the cueball than anything else. The Brits laughed and laughed and laughed some more when The Miz competed in a pro snooker event using a cue having a 13 mm tip.

Anyone recommending that a player using a small tip pool cue switch should, very carefully, explain the pros and cons of the switch. Then, leave the decision up to the player.
 
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I'm with SJM here. It doesn't hurt to suggest ways to improve someone's game, as I'm sure BillyBob would agree (look at all the good suggestions you've used off the internet). It's up to them whether or not they want to spend the time/money to find out if it is worthwhile for them. When I play with a 12mm cue tip, I have to pay a lot more attention to where I'm hitting the cue ball or I end up missing more often. I also have a tendency to miscue more on draw shots from hitting too low. As has already been stated, it will most likely take some time before the benefits of the larger tip will manifest themselves. If I'm playing well, it doesn't really matter what size tip I'm using, as long as I know what the differences are and concentrate enough to minimize them.
 
couple questions come to mind here............

how long has she been playing with the 13mm? if you're talking a day or even a week.........that isn't time for the average banger to adjust...........if you're playing 4 plus hours a day and you're a quick learner, you can adjust easily..........i'm guessing from what you've posted she's not that kind of player that can adjust on a moments notice.

what do you mean by "going down the tubes"? did she go from running 3 balls to running 2 or what? i doubt it completely ruined her game........if it did, its all in her head.

and lastly, ask yourself, why on earth would you want to play with a tip that small??? even steve davis after a while finally broke down and bought a real pool cue. 11 mm by 99 percent of all players/instructors/cuemakers is far too small for pool.

hell, its almost impossible that her game went to shit because of that fact..........it should have actually raised her game a little(probably will in the long run) because the room for error witht the 11mm tip is way way way less than the room for erros using a 13mm.

IMO the advice she was given was sound advice, and i think that its mainly a mental obstacle that she needs to/will get over.

thanks

VAP
 
I have found that the best advice is to give none. I use to give advice thinking that I was being friendly and just trying to be helpful. I have since found out that other players don't really want your advice and most times don't understand what you are trying to show them and will not remember anyways. Some will say that they cannot do it that way or don't like doing it like that. Cues are a completely different subject. Majority of players just want a 2 piece cue that looks fancy and don't have a clue what is a good cue. I have had players tell me and others that the best cues are those with screw on tips because you can change them easier.

I now play my game, keep my mouth shut, and will only give advice when someone asks for it.
 
Actually this lady is just a recreational player. She is just playing for fun and trying to get good enough to beat some of the locals at one bar only. I don't see her wanting to go and play elsewhere ever. (I should have made that clear.)

"Down the tubes" means she was getting to where she could beat some of the locals, but now with her new cue, she can't beat anyone.

And yes I agree, if she was a serious player, had a desire to join leagues/play in tournaments, etc. Then it would be best for her to switch cues (for the long term).

But being as she is just a recreational player having fun, what is the harm in her playing with what works best for her? She is about 50 years old BTW.

I guess I got a little upset when I saw how discouraged she looked. She was glowing like a lightbulb when she was winning a few games every here and there.

And when she beat "Billy Bob" (I wonder how that happened? :D ), she talked about it for two weeks.
 
Recreational players games go up and down like like the changing tides. However another cue wouldn't have been my first choice for helping someone with there game.

One day she may choose to put more effort in the game though, so a 13mm cue isn't a bad choice. All it is, is just getting use to a larger shaft with a slight difference in aim. I think people tend to hit balls a little fat with a larger shaft. She either adapts, (all players need to do this at some point) or play with her old cue. Pretty simple really.

Rod
 
changes ...

First, only take advice from somone that is qualified.

Second, some people start out wrong to begin with and some people
are progressing their game up the ladder.

If you learned the right way, then remember when your instructor was
trying to get you to the proper form and stroke, not worrying about whether you made the ball or not, because he was trying to lay a good foundation for you to learn pool. Building blocks of information ...

OR when an iintermediate player is finally talked out of that soft tip to a hard tip, which most better players play with, because it offers better control of the cue ball, but takes sometime to adapt to it, and when they make that long difficult shot with a hard tip without the cueball being thrown off from the way they aimed it, and a lightbulb finally lights up.

People want to good at Pool for different reasons, but if they are the right reasons, they will take the time to learn the right way, and use their brain
along the way.
 
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