That's a lotta warm-up strokes!

[PKM]

I was watching Helena Thornfeldt vs. Jasmin Ouschan on ESPN. Helena likes to take a lot of warm-up strokes on her shots in general. She had a difficult cut on the 9-ball, and took 18 warm-up strokes! Just thought that was interesting (she made the shot). I wonder if that's some kind of record.

 

[mbvl]

There's a tape (somewhere) of Sang Lee in a three-cushion match taking 34 warm-up strokes. He then makes a very difficult shot.

Mark

 

[Slider]

If there's going to be some sort of title for this, I'm sure Danny Basavich has to be a contender...

 

[Neil]

I was watching Helena Thornfeldt vs. Jasmin Ouschan on ESPN. Helena likes to take a lot of warm-up strokes on her shots in general. She had a difficult cut on the 9-ball, and took 18 warm-up strokes! Just thought that was interesting (she made the shot). I wonder if that's some kind of record.

Wait till you get stuck playing someone that takes that many every shot and then stops to stand up and re-survey the table before getting back down to do it again.

 

[SharpPT]

If there's going to be some sort of title for this, I'm sure Danny Basavich has to be a contender...

Saw him play in a tourny several years ago. He beat Buddy Hall in the finals.

Me and my buddys were counting his warm up strokes and he would consistantly take 20-25 strokes on 80-90 % of his shots...even easy shots. If I did that, my game would be so screwed up, I probably wouldn't make a ball.

 

[Hidy Ho]

Saw him play in a tourny several years ago. He beat Buddy Hall in the finals.

Me and my buddys were counting his warm up strokes and he would consistantly take 20-25 strokes on 80-90 % of his shots...even easy shots. If I did that, my game would be so screwed up, I probably wouldn't make a ball.

There is a local guy, fairly low speed, who also does this.

It works since it's fairly distracting and drive everyone crazy.

 

[Boro Nut]

Just thought that was interesting (she made the shot). I wonder if that's some kind of record.

No it wasn't, you sexist pig. She potted one just like it only last week.

Not sure if that wasn't a record at the time though.

Boro Nut

 

[Slider]

Me and my buddys were counting his warm up strokes and he would consistantly take 20-25 strokes on 80-90 % of his shots...even easy shots. If I did that, my game would be so screwed up, I probably wouldn't make a ball.

The funniest part is that half of them are in the air, before he even gets down on the shot.

 

[FLICKit]

I was watching Helena Thornfeldt vs. Jasmin Ouschan on ESPN. Helena likes to take a lot of warm-up strokes on her shots in general.

Helena and many other of the WPBA players seem to have a number of extra misses from loss of concentration, possibly due to a slight bit of rushing. Many of Helena's past mistakes have been as a result of this flaw. Evidently she's doing this approach in an effort to overcome or correct that flaw.

I think she's taking it a bit to the extreme, and it is currently causing her more harm than good. She will have to find a happy medium between what she did there, and what she used to do. But, evidently she is in the process of making the correction and she will have to learn what works best for her.

 

[thrasher789]

Hahaha, I knew it was about helena before I even opened the thread, I too saw that match and was tempted to switch channels for a minute everytime she went down to shoot becuase I knew she'd be there forever.

 

[Fatboy]

I was watching Helena Thornfeldt vs. Jasmin Ouschan on ESPN. Helena likes to take a lot of warm-up strokes on her shots in general. She had a difficult cut on the 9-ball, and took 18 warm-up strokes! Just thought that was interesting (she made the shot). I wonder if that's some kind of record.

perhaps her mind was elsewhere

 

[suckershot]

Wait till you get stuck playing someone that takes that many every shot and then stops to stand up and re-survey the table before getting back down to do it again.

Exactly.

The funniest part is that half of them are in the air, before he even gets down on the shot.

And exactly.

Let me run through one of my "favorite players". How about:

1. Scratching their head
2. Getting head down at table level to look at shot
3. Walking around the table and then #2 again
4. #1 again
5. Pointing to a spot on the table with cue
6. Grinding the chalk out for about 30 seconds
7. Slider's quote again
8. #6 again
9. Neil's quote

And on, and on, and on. Keep in mind, the guy would do this on hangers...I could understand some deliberation on tough shots, but come on. Pool definitely needs a shot clock.

 

[iamgoingto]

There is a local guy, fairly low speed, who also does this.

It works since it's fairly distracting and drive everyone crazy.

i dont know if we are talking about the same guy. but im from santa rosa and in a league my brother was in he told me about this guy who took forver on his shots, with many warm up strokes. my bro told me he lost, and partly because when he finally got to the table he just wanted to shoot so badly and shot too quickly. basically the guy annoyed the crap out my bro and tweaked his game.

 

[SPINDOKTOR]

Someone, SOMEWHERE has messed with that chicks head! Im sure playing on TV is the real problem, but good golly, that gal is painful to watch. I also watched her Miss an easy 9 about a year ago. you could look at her expression and know she was going to miss. The whole Jumping off the cliff first time, bunjee jumping thing. She has to be able to play, you see to much of her, she just keeps hanging in thier like hair in a biscuit, So Im going to make a suggestion, someone pass this along to her.


INSTEAD of stroking to seemingly find your line. STOP. Hold your cue in position on line with your target be absolutely still. When your certain your on line perfect stroke once, and stop. Look at the shot again, now stroke 5 times to make sure your cue is swinging straight and release. I gurantee you will play better.

When I watch her play she lines up perfect, or at least it looks like it. then with every stroke confidence is falling, if she lined up right and was confident she wouldnt stroke that many times. OR she has found a way to cool off the hot shots by keeping them in thier seat longer. A good strategey but this is all about lack of confidence, I would be interested in her opinion of what I suggested.

I also have a excercise for players whom have this problem. it was given to me by a very wise man, My game went up and is still comming up.


http://CueTable.com/P/?@1AayU1BWHT1...ot_making,_control,_its_all_right_here.__&ZZ@



SPINDOKTOR

 

[Snapshot9]

Equivalent

Helena's 18 strokes (and more on other shots) is like someone, from a standing position, with a rifle holding the aim on a bull's eye for 18 seconds before squeezing the trigger. People that do things like this have no natural feel for the game, and they are logically trying to control it.

People like this, also, are usually easy to take off their game, and rattle them. Helena looked like she was scared of Jasmin to begin with, probably because Jasmin had beaten her everytime they played before.

I used to root for Helena, but I won't anymore, her preshot routine is just too unbearable now. I used to think she might be a champion trying to get over the hump, but now I've relegated her to just being a contender never a champion. Helena looks like she has put on weight too. I don't know where this figures into her shooting, but it could.

A pro getting down on shiot should have it lined up in no longer than 3 seconds.

Jasmin has serious game, but she does need more experience. She's young, and I am sure she will be a top 5 player for many years to come.

 

[Gerry]

not to mention it would KILL my back if I played like that!

Gerry

 

[BillPorter]

a thought

This thread makes me think of how often I feel I have missed a shot and thought to myself that I would have probably made the shot had I taken just one or two more warmup strokes instead of rushing the shot. I wonder if my shooting percentage would go up if I were to force myself to take a few more warmup strokes per shot.

 

[Craig Fales]

This may sound crazy but I count my warmup strokes when I'm on the shot...I usually count to 6 in my head then shoot...this keeps me from rushing the shot...

 

[Williebetmore]

I was watching Helena Thornfeldt vs. Jasmin Ouschan on ESPN. Helena likes to take a lot of warm-up strokes on her shots in general. She had a difficult cut on the 9-ball, and took 18 warm-up strokes! Just thought that was interesting (she made the shot). I wonder if that's some kind of record.

PK,
No, this is nowhere near her "personal best."

Last year at Peoria, I ran the shot clock during one of her matches (I can't remember the opponent, but it was a GREAT match that Helena pulled out against a top player - I bet you a nickel that sjm can remember the opponent). She was VERY deliberate, taking huge numbers of practice strokes. I timed one of these episodes, and after she got down on the ball; she stroked rapid-fire for an additional one and a half minutes before pulling the trigger (if you are down on the shot within 20 seconds, then you have as long as you want to stroke). That was a LONG match, very painful to watch.

I will point out that up until last year I never witnessed her doing this to any significant extent - I do believe it is a new habit, and not necessarily a good one.

P.S. - on the "minute and a half" shot, she missed the ball.

P.P.S. - the same year, I witnessed Karen Corr take 5 minutes to attempt a tough, off-the rail shot (last match of the day, no shot clock, I only started timing her after several minutes of indecision - it could have been LONGER - she missed it by a diamond).

 

[thrasher789]

PK,

P.S. - on the "minute and a half" shot, she missed the ball.

Yeah, that's what I found most funny, on these shots where she's taking a million warm up's half the time she misses because the reason she's taking so many strokes is becuase she isn't confident in the shot to begin with.