THE BOTTOM LINE - Is the IPT DEAD ? Yay or Nay ?

B

Bigbro66

Registered
The focus of the forum in recent times has quite rightly been on the payment or lack of it and the checks.

But given what has happened, can we safely say that the IPT is dead ? Can there no longer be any more tournaments which the big names would play in given the total rape of the goodwill ?
 
As they show ...

in tales from the crypt, A hand is sticking out of the grave .... grasping .....grasping .... lol
 
The IPT is not done. It won't be done until they give up and say that's it no more tournaments, no more money. OR until they are legally forced to quit or are shut down for the inablity to satisfy the judgement against them.

I am listening to Trudeau's address at the NA Open. You know, for someone who is such an egomaniac and supposedly the world's biggest huckster, he is sure spending a lot of time to talk rationally to the players about the format of the tournament. Not trying to be a Trudeau apologist here, just trying to be fair.

He spends a lot of time going through the things that one would think that Mr. Andrews or his assistant would go through.

I mean Trudeau sounds really sincere and not as hyped as he does on the informercials. I have to think that listening to him here is that he is sincere about this venture but as we see, has perhaps reached a lot further than he thought he could.

It is my observation that if this whole thing is just a scam then Trudeau could have have gone about it in a wholly different way. He could have gotten people hooked on qualifiers for a lot less expense and effort.

It just seems to me that Trudeau has spent a LOT of money and a LOT of time to set the IPT up and that he doesn't want to see the investment wasted.

Granted, he owes 3 million, or technically 2.6ish. Listening to him I get the impression that he truly believes in the IPT concept as he thought of it and will do whatever he can to realize it. So no, the IPT is not dead, perhaps on some kind of intravenous drip but still breathing.
 
Roadie.....I doubt that you would have such an objectively favourable opinion of his sincerity if you were listening to the words uttered in his Reno address to the players in the hindsight light of what we now know he knew at the time he made that address.Hang on to that NA Open recording that you are listening to since along with his address to the players at Reno and several other items it's been long ago wiped from it's previous pride of place in the IPT website in a systematic purging of every spoken or written KT/IPT reference to "guarantees" and promises,including those made to the aspiring qualifier entrants as well as to card holders.

We do not have to travel very far down Cynical Street to recognise that swift purging of website information as the action of someone who feels he has said or written things which may damage his defence in any forthcoming legal case and the action of someone who is hoping those who did not follow IPT developments closely might forget some of those details.
 
Agreed. The recordings are safe with me and there for anyone who wants them.

I don't have a favorable opinion at all about Trudeau's actions post Reno. I was merely commenting on the apparent sincerity and ambition Trudeau exhibited. For the record, he mentions in that address, the possibilities of deals with "billion dollar enterprises" and taking the IPT public. He also mentions the plans for the website along the lines of Major League Baseball's website which he says is subscription based with 500,000 paying subscribers.

To me, this sounds like a pretty solid set of goals. Of course there wasn't much in the way of detail on how he's going to get there but there wasn't anything I'd call unreasonable outside of the $100,000 guarantee that was reiterated emphatically.

Trudeau also tied himself to the IPT repeatedly. So I doubt that he will be able to separate himslef from it should it come to court.

I have no doubt that the purging is in response to the threat of lawsuits. It is probably also not good business to leave your business on the street so to speak. I wouldn't expect to go to MLB's website and get a recording of the commisioner's address to the players concerning their earnings and MLB's business plan.

It just seems to me that this is something that Trudeau really wants to work. I am sorry but I don't think it's just a scheme to fleece the players or to fleece thousands of qualifiers. I truly believe that Trudeau wants to own the sport of pool and this is the way he sees as being the best way to go about it. Unfortunately for him pool is a rocky lot that needs a lot of work to build it into a valuable property. Pool didn't spend 100 years getting this diverse and this much of a fringe activity to think that some ambitious egomaniac culd throw a few million at it and "own" it.
 
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Roadie said:
The IPT is not done. It won't be done until they give up and say that's it no more tournaments, no more money. OR until they are legally forced to quit or are shut down for the inablity to satisfy the judgement against them.

I am listening to Trudeau's address at the NA Open. You know, for someone who is such an egomaniac and supposedly the world's biggest huckster, he is sure spending a lot of time to talk rationally to the players about the format of the tournament. Not trying to be a Trudeau apologist here, just trying to be fair.

He spends a lot of time going through the things that one would think that Mr. Andrews or his assistant would go through.

I mean Trudeau sounds really sincere and not as hyped as he does on the informercials. I have to think that listening to him here is that he is sincere about this venture but as we see, has perhaps reached a lot further than he thought he could.

It is my observation that if this whole thing is just a scam then Trudeau could have have gone about it in a wholly different way. He could have gotten people hooked on qualifiers for a lot less expense and effort.

It just seems to me that Trudeau has spent a LOT of money and a LOT of time to set the IPT up and that he doesn't want to see the investment wasted.

Granted, he owes 3 million, or technically 2.6ish. Listening to him I get the impression that he truly believes in the IPT concept as he thought of it and will do whatever he can to realize it. So no, the IPT is not dead, perhaps on some kind of intravenous drip but still breathing.
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Roadie, I believe you are correct. The IPT is certainly ALIVE, and if people were TRULY concerned about the players they would try and come up with real solutions instead of trying to break it down even more with damaging statements and deeds.

And of course no one agrees with the way that the Reno event was handled as far as payouts are concerned, but everyone even NON-IPT members have to admit that this tour is the best tour that has ever happened to pool.

Can anyone say that they have competed in a tournament and didn’t even get to the second round and made $2000- $5000?? I don’t think that they can.

As far as Uniting, a UNION in my opinion would be to come together as members to save your futures in the IPT not to let others (NO offence to anyone) lead you to attorneys that are just going to take your money and have you in litigations for years. The time and energy spent on something like that could be better spent on trying to get your futures in the IPT working again.
 
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yes, yes I know Trudeau is an accomplished liar and well practiced in the art of "appearing" sincere. Well so are most of our politicians and preachers. Although I espoused my "feeling" of how Trudeau sounded to me I should perhaps clarify that I think the content of his speech made sense. That with the proper funding and contacts there seems to be no reason why the things Trudeau lays out as goals should not come to pass.

Of course, funding appears to be an issue and management isn't far behind. So, while the IPT venture may not have been an intentional scam, it may have been unfortunately the wrong investment to pick to "go straight" on. As the parlance goes.
 
KT in the drivers seat

How about temporarily on life support with KT at the controls?

With all respect due those who are hard at work fighting, at their own expense, to try and bring some justice and unity to the players. Unfortunalely, my honest feelings are that it has been mostly done in vain.

The history of pool and the nature of it's professional players make attempts at their unity of will and purpose almost impossible.

I believe that KT is a disease in the body of pool and has to be surgically removed in order for pool to have any chance for respectability. I also believe that he has singlehandily set back any possibility of that happening for a least another decade.

KT was on the ropes, he could have been terminated and pool freed from his parasitic influence had the players the strength and will to make the very difficult choices necessary to accomplish this end. That would have meant having the strenght to file suit against him. He would have been forced into either paying them in full, or having to file for bankruptsy and defending himself criminally and civilly. I believe that had the players taken a hardball stand either 1) they would have forced a much better financial deal for themselves, or, 2) they would have beaten him in court and, ultimately had won even more in court.

The catch was that they would have had to refuse any payments that KT offered and totally refused to play on any future tournaments that he claimed were to be held. Severing ties with KT is the key.

Instead, the players have showed KT that they are willing, not only to accept 11% payments and promises, but also a willingness to support and participate on any future tour this snake decides to hold. Basically they immediately dropped their pants for 11%. And don't think KT doesn't thank them for it.

Look, I understand that I, am not in the player's shoes and that makes it very easy for me to take this verbal position, but that still does not invalidate it either.

So, is the IPT dead? It is whatever KT decides it is. KT has all the options, he will gauge the income from qualifiers, possible sales, will restructure player and vendor debt, and decide whether or not to hold future tournaments. They players will be there if he calls, and he knows it.

In my opinion, this is the unfortunate reality.

Jim
 
I hate to say it, but I think we will all find out that Trudeau pulled a fast one on us. I hope it won't die, but I believe it's over.
 
Bigbro66 said:
The focus of the forum in recent times has quite rightly been on the payment or lack of it and the checks.

But given what has happened, can we safely say that the IPT is dead ? Can there no longer be any more tournaments which the big names would play in given the total rape of the goodwill ?
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I would say it is done except for one thing....We have yet to hear from the PLAYERS. While a host of people on this forum speak their mind, for and against the IPT. I have not heard any thoughts from the people that really matter...The Players. Cause, while it is entertaining to read everyones remarks, if the IPT came to our city tomorrow, we would all be there. PRAYING for a final 6 consisting of Efren, Earl, Busta, Archer, Alex and Ralf.
 
There is a saying that says a person is not dead as long as people are talking about them. So as long as we are discussing the IPT - it's not dead.
 
Roadie said:
There is a saying that says a person is not dead as long as people are talking about them. So as long as we are discussing the IPT - it's not dead.
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So Elvis is still alive??? Memphis here I come!!!!!!!! :cool:
 
Give it up Roadie....even if KT were to have a tournament now one in there right mind would show up...these people still entering qualifiers need to get educated...
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Gesture

If K-Doh wanted to do something to show his sincerity he might step in and help pump up the Derby City Classic. Greg I'm sure stepped out on a limb for th ITP. The DCC has the potential to be a world class tourney. So K-Doh, do something to help the sport and through all your support to the DCC.
 
"Right Mind" is subjective as we know. Some might say, perhaps some with far more resources than Trudeau, that no one in their "right mind" would throw away millions of dollars gambling on a pool tour. The question was asked if the IPT is "dead". The answer is that it is not yet dead either figuratively or literally.

If Trudeau held a tournament today then a lot of players would show up. Fans would be attending, people would pay money to sign up and watch it on the internet. Why? Because the game is what the attraction is for those folks, not the personality of the promoter. Do people and participants not show up at boxing matches because Don King is involved? No one ever really questions how the prize money in a boxing match is truly structured, what the payout terms are, who gets what cut and so on..... at least it isn't front page news if they do.

Arenas are filled, pay-per-view subscriptions are sold based on one thing, the people want to be entertained. If the IPT can provide that then they will come out of the self-induced coma they are in. If not then they will surely die in the most literal sense.
 
steveharn said:
If K-Doh wanted to do something to show his sincerity he might step in and help pump up the Derby City Classic. Greg I'm sure stepped out on a limb for th ITP. The DCC has the potential to be a world class tourney. So K-Doh, do something to help the sport and through all your support to the DCC.
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I agree. I would like to see him make restitution to the players, come out with a SOLID plan that does guarantee at least a year's worth of tournaments, AND donate a couple hundred thousand to pump up the DCC. Tournaments like the DCC is where Trudeau would likely find qualifier prospects as well. Last year the DCC was gracious enough to hold a tour card qualifier amidst their other events, something that sucked nearly 100,000 in revenue out of the room due to the cost of entry. That's 100,000 that had NO CHANCE to make it's way into the pockets of the vendors, the DCC promoters, the wait staff at the restaurant, the hotel, other players, 3 card monte hustlers, hookers, pimp, drug dealers, and so on.... So, again, I agree. It would be a great start to the new year to see Trudeau reinvent himself yet again in a more REAL way.

Or at least pay the players and let someone else run the IPT.
 
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