The future of the art

Canadian cue

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
What does the future look like for the aspiring cuemaker? This is something I have been pondering as of late and was curious as to what everybodys opinion was on the subject. I ask this question because it seems to me that there is more and more cuemakers everyday. So is the market big enough to keep all these cuemakers alive, is it growing proportionately? For the part timer this may not be as big an issue but for the ones who do this for a living I think this is a very real question. In the early days of this craft there were only a few makers and these makers had to learn their craft the hard way building and modifying equipment to do what they wanted, learning from thier mistakes and granted this does still exist today but to a much lesser extent. There was no internet for free info or speacialized equipment. One other consideration would be that veterans of this art are still making cues ,it's not like the new cuemakers are replacing the old. So considering all that is there a future in this trade? Now to the true cuemaker they do it because they enjoy the challenge and just love building cues so all this is probably not all that relevant but if you rely on this for your bread and butter.....
 
If you rely on this for your bread and butter... then we're doomed! :D

I share the same sentiments CC. With the advent of CNC cue machines like the one from Unique you see CM's who have been just around for less than five years putting out fancy inlaid cues. I guess technology has made it easier to make a cue that looks like a cue, shaped like a cue and appears to be a cue. But I guess newbie CM's like me are a mismatch to a newbie too that has those CNC stuff. But I believe craftsmanship will be a factor... the biggest one I believe and it would set us apart from one CM to the next. And some other knowledge that's needed into making a good cue.

But it makes it easier on that dam CNC thing!... :(

The available knowledge online etc. has been a lot of help and maybe that's why it opened a lot of opportunites for others too. It could be good, could be bad for the future which I cant tell. Who knows?

The thing I'm living with right now is just tryin to do and make the best of what I know and have... same as what all the other things I do, believe in it and work hard for it.
 
To give the simple truth as I see it, the market is too small to support all the cuemakers as full time cuemakers. The market is large enough to support about 10% to 30% as full time and the rest as part time. So breaking into it full time is a going to be an up hill climb. If you are doing it because you enjoy it and just need a part time income you shouldn't be disappointed. There are now at least several hundred part time cuemakers in the USA alone.
 
cueman said:
To give the simple truth as I see it, the market is too small to support all the cuemakers as full time cuemakers. The market is large enough to support about 10% to 30% as full time and the rest as part time. So breaking into it full time is a going to be an up hill climb. If you are doing it because you enjoy it and just need a part time income you shouldn't be disappointed. There are now at least several hundred part time cuemakers in the USA alone.

I think you are on the money. As a dealer I can tell you I am still shocked at how much wood is available on the market. Heck, you can look at ebay and see at least a dozen 2000 dollar cues at any given time. Cuemakers pop up everyday...

Joe
 
hadjcues said:
If you rely on this for your bread and butter... then we're doomed! :D
I share the same sentiments CC. With the advent of CNC cue machines like the one from Unique you see CM's who have been just around for less than five years putting out fancy inlaid cues.
<snip>
But it makes it easier on that dam CNC thing!... :(
The thing I'm living with right now is just tryin to do and make the best of what I know and have... same as what all the other things I do, believe in it and work hard for it.

CNC can greatly expand your potential, and make production easier, but it is JUST ANOTHER TOOL. If you are truly talented, you will make a name for yourself and a living too, CNC or no CNC, if that is what you are after. There are those that think CNC is easy, don't be fooled. Take a look at what this guy went through.... (not everyone will struggle like this, but it illustrates my point)
http://arnotq.com/pages/630/630.html

If you can't bring top notch work and innovation, you sure as hell better have a day job!! :D
 
classiccues said:
I think you are on the money. As a dealer I can tell you I am still shocked at how much wood is available on the market. Heck, you can look at ebay and see at least a dozen 2000 dollar cues at any given time. Cuemakers pop up everyday...

Joe
I agree with that observation. Many, if not all, started out because they saw a "need"(cue repair) to address and then evolved into building cues. All worked on achieving a system that will yield them a technically superior product and most just stayed there. The few that have artistic talent moved on to "blend aesthetics with technology(structural configuration)" and this IMO is CueArt.

My observation of "technically focused cuemakers":
Most just do cuemaking on a part-time basis and cover their locality. Some have broken into public awareness at a national and international level and it is not an easy thing to do as to reach this point dedication factors in heavily. But even then this is the most cut-throat sector as it is where "new slices in the pie" are taken.

For those who took the aesthetic path, it too is a torturous road to take. I'm aware of a few who've ventured this road when they still have inadequate technical knowledge and this is what eventually delegates their master pieces into the "wall-hanger" category. And some, who become well known in blending art and technology, get to immersed in the art part that they eventually too end up in the wall-hanger category. This sector too "requires" fresh ideas.

Cue Art is a blend of technology and artistry but it is technology first as a pool cue is a functional tool. The cue artist just have to derive satisfaction, in his creation, that is much greater than the financial gain for it to be recognized as such. CUE ART

The future of the ART? It's great, just don't forget the technology part.
 
bandido said:
Cue Art is a blend of technology and artistry but it is technology first as a pool cue is a functional tool. The cue artist just have to derive satisfaction, in his creation, that is much greater than the financial gain for it to be recognized as such. CUE ART

The future of the ART? It's great, just don't forget the technology part.

Bandido, I've never hit a ball with one of your cues so I can't comment on the hit. I can comment on the looks though. From the pictures I've seen, Your cues are eat up with art. Some of the most beautiful cues I've ever seen.
 
Sheldon said:
CNC can greatly expand your potential, and make production easier, but it is JUST ANOTHER TOOL. If you are truly talented, you will make a name for yourself and a living too, CNC or no CNC, if that is what you are after. There are those that think CNC is easy, don't be fooled. Take a look at what this guy went through.... (not everyone will struggle like this, but it illustrates my point)
http://arnotq.com/pages/630/630.html

If you can't bring top notch work and innovation, you sure as hell better have a day job!! :D

I agree. Read that thing on Arnot's site a couple of years ago I think. I had a blast reading it =) He's cutting feed is probably to fast for the cutting speed =) and too deep!
 
Arnotq.com cnc

Sheldon said:
CNC can greatly expand your potential, and make production easier, but it is JUST ANOTHER TOOL. There are those that think CNC is easy, don't be fooled. Take a look at what this guy went through.... (not everyone will struggle like this, but it illustrates my point)
http://arnotq.com/pages/630/630.html

I went to the site to check out Arnotq's experience with cnc. It was entertaining - I laughed til I wanted to cry. I wanted to cry because that very lengthy and costly scenerio is the same scenerio I experienced with "put it in the cnc and go away for a cup of coffee". Doesn't work that way. And I have a feeling that a lot of other cuemakers have had the same nightmare with the "easier way to do things". And those little end mills are "so easy" ---so easy to break and are "so costly". CNC is a costly tool but it is JUST ANOTHER TOOL to make a quality built cue look different than every other stick.
Jack Madden
www.johnmaddencues.com
 
Jack Madden said:
CNC is a costly tool but it is JUST ANOTHER TOOL to make a quality built cue look different than every other stick.

Yep, the jokers who would try to make you believe that CNC is some kind of magic technology that builds a cue for you are the people that either can't afford it, or can't understand or learn it.
 
There are some cuemakers who create arty cues with CNC.
Joe Gold and Eddie Prewitt are two makers I admire a ton for their cues even though they use CNC.
Sadly, a ton of cnc'd cues look like they wanna be Joe Gold.
Eddie Prewitt's cues have their unique look. And, they play nice.
That's why they sell at this price. Even without points.
http://www.indyq.com/custom/prewitt/Ebony 5-Rings.html
Most cnc'd cues I see on Ebay are dirt cheap. I don't even know how the maker can afford to sell them at those ridiculous prices.
 
Cnc Or Manual

Sheldon said:
Yep, the jokers who would try to make you believe that CNC is some kind of magic technology that builds a cue for you are the people that either can't afford it, or can't understand or learn it.

Myself I have nothing against CNC it can be a great help and some things are just not possible without it. From experience I know that it requires just as much skill as manual. CNC is an expensive proposition though and unless one is making a great number of cues a year it is hardly justifiable. If you build a small number of cues a year manual equipment does not limit how nice of a cue you can build, it just limits how fast you can build it.
 
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Murray Tucker said:
My CNC mill will give the 5 and out to everyone.

http://www.murraytucker.com/mazak.htm

BTW that mill is about 250 large after tooling.
I'm sure it will Murray. CNC capability is great and I am looking at different machines, at present, that will address what I plan to use it for.

It's a great tool but it also equalized the field in the "technically focused" cuemaking. Newcomers who have the aptitude to do the basic operations plus have basic knowledge in cuemaking can easily break into the "solid hitting" cue market. The few artistic and dedicated once move on to cue art.

The ones to look up to with regards to CNC assisted cue art? Thomas Wayne, Joe Gold and Black Boar. IMO
 
I guess I am really in the minority on this topic. I am really not interested in cnc cues regardless of their intricasies of design. I find some of them very pretty but can't get it out of my mind that it is computer generated. I prefer beautiful woods combined for a solid hit and and clean craftsmanship. I realize that many tools, lathes ect are used in the making of cues and have no problems with that. The more hands on work and the creativeness of the cuemaker are much more appealling to me. They have generally paid their dues and use their minds as their computers. JMHO
 
I have always been of the same mindset as you until sometime in the not so distant past. The market for the most part has quit caring if inlays are done by CNC or pantograph. And the CNC has driven prices down to the point the customer expects fancier for less money. So I did what I at one time never expected to do and bought a small cnc machine to do inlays with. I have just cut my first pockets into a cue with it. Will see how it goes. I will still do some of it with my older inlay machine, but I think all larger inlays will be CNC unless someone wants them done the other way and is willing to pay the price. I have spent 90 hands on hours on one cue before. Time is indeed money. So it is a decision I am not as crazy about as a cue maker, but feel it is neccessary as a business decision.
Chris
www.internationalcuemakers.com
www.cuesmith.com
 
Gerald said:
I prefer beautiful woods combined for a solid hit and and clean craftsmanship. I realize that many tools, lathes ect are used in the making of cues and have no problems with that. The more hands on work and the creativeness of the cuemaker are much more appealling to me.

CNC does not change the beauty of the wood, nor the craftsmanship. To the contrary, it can be used to ENHANCE the beauty AND the craftsmanship, as well as greatly expand the ABILITY to be creative.

While I will agree it can also be ugly and un-appealing if the craftsmanship is lacking..... the same can be said for ALL cues, cnc or not.
 
I understand what everyone is saying and I especially understand the economics of such decisions. It just doesn't have, for me, the same amount of "heart". What can I say? Maybe if all of the real fancy cues really turned me on I would feel different, but too many of them are, to me, once again, way overdone. But that said, if I could lay my hands on Jack Cooney's cue made for him by Joey Gold I would never let it out of my sight. Simplicity though is my main pleasure.
 
Gerald said:
I understand what everyone is saying and I especially understand the economics of such decisions. It just doesn't have, for me, the same amount of "heart". What can I say? Maybe if all of the real fancy cues really turned me on I would feel different, but too many of them are, to me, once again, way overdone. But that said, if I could lay my hands on Jack Cooney's cue made for him by Joey Gold I would never let it out of my sight. Simplicity though is my main pleasure.
Ger, funny you should mention Joe Gold.
It seems to be, a ton of CNC'rs are trying to copy his cues. :D
I like the good ole v-points and sharp inlays myself.
 
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