This forum needs a Bar Section...

[Pushout]

I would be one of the people I described. I don't have the motivation to go pro and become a national champ, and I don't really have that much desire to analyze historically important players and matches. However, saying that I don't want to improve in my own way would be a great lie. I'm pretty sure I'm not just a statistical error, and there should be many people like me who'd enjoy participating in bar pool conversations and debates.

You would be one of few, I'm afraid. Most of us don't have the motivation to go pro either. Where do you get that?? You don't have much desire to learn from professional players and matches how do you expect to learn?? That's only one of the many, many ways people here learn. From other bar players, I guess? And how much do you think you'll learn from them versus what you could learn from reading and participating in discussions here and from books and videos which would give much more and better information? You seem to have the idea that bar pool is different than what, any other pool?? Here's a clue, it ain't! To learn you want to enhance your learning experience and you wouldn't be doing that with a bar pool forum.

 

[Ghosst]

You're thinking only about the drunk bangers but you ignore the rest of us casual/bar players. I already said we like to take our game seriously, just the rules, the approach and the skills are different. I can teach you some bar strategies if you want

I don't ignore anyone. Once you play some more serious games and want to play better opponents I think you'll learn to notice more of the goings on in your local bar or pool-hall. Honestly, it's just a general good practice to keep your eyes open.

No one who wants anything good for pool ignores people who don't play, "seriously". There's nothing wrong with enjoying pool for the social aspect whatsoever, so don't feel defensive about having a good time playing pool. All the power to you. But coming to a pool-oriented website where almost everyone is a regular tournament winner and wanting to add a sub-forum for, "casual", players is going to raise some eyebrows. It's almost like going into a Christian forum and wanting to setup a, "Dabbling in Satanism" sub-forum as far as the members feel.

I actually like the idea because it brings in more members. But would they come? I doubt it. A standard poster starts out with, "I can win against ANYONE!!!!!", in the main forum, gets knocked down a dozen pegs, and then figures out where they are in the pecking order after a few months. It's internet life. But casual players aren't interested in staying the same if they find their way here for the most part. They come here to get better and we have some world-class players and instructors ready to help. It's what AZ is. They lose the, "bar rules", pretty quickly.

Even if the whole PK identity was a failure, shrug it off, keep this new name and figure out what you want to discuss. Try to stay away from the same ideas over and over and over or we'll lock you in the basement with Pangit, hose you down with Kamui chalk and beat you about the head with LD shafts while the, "local girls" chant, "8-Ball is the best game ever!"

Ask questions, show off your toys, learn from these guys. Seriously, some of them may not seem too friendly at first but you'll learn more about pool here in a week than in all the years before this.

To wrap up another long-winded post, this one #999:

If you really want a game, shoot me a PM whenever you're in Calgary. I'm happy to play just about anyone, as long as they're not an arse. I don't care if you know which end of the cue is which, and hey, if you think you can teach me, please do. I'm sure someone on here will be happy to stream it live on the internet. I'm not camera shy.


.

 

[CreeDo]

It's been said the current US Open champion's favorite game is bar box 8-ball.

That being said, there's a difference between having specific tastes and having limited tastes. If a guy goes to a fancy french restaurant and orders rabbit, he's a connoisseur. If he's eating rabbit in the middle of a forest because he can't trap anything else, he's just desperate.

You should give 9 footers a fair shake, and reach a decent level (let's say where you can run a rack every so often) before deciding you just love bar pool better.

Personally I kind of suspect you want a separate forum because you're getting a certain elitist vibe from other players, and you're hoping to talk about amateur pool without anyone jumping on you and acting like they're the high and mighty pros who look down on guys who play on "Toy tables". Is that about right?

If so, you might be disappointed to find that even with your own forum, you will still get people arguing with you and shooting down your ideas and acting superior. It's just the nature of the internet.

 

[Pushout]

Please note the first of Ghosst's tag lines

 

[Push&Pool]

Of course you don't see the contradiction between saying bar players don't want to learn detailed things, then say that they may be interested in learning detailed things.

I'm not really a bar lover? You're right, I'm just a pool lover that has played 99% in bars. I'm beginning to wonder if you even know what the hell you're talking about. Go troll the chess forum again..

Nobody said they don't wanna learn detailed things. They just won't spend hundreds of hours practising perfect shots. That doesn't mean they won't concentrate on some very complicated strategies and tricks in order to win. If you've played 99% of matches in bars you'd know that. Chess forum?

You would be one of few, I'm afraid. Most of us don't have the motivation to go pro either. Where do you get that?? You don't have much desire to learn from professional players and matches how do you expect to learn?? That's only one of the many, many ways people here learn. From other bar players, I guess? And how much do you think you'll learn from them versus what you could learn from reading and participating in discussions here and from books and videos which would give much more and better information? You seem to have the idea that bar pool is different than what, any other pool?? Here's a clue, it ain't! To learn you want to enhance your learning experience and you wouldn't be doing that with a bar pool forum.

I expect to learn from many different sources. But my best teacher has always been me. I've learned, practised and adapted my own way of play, and after several years of doing so, I can keep up with some very good players. I'm not really worried about my learning skills.

Actually, bar pool IS different. The pool you're talking about is only the tip of the iceberg of the entire pool world. I'm in a hurry now so I'll explain later. And bar section WOULD improve a player's chances of lerning. A lot.

I don't ignore anyone. Once you play some more serious games and want to play better opponents I think you'll learn to notice more of the goings on in your local bar or pool-hall. Honestly, it's just a general good practice to keep your eyes open.

No one who wants anything good for pool ignores people who don't play, "seriously". There's nothing wrong with enjoying pool for the social aspect whatsoever, so don't feel defensive about having a good time playing pool. All the power to you. But coming to a pool-oriented website where almost everyone is a regular tournament winner and wanting to add a sub-forum for, "casual", players is going to raise some eyebrows. It's almost like going into a Christian forum and wanting to setup a, "Dabbling in Satanism" sub-forum as far as the members feel.

I actually like the idea because it brings in more members. But would they come? I doubt it. A standard poster starts out with, "I can win against ANYONE!!!!!", in the main forum, gets knocked down a dozen pegs, and then figures out where they are in the pecking order after a few months. It's internet life. But casual players aren't interested in staying the same if they find their way here for the most part. They come here to get better and we have some world-class players and instructors ready to help. It's what AZ is. They lose the, "bar rules", pretty quickly.

Even if the whole PK identity was a failure, shrug it off, keep this new name and figure out what you want to discuss. Try to stay away from the same ideas over and over and over or we'll lock you in the basement with Pangit, hose you down with Kamui chalk and beat you about the head with LD shafts while the, "local girls" chant, "8-Ball is the best game ever!"

Ask questions, show off your toys, learn from these guys. Seriously, some of them may not seem too friendly at first but you'll learn more about pool here in a week than in all the years before this.

To wrap up another long-winded post, this one #999:

If you really want a game, shoot me a PM whenever you're in Calgary. I'm happy to play just about anyone, as long as they're not an arse. I don't care if you know which end of the cue is which, and hey, if you think you can teach me, please do. I'm sure someone on here will be happy to stream it live on the internet. I'm not camera shy.


.

I'm not being defensive about anything and I feel proud about being a bar player. I'm also not offended or intimidated by anyone on this forum. I'd happily 1on1 every single person here if we played on a bar box and with bar rules I'm used to. If I ever get close to Calgary, I'll let you know and please stop with the PK comments, it's killing the thread...

It's been said the current US Open champion's favorite game is bar box 8-ball.

That being said, there's a difference between having specific tastes and having limited tastes. If a guy goes to a fancy french restaurant and orders rabbit, he's a connoisseur. If he's eating rabbit in the middle of a forest because he can't trap anything else, he's just desperate.

You should give 9 footers a fair shake, and reach a decent level (let's say where you can run a rack every so often) before deciding you just love bar pool better.

Personally I kind of suspect you want a separate forum because you're getting a certain elitist vibe from other players, and you're hoping to talk about amateur pool without anyone jumping on you and acting like they're the high and mighty pros who look down on guys who play on "Toy tables". Is that about right?

If so, you might be disappointed to find that even with your own forum, you will still get people arguing with you and shooting down your ideas and acting superior. It's just the nature of the internet.

As I said, I don't feel inferior to anyone cause I know my "toy tables" are my own pool world, just like your pool halls are yours. Maybe I'm not experienced with 9-footers, but you guys missed just as much pool action if you didn't play bar pool.

 

[Push&Pool]

Actually, bar pool IS different. The pool you're talking about is only the tip of the iceberg of the entire pool world. I'm in a hurry now so I'll explain later. And bar section WOULD improve a player's chances of lerning. A lot.

Now, when I have a little time, let me clarify why bar pool is different than WPA/BCA/APA etc. It's true the fundamentals in all of these games are more or less the same. But there are three main reasons which make bar pool quite unique.

1. The rules. There's no doubt bar rules are totally different comparing to world standardized rules. Some bar rule sets have a lot in common with the WPA/BCA, some are closer to APA, but there's still a large portion of those variants which has nothing to do with any of the "official rule sets". Sure a good player can play well despite the rule differences. But when you change a vital aspect like BiH, requirement to hit the line, last pocket and such, it's obvious that the whole approach to the game, from technique to strategy and other tricks, simply can't remain the same. Just like a bar player would suffer from BiH in a BCA tournament, the same way a league player has to either adapt or face defeat on a barbox.

2. The equipment. Smaller, old, dirty tables, unpredictable rails, low quality cues with damaged tips, no chalk, no room to shoot... Sounds familiar? Well, those are just a few of the problems every league player has to go through in a bar environment. You can't deny bar players have mastered such conditions a lot better than their league counterpart. There are numerous techniques and tricks bar player use to reduce the effects of bad equipment on their game. This actually gives them an advantage over the league players when they're playing on bar boxes. In the opposite situation, when a bar player enters a good pool hall, he'll adapt to that environment a little easier comparing to the league players in bars.

3. Skill and experience. This one surely goes to the league players. Having a lot of expertise allows them to use advanced techniques and tactics bar players simply aren't capable of. They, on the other hand, tend to use simpler techniques, but in a way which allows them to gain advantage over their opponent through cunningness, unexpected tricks or just pure luck. Maybe this difference is the greatest void between the worlds of league and bar pool. And that's exactly why matches between the representatives of those two pool scenes have always been exciting, amusing and memorable.

 

[Banks]

Nobody said they don't wanna learn detailed things. They just won't spend hundreds of hours practising perfect shots. That doesn't mean they won't concentrate on some very complicated strategies and tricks in order to win. If you've played 99% of matches in bars you'd know that. Chess forum?

So, they can "concentrate on some very complicated strategies", and have total success, but they don't want to "spend hundreds blah blah blah"? Really, man, try again.. we'll just call this thread "Logic 101".

I still think you've got to be pulling our legs if you're this overboard on something so fuggered..



If you think that even a mediocre BCA player will have their butt handed to them by an anything-goes bar rules player, you're not actually pretending to be like Cartman there..

Tell us more about the "arm swipe" technique(aka The Swimmer) that we can use to move all of the balls over to the rail to make a runout impossible.

 

[supergreenman]

Now, when I have a little time, let me clarify why bar pool is different than WPA/BCA/APA etc. It's true the fundamentals in all of these games are more or less the same. But there are three main reasons which make bar pool quite unique.

1. The rules. There's no doubt bar rules are totally different comparing to world standardized rules. Some bar rule sets have a lot in common with the WPA/BCA, some are closer to APA, but there's still a large portion of those variants which has nothing to do with any of the "official rule sets". Sure a good player can play well despite the rule differences. But when you change a vital aspect like BiH, requirement to hit the line, last pocket and such, it's obvious that the whole approach to the game, from technique to strategy and other tricks, simply can't remain the same. Just like a bar player would suffer from BiH in a BCA tournament, the same way a league player has to either adapt or face defeat on a barbox.

2. The equipment. Smaller, old, dirty tables, unpredictable rails, low quality cues with damaged tips, no chalk, no room to shoot... Sounds familiar? Well, those are just a few of the problems every league player has to go through in a bar environment. You can't deny bar players have mastered such conditions a lot better than their league counterpart. There are numerous techniques and tricks bar player use to reduce the effects of bad equipment on their game. This actually gives them an advantage over the league players when they're playing on bar boxes. In the opposite situation, when a bar player enters a good pool hall, he'll adapt to that environment a little easier comparing to the league players in bars.

3. Skill and experience. This one surely goes to the league players. Having a lot of expertise allows them to use advanced techniques and tactics bar players simply aren't capable of. They, on the other hand, tend to use simpler techniques, but in a way which allows them to gain advantage over their opponent through cunningness, unexpected tricks or just pure luck. Maybe this difference is the greatest void between the worlds of league and bar pool. And that's exactly why matches between the representatives of those two pool scenes have always been exciting, amusing and memorable.

You act like none of us has ever played bar rules pool. Give up already.

 

[Cornerman]

. In my defense, I had a redhead on the phone..

Ba$tard.

Freddie <~~~ needs a good defense.

 

[Cornerman]

Now, when I have a little time, let me clarify why bar pool is different than WPA/BCA/APA etc.

Really?

Freddie <~~~ had no idea what bar pool was

 

[Pushout]

1. The rules. Good players can adapt to any rules they have to. There are those of us who really dislike the bih rules but don't ever think we can't play by them if we have to. Bar players have absolutely no edge in this respect. In fact, they are hampered by not playing by accepted rules and that is one of the big reasons that they don't play outside of in-house bar leagues often.

2. The equipment. Again, good players can adapt. You seem to have some idea that most of us have never played the kind of pool you talk about. I was playing that kind of pool when I was, oh, 12 or 13 and by 16 I was actually playing in bars and did for years.

3. Skill and experience. Some league players have a lot of experience, I guess. I've never been much of a league player and have more knowledge and experience than most league players. I could make you a better player, in person, by a ball at least, in about 15 minutes. That's assuming {yeah, I know} that you would listen, which I'm beginning to think you wouldn't.

Most of us have experienced all the things you listed and now know that there are much better ways to go about learning. You still seem to insist that bar pool as you know it is so much different. It is not.
One reason the PK thing sticks to you like glue is you sound a lot like him and have the same kind of we-just-don't-understand attitude. A group I belong to has a saying: "Don't waste your time on people who don't want it, there are many, many more who do." You'd be better off trying something locally with those who think as you do, if you can find them.

 

[Push&Pool]

1. The rules. Good players can adapt to any rules they have to. There are those of us who really dislike the bih rules but don't ever think we can't play by them if we have to. Bar players have absolutely no edge in this respect. In fact, they are hampered by not playing by accepted rules and that is one of the big reasons that they don't play outside of in-house bar leagues often.

2. The equipment. Again, good players can adapt. You seem to have some idea that most of us have never played the kind of pool you talk about. I was playing that kind of pool when I was, oh, 12 or 13 and by 16 I was actually playing in bars and did for years.

3. Skill and experience. Some league players have a lot of experience, I guess. I've never been much of a league player and have more knowledge and experience than most league players. I could make you a better player, in person, by a ball at least, in about 15 minutes. That's assuming {yeah, I know} that you would listen, which I'm beginning to think you wouldn't.

Most of us have experienced all the things you listed and now know that there are much better ways to go about learning. You still seem to insist that bar pool as you know it is so much different. It is not.
One reason the PK thing sticks to you like glue is you sound a lot like him and have the same kind of we-just-don't-understand attitude. A group I belong to has a saying: "Don't waste your time on people who don't want it, there are many, many more who do." You'd be better off trying something locally with those who think as you do, if you can find them.

OK I don't want to start a fight here so let's slow down a little... I don't have a "we-just-don't-understand" attitude. I know most of you experienced the bar environment, at least a little, but you sometimes act like you never did. I'm sorry but it's the truth. Regarding the rest of your post, sure a good player can adapt to all those circumstances... with time. Those who played only in pool halls for years and then entered a bar and ran 10 racks are unbelievably rare. I'm saying this cause I personally saw how bar conditions influence those good players and how it can easily give advantage to the bar players if they're smart enough.

 

[Pushout]

OK I don't want to start a fight here so let's slow down a little... I don't have a "we-just-don't-understand" attitude. I know most of you experienced the bar environment, at least a little, but you sometimes act like you never did. I'm sorry but it's the truth. Regarding the rest of your post, sure a good player can adapt to all those circumstances... with time. Those who played only in pool halls for years and then entered a bar and ran 10 racks are unbelievably rare. I'm saying this cause I personally saw how bar conditions influence those good players and how it can easily give advantage to the bar players if they're smart enough.

Again, refer to Ghosst's first tag line.

 

[Ghosst]

Ba$tard.

Freddie <~~~ needs a good defense.

She has a helluva good stroke too.

 

[sfleinen]

OK I don't want to start a fight here so let's slow down a little... I don't have a "we-just-don't-understand" attitude. I know most of you experienced the bar environment, at least a little, but you sometimes act like you never did. I'm sorry but it's the truth. Regarding the rest of your post, sure a good player can adapt to all those circumstances... with time. Those who played only in pool halls for years and then entered a bar and ran 10 racks are unbelievably rare. I'm saying this cause I personally saw how bar conditions influence those good players and how it can easily give advantage to the bar players if they're smart enough.

P&P:

With this, I *have* to ask: when was the last time you were in a genuine pool hall, with genuine 9-foot tables, with genuine players that cut their teeth in a genuine pool hall? Because your posting(s) beg this question -- I have a feeling you don't have much experience in a genuine pool hall, or if you did, you didn't like the fact that your "skills" on a bar table didn't scale to a 9-footer.

Personally, I play in both. Even though I cut my teeth in pool halls on big tables, I appreciate the congested aspect of a small table playing 8-ball, and the ability to precisely control the cue ball. Here in the USA, we play "call everything" rules in this type of environment -- one has to call every little contact that the cue ball *and* the object ball make before the object ball enters the pocket. You won't find the type of bar table play you describe, where you can randomly smash into clusters of balls and if a ball pockets, you keep control of the table -- unless they are absolute beginners.

And, when I play in a bar, inevitably (and rarely it's NOT the case), I'm the best player there. I usually own the table for the night, taking on all-comers, until complaints are lodged to the barkeep for me to relinquish the table.

What you describe, where a big-table-experienced player gets his/her "head handed to him/her" RARELY occurs, unless the winner is a road player experienced in bar table play. The generally-accepted rules for bar table play here in the U.S. preclude "smash 'em and hope" play causing a really good player (that knows what he/she is doing and can control the cue ball) to lose the game.

The only time you see this in the U.S., is in the APA league, where as long as the player hits his/her category of balls first (i.e. stripes or solids), and a ball of that category pockets, that the player maintains control of the table -- with the only exception being the 8-ball itself, in which the desired pocket needs to be marked. Even then, to offset this "slop counts" mindset, ball-in-hand is implemented to balance the scales.

I honestly don't see how you can say, in the same breath, "players with very pointed bar-table skillsets" (presumably that can "hand a poolhall-experienced player his/her head on the bar table"), but yet at the same time say, "amateur and not of the same caliber as the type of player often discussed / encountered here on the AZBilliards forums." You're talking out of two different sides of your mouth.

Sorry, but I'm "not getting it." You need to clarify.

-Sean

 

[Push&Pool]

P&P:

With this, I *have* to ask: when was the last time you were in a genuine pool hall, with genuine 9-foot tables, with genuine players that cut their teeth in a genuine pool hall? Because your posting(s) beg this question -- I have a feeling you don't have much experience in a genuine pool hall, or if you did, you didn't like the fact that your "skills" on a bar table didn't scale to a 9-footer.

Personally, I play in both. Even though I cut my teeth in pool halls on big tables, I appreciate the congested aspect of a small table playing 8-ball, and the ability to precisely control the cue ball. Here in the USA, we play "call everything" rules in this type of environment -- one has to call every little contact that the cue ball *and* the object ball make before the object ball enters the pocket. You won't find the type of bar table play you describe, where you can randomly smash into clusters of balls and if a ball pockets, you keep control of the table -- unless they are absolute beginners.

And, when I play in a bar, inevitably (and rarely it's NOT the case), I'm the best player there. I usually own the table for the night, taking on all-comers, until complaints are lodged to the barkeep for me to relinquish the table.

What you describe, where a big-table-experienced player gets his/her "head handed to him/her" RARELY occurs, unless the winner is a road player experienced in bar table play. The generally-accepted rules for bar table play here in the U.S. preclude "smash 'em and hope" play causing a really good player (that knows what he/she is doing and can control the cue ball) to lose the game.

The only time you see this in the U.S., is in the APA league, where as long as the player hits his/her category of balls first (i.e. stripes or solids), and a ball of that category pockets, that the player maintains control of the table -- with the only exception being the 8-ball itself, in which the desired pocket needs to be marked. Even then, to offset this "slop counts" mindset, ball-in-hand is implemented to balance the scales.

I honestly don't see how you can say, in the same breath, "players with very pointed bar-table skillsets" (presumably that can "hand a poolhall-experienced player his/her head on the bar table"), but yet at the same time say, "amateur and not of the same caliber as the type of player often discussed / encountered here on the AZBilliards forums." You're talking out of two different sides of your mouth.

Sorry, but I'm "not getting it." You need to clarify.

-Sean

If the situation is like that in the US, then I'm beginning to understand why the way we Europeans play is so unknown and ridiculous to you. Of course most bar players aren't the same caliber as the poolhall ones, but OUR bar rules allow the player to implement completely different strategies to deal with potentially better, poolhall-experienced opponents. In our system, there are two ways of offensive, defensive is much more versatile and important, all kind of techniques can be used (both very simple and rather advanced), and there are always smart tricks an intelligent and experienced player can pull off. So, to answer your question, yes, a technically inferior bar player CAN defeat a poolhall player on a barbox if bar rules are implemented.

 

[Banks]

So, to answer your question, yes, a technically inferior bar player CAN defeat a poolhall player on a barbox if bar rules are implemented.

I can possibly beat an Olympic sprinter in a hurdle competition if you restrict the running lane to 2 feet high by 2 feet wide.

I could do all kinds of thing if I changed the rules.

The thing is, on a pool table everybody plays within the same confines. You've presented, through countless aliases, no logical reason that an 'inferior bar player' can regularly defeat a 'poolhall player' through tactics that are unique to bar rules.

 

[Pushout]

If the situation is like that in the US, then I'm beginning to understand why the way we Europeans play is so unknown and ridiculous to you. Of course most bar players aren't the same caliber as the poolhall ones, but OUR bar rules allow the player to implement completely different strategies to deal with potentially better, poolhall-experienced opponents. In our system, there are two ways of offensive, defensive is much more versatile and important, all kind of techniques can be used (both very simple and rather advanced), and there are always smart tricks an intelligent and experienced player can pull off. So, to answer your question, yes, a technically inferior bar player CAN defeat a poolhall player on a barbox if bar rules are implemented.

From your posts, you play about the same speed as my son....when he was 8. When he was 12 he could have played you, with YOUR rules, on YOUR table and blown you away. The strategy and tactics you've posted before would not deter anyone who could play a lick. You might win a few games but in the long run you'd fail. If nothing else, your own tactics would be thrown back in your face and YOU would have to deal with them yourself. You have the same attitude and posting style as PK, who, by the way, regardless of what you say you were told, didn't want to change pool to make it better, he just wanted changed to HIS way which is pretty much what you seem to want. Get some friends who feel the same as you and discuss it to your heart's content. Get someone with computer savvy and start your own forum, for bar players, and see how many you get.
I've tried, I'm not sure why:sorry:

 

[Push&Pool]

I can possibly beat an Olympic sprinter in a hurdle competition if you restrict the running lane to 2 feet high by 2 feet wide.

I could do all kinds of thing if I changed the rules.

The thing is, on a pool table everybody plays within the same confines. You've presented, through countless aliases, no logical reason that an 'inferior bar player' can regularly defeat a 'poolhall player' through tactics that are unique to bar rules.

What do you mean by countless aliases? And what kind of logical reason do you need? Please clarify.

From your posts, you play about the same speed as my son....when he was 8. When he was 12 he could have played you, with YOUR rules, on YOUR table and blown you away. The strategy and tactics you've posted before would not deter anyone who could play a lick. You might win a few games but in the long run you'd fail. If nothing else, your own tactics would be thrown back in your face and YOU would have to deal with them yourself. You have the same attitude and posting style as PK, who, by the way, regardless of what you say you were told, didn't want to change pool to make it better, he just wanted changed to HIS way which is pretty much what you seem to want. Get some friends who feel the same as you and discuss it to your heart's content. Get someone with computer savvy and start your own forum, for bar players, and see how many you get.
I've tried, I'm not sure why:sorry:

Don't be so sure. In single matches or short runs I can be defeated, even by inferior players, much easier than when playing longer runs (4 wins per victory or more). In case we're thinking about the same tactics, you should know they become more effective as time passes, not less. Let's say there's 20% chances my own tactic can turn against me. That's actually quite a lot when you think about using it just a few times in a row, in one or two matches. But if you play several matches or even more, those 80% chances of success become much more significant, and eventual sacrifices you have to make to countinue playing with that strategy won't seriously damage your play. So, my efficiency increases as time passes (unless I'm having a terrible day). Your son could get me if we played for 2 wins, but if it were 5 or 6, he'd surely have to try harder...

I can also see your other arguement isn't really based on logic. You compare my posting style to PK, but you keep talking about his ideas about changing pool. I don't wanna change anything. I like pool just the way it is. I'd only love to have a section where we bar-oriented players could have our own topics which are always frowned upon in the main section. It would do no harm to the rest of the forum, but there would always be people who'd love to talk about stuff like "how to played on damaged cloth", "which bar cue should I use", "how to play when the cue ball is bigger than the rest" etc. I'm only asking you to try it. Make the section and keep it for a few months, and if nobody posts there, delete it. That's all I'd like you to do.

 

[bender_lu]

maaan, when i saw this thread i thought you wanta subforum to discuss your favorite drinks and/or bars, post pics of em etc....

im kinda disappointed