Tight Pockets!

skins

skins

Likes to draw
Silver Member
i recently had Tony Morris tighten up my table to prepare for tournyes and he did a great job. these pockets are tighter than bullfrogs a**. my table will improve some players game greatly but will make most players cry. i love it! Tony does good work. thanks Tony

Pocket.jpg
 
skins said:
. these pockets are tighter than bullfrogs a**.
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I'd hate to be the guy that has to make that determination.


my table will improve some players game greatly but will make most players cry.
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We have very tight tables at my local social club. Everyone who plays there regularly has difficulty when switching to a bar table. They focus so much on shotmaking (which they all have to be tremendously good at) at home, but their position play suffers horribly on smaller tables.

That's just my experience. I like tight tables, but I think too tight has its own set of downfalls. Tight but fair is how I like them.

Fred
 
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Cornerman said:
That's just my experience. I like tight tables, but I think too tight has its own set of downfalls. Tight but fair is how I like them.

Fred
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Fred,

This is the type of setup I eventually want to get at home. Would you say that a Diamond Pro fits into this category? If not, what pocket size and geometry would you say is ideal for a table that's tight enough to improve your shot making and fair enough that your position play doesn't suffer, i.e. you're not slow rolling everything?
 
zeeder said:
Fred,

This is the type of setup I eventually want to get at home. Would you say that a Diamond Pro fits into this category? If not, what pocket size and geometry would you say is ideal for a table that's tight enough to improve your shot making and fair enough that your position play doesn't suffer, i.e. you're not slow rolling everything?
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I'm not Fred but...

Alot of people consider the Pro cut Diamond tables to be about right. 4.25 corners with straight cut rails (not angled out). This will give you "tight but fair".


Eric >likes em tight and fair
 
zeeder said:
Fred,

This is the type of setup I eventually want to get at home. Would you say that a Diamond Pro fits into this category? If not, what pocket size and geometry would you say is ideal for a table that's tight enough to improve your shot making and fair enough that your position play doesn't suffer, i.e. you're not slow rolling everything?
Click to expand...

The Diamond Pro with 4 1/2 or 4 7/16ths, with the <40% must drop specification is right in line with what I feel is "tight but fair."

The tables at my social club are Olhausen Super Pros (or whatever their black commercial table is) the <40% must drop doesn't apply to them, and they jaw a lot of balls that are hit pretty cleanly.

Fred
 
Cornerman said:
The Diamond Pro with 4 1/2 or 4 7/16ths, with the <40% must drop specification is right in line with what I feel is "tight but fair."

The tables at my social club are Olhausen Super Pros (or whatever their black commercial table is) the <40% must drop doesn't apply to them, and they jaw a lot of balls that are hit pretty cleanly.

Fred
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Thanks Fred and Eric. One more question though. What's the <40% must drop specification?
 
Wow, nice picture...I printed it immediatelly...:)
Would that be 4.25 inch opening? They look really tough...

Can anyone post pictures of pockets used at WPC in Taiwan and the ones in IPT? Can't seem to find them, and I'm in the hurry, need to print it out...

The reason I ask is because some of my clubmates cry about our pockets. I tell them that our pockets are only about average difficuly, but they don't believe me.
 
Balls 40% in the pocket will fall, IIRC.

Something about where the pockets edge meets the drop zone of the slate.

Not 100% so don't quote me, still early and working on that first cup of Joe.
 
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Cornerman said:
The Diamond Pro with 4 1/2 or 4 7/16ths, with the <40% must drop specification is right in line with what I feel is "tight but fair."

The tables at my social club are Olhausen Super Pros (or whatever their black commercial table is) the <40% must drop doesn't apply to them, and they jaw a lot of balls that are hit pretty cleanly.

Fred
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I don't know a heck of a lot when it comes to this subject. But wouldn't all Olhausen tables have the same angle cut(s). I do not by any means have tight pockets, but I rattle a lot of balls. More so the the gold crowns at the local PH. If I decided to tighten my pockets, I am a fraid I'd never make a shot again.

Here's a common shot that I rattle a lot. Straight in 3/4" off the rail. I even experiment and toss the CB with my hand, and I still rattle it.

WEI

START(
%AI6D2%BL7P8%CJ5O4%DL7N1%EM7P1%FK6P1%GK6N8%HM7N8%IL7O4%JK6M5
%KJ5P7%LJ5N2%MK6Q4%NJ5R0%OJ5M0%PO0D2%WD0D0%XH8D1
)END
 
Cornerman said:
That's just my experience. I like tight tables, but I think too tight has its own set of downfalls.
Fred
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I've seen players quit the game in our room once the pockets were tightened. Other players became so discouraged that their game went south. Most players are not pros and only a tiny very few take it seriously enough to practice. Given this I would limit to one or two tables.

Just my thoughts. I do prefer playing on tables with tight pockets if the game means something.
 
Sore_Aintya said:
Balls 40% in the pocket will fall, IIRC.

Something about where the pockets edge meets the drop zone of the slate.

Not 100% so don't quote me, still early and working on that first cup of Joe.
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I'm not sure either but if the pockets are done incorrectly, the ball will jaw more often on good shots.

There is a technique though for playing shots that would otherwise jaw and that is when the first pocket face is hit, the OB should have outside English so when it hits the second pocket face it has inside English taking it to the hole. How hard you hit the shot changes this. This is another reason to understand how the OB,yes, twists (whatever you want to call it) with English used. Top left and top right will cause the most side English. Using only left or right will cause top right or top left.
 
WPA pocket specs

I haven't heard of <40%. Here is what it states in the rules (note the narrower openings):

9. Pocket Openings and Measurements
Only rubber facings of minimum 1/16 [1.5875 mm] to maximum ¼ inch [6.35 mm] thick may be used at pocket jaws. The WPA-preferred maximum thickness for facings is 1/8 inch [3.175 mm]. The facings on both sides of the pockets must be of the same thickness. Facings must be of hard re-enforced rubber glued with strong bond to the cushion and the rail, and adequately fastened to the wood rail liner to prevent shifting. The rubber of the facings should be somewhat harder than that of the cushions.

The pocket openings for pool tables are measured between opposing cushion noses where the direction changes into the pocket (from pointed lip to pointed lip). This is called mouth.

Corner Pocket Mouth: between 4.5 [11.43 cm] and 4.625 inches [11.75 cm]
Side Pocket Mouth: between 5 [12.7 cm] and 5.125 inches [13.0175 cm]
*The mouth of the side pocket is traditionally ½ inch [1.27 cm] wider than
the mouth of the corner pocket.

Vertical Pocket Angle (Back Draft): 12 degrees minimum to15 degrees maximum.

Horizontal Pocket Cut Angle: The angle must be the same on both sides of a pocket entrance. The cut angles of the rubber cushion and its wood backing (rail liner) for both sides of the corner pocket entrance must be 142 degrees (+1). The cut angles of the rubber cushion and its wood backing (rail liner) for both sides of the side pocket entrance must be 104 degrees (+1).

Shelf: The shelf is measured from the center of the imaginary line that goes from one side of the mouth to the other - where the nose of the cushion changes direction - to the vertical cut of the slate pocket cut. Shelf includes bevel.

Corner Pocket Shelf: between 1 [2.54 cm] and 2 ¼ inches [5.715 cm]
Side Pocket Shelf: between 0 and .375 inches [.9525 cm]

Jim Eales
 
skins said:
i recently had Tony Morris tighten up my table to prepare for tournyes and he did a great job. these pockets are tighter than bullfrogs a**. my table will improve some players game greatly but will make most players cry. i love it! Tony does good work. thanks Tony

Pocket.jpg
Click to expand...

Those pockets are West Coast Cut ;)
 
Cornerman said:
The Diamond Pro with 4 1/2 or 4 7/16ths, with the <40% must drop specification is right in line with what I feel is "tight but fair."

The tables at my social club are Olhausen Super Pros (or whatever their black commercial table is) the <40% must drop doesn't apply to them, and they jaw a lot of balls that are hit pretty cleanly.

Fred
Click to expand...

Bumping this because I was hoping for an explanation of what the "<40% must drop specification" is.

-Andrew
 
skins said:
i recently had Tony Morris tighten up my table to prepare for tournyes and he did a great job. these pockets are tighter than bullfrogs a**. my table will improve some players game greatly but will make most players cry. i love it! Tony does good work. thanks Tony

Pocket.jpg
Click to expand...

you're probably going to have problems pocketing balls ~ 1" off the rail using draw.
 
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