Both shafts are low deflection however I also realize there are differences here as well. Additionally since I originally posted I did a bit of shaping on the new tip and that helped some, however I am now leaning toward a shaft difference. Also, both cues are same weight.
Tip Softness/Effect on Draw
- Thread starter wizard77
- Start date
You must work for the for 30 dollar tip companies
Same
Additionally, my game has improved quite a bit with the new Lucasi cue and it just has a better feel, to me at least, although I did NOT dislike the Cuetec at all. Just had an itch and the means to get something new and I hefted a Lucasi before I purchased it, (didn't play it), and it was beautifully detailed, so I got it. Leaning toward retipping it, but right in the middle of league play right now so leary of doing it til the post season. Also this is barbox pool so huge draws really aren't needed, but even on the touch shots especially, an inch or two can be a huge difference, thanks for all your responses.
People will tell you that tip has nothing to do with draw, or tip brands all draw the same and its just a getting used to type of issue or stroke issue but here's the thing. I've always disagreed with this.
It is my experience of which i've been playing pool all of my life since I was a little kid, today I am 45. TIP is the most important thing when it comes to a cue second to this is the shaft. And I will tell you that there are certain tips that draw the cueball much more comfortably and easily than other tips but here's the kicker. Sometimes even the same brand/type don't draw the cueball or put spin the same way, afterall its leather and leather to leather are different. Its true that if you buy the same tip/brand/softness it will feel similar but it wont play the same when applying maximum offset spin/draw etc.
Even if its layered. Here's what I do....I install a tip, try it with my maximum offset draw, if it miscues 3 times in one day, I go ahead and change it to the same brand, and do that over and over until I find a good one....and when I find a good one where I try it with my maximum offset draw shots which I know for fact that it shouldn't be a miscue. Then I keep that TIP--- and I go a year with that tip with ZERO MISCUES. So I know for fact that the miscues arent a stroke issue or a chalk issue, I know 10000% for fact that its the tip. Because I know my draws and that I shouldnt get miscue with the offset i'm applying.
As I said......I install the same exact tip that I like, if it miscues 2-3 times where I know 1000% its not stroke issue because I know my draws. Then I change it!! simple as that, some other ppl would think its their stroke but I know for me it isnt....When I find the good tip (Good leather by luck) then that tip will never miscue to me and I can apply maximum draws. Also to clarify this experiment/experience of mine, again as I said I go years without single miscue.
It is my experience of which i've been playing pool all of my life since I was a little kid, today I am 45. TIP is the most important thing when it comes to a cue second to this is the shaft. And I will tell you that there are certain tips that draw the cueball much more comfortably and easily than other tips but here's the kicker. Sometimes even the same brand/type don't draw the cueball or put spin the same way, afterall its leather and leather to leather are different. Its true that if you buy the same tip/brand/softness it will feel similar but it wont play the same when applying maximum offset spin/draw etc.
Even if its layered. Here's what I do....I install a tip, try it with my maximum offset draw, if it miscues 3 times in one day, I go ahead and change it to the same brand, and do that over and over until I find a good one....and when I find a good one where I try it with my maximum offset draw shots which I know for fact that it shouldn't be a miscue. Then I keep that TIP--- and I go a year with that tip with ZERO MISCUES. So I know for fact that the miscues arent a stroke issue or a chalk issue, I know 10000% for fact that its the tip. Because I know my draws and that I shouldnt get miscue with the offset i'm applying.
As I said......I install the same exact tip that I like, if it miscues 2-3 times where I know 1000% its not stroke issue because I know my draws. Then I change it!! simple as that, some other ppl would think its their stroke but I know for me it isnt....When I find the good tip (Good leather by luck) then that tip will never miscue to me and I can apply maximum draws. Also to clarify this experiment/experience of mine, again as I said I go years without single miscue.
some things that make a miscue "or" add to its chances:
polished balls
hitting at the edge of where your miscue spot is on that particular cueball
your stroke moving the tip other than straight
your tip not "holding/gripping" the chalk to it in all spots
not enough chalk for the shot
polished balls
hitting at the edge of where your miscue spot is on that particular cueball
your stroke moving the tip other than straight
your tip not "holding/gripping" the chalk to it in all spots
not enough chalk for the shot
things that make a bad tip,, or a tip that is bad for you:
one that wont hold chalk over its entire surface hitting area
one that mushrooms often, or wont hold its shape as you desire
one that makes a noise thats is disturbing to your shooting
one that doesnt give you confidence in it performing as you want.
one that wont hold chalk over its entire surface hitting area
one that mushrooms often, or wont hold its shape as you desire
one that makes a noise thats is disturbing to your shooting
one that doesnt give you confidence in it performing as you want.
I wonder how many players have actually taken the time, to execute the stripped ball test. It is amazing how much draw you can get, far from the miscue limit. It is also amazing how difficult it is to hit at the limit. Your brain doesn't want to. I know, you don't need the chalk mark to tell you. The cue ball doesn't lie. Same as golf, flight path reveals what you did. If you perform the stripe ball test accurately, patiently, for hours, it will tell you a lot. In the end, there is no such thing as a draw stroke, a draw tip, a draw cue, etc. There is the ability to hit the cue ball where you intend to, and the knowledge to know where that should be.
In my own case I agree with what you have posted. I probably have not spent the time required to to regularly hit the cueball where it needs to be struck. I will continue on this path. Thank you.
For longer shots you can get more draw by not hitting at the maximum tip offset.
Dr. Dave says “With larger drag distances, and for a given maximum cue speed, max draw occurs at less than maximum tip offset (at about 70%-80% tip offset).” I think because the CB has less time to lose backspin on its way to the OB.
pj
chgo
You don't think the gear ratio has anything to do with it?
You mean hitting closer to center increases RPMs? That’s an interesting idea for draw shots, but you’re the only person I’ve heard it from…
pj
chgo
Isn't it a higher gear than on the outer reaches? Seems mechanically sound to me.
Why do you suppose Dave suggests 70-80% of maximum offset instead of, say, 40-50%, or even less…? Suspiciously specific.
pj
chgo
Probably as we've all noticed, you need more spin than thrust - until you don't.
On a straight draw shot any amount of "thrust" is cancelled by collision with the OB, so why not maximize the spin by (as you suggest) hitting closer to center ball?
pj
chgo
For me this "any amount" maxes out into some manner of stop shot. On fresh cloth where the ball will slide forever, I can get full draw without exceeding med speed. Even on pristine conditions though, high thrust draw just produces stop.
This may sound retarded,consider the source 
, but to draw a ball i just see it backing up and do what i need to do so. I'm aboslutely NOT a technical player. Touch/feel/vision are my guides. As for tips, it DON"T MATTER. I can spin it/draw it just as well regardless of tip type. I prefer the feel of firmer tips but i've played some really good games with a wallybushka with a play-doh soft elkmaster.
, but to draw a ball i just see it backing up and do what i need to do so. I'm aboslutely NOT a technical player. Touch/feel/vision are my guides. As for tips, it DON"T MATTER. I can spin it/draw it just as well regardless of tip type. I prefer the feel of firmer tips but i've played some really good games with a wallybushka with a play-doh soft elkmaster.
I know you know this, but it’s the same reason you don’t take off from a stop in 5th gear in a manual transmission car.
I do think there might be something to the “gear ratio effect” for power draws, where the cue stick speed can overcome the ball’s inertia to spin and result in higher immediate rpms when struck slightly above the miscue limit. There would be rapidly diminishing returns on hitting it much higher, however.
We know @dr_dave has proven the slightly higher hit is best for power draws to maximize rpm at contact with the object ball, but iirc the explanation was that it minimized friction loss of rpm with the higher ball velocity.
The DigiBall or high-speed video should be able to prove/disprove the hypothesis by measuring the initial rpm at various tip heights and various cue stick speeds.
(I won’t be surprised if Dave has already looked at this and knows the answer.)