Tips for playing on crap tables

[Gregg]

I've been around the AZ block a few times, and know that some of posters would rather have their toenails pulled out with a pair of pliers than play on anything less than a professionally set up Gold Crown IV with new Simonis, but;

Sometimes during league night we play on tables that are less than ideal. Lots of runoff, bad bumpers, and sometimes that's just the beginning.

Any tips for getting dialed in as best possible on these crummy tables?

 

[socks]

use a crummy house cue, you might find that the crumminess of the house cue might offset the crummyness of the table and then you'll find yourself shooting strait

 

[PKM]

Watch those slow rolls, some of the tables I play on have holes in the cloth big enough to swallow the cue ball.

 

[JayBates]

i practice on crappy tables. i own a crappy table. i love play on a crappy table. think about it..if you fundamentals are sound than it takes a lot more to be good on a crappy table. master the crappy one and when you play on good equiptment its sooo nice. it takes a good stroke to move the cue ball around when using dirty balls, dirty slow nap cloth, and crappy rails. you develope a stroke on this and go to level simonis with arameth balls (bad spelling) and you can do anything you want. this is for those of us who dont have a nice table to practice on.
Jay

 

[VIProfessor]

I've been around the AZ block a few times, and know that some of posters would rather have their toenails pulled out with a pair of pliers than play on anything less than a professionally set up Gold Crown IV with new Simonis, but;

Sometimes during league night we play on tables that are less than ideal. Lots of runoff, bad bumpers, and sometimes that's just the beginning.

Any tips for getting dialed in as best possible on these crummy tables?

Ahh, you've come to the right place, as all players on St. Thomas are experts on this matter. For some reason, whatever action we have down here doesn't usually occur on the few half-decent tables--its almost always on equipment that has hills and valleys, dead spots galore, and if you brush the table in preparation for a match, all the asthmatics have to go outside!

Five tips:

1. Learn your terrain--take whatever time you can to at least roll a ball around the table so you can determine where the table leans, and hit a few kicks or banks to get a feeling for the rails.
2. Don't slow roll balls unless you absolutely have to--choose angles and position routes that will allow you to stroke firmly to keep the hills and valleys out of play.
3. Simplify your patterns and choose routes that require minimum cueball movement or area shape. The longer the cueball route and the more rails you contact, the more the table affects the outcome. Thus, try to avoid long routes, particularly to small target areas.
4. Minimize your use of sidespin where possible. With dirty balls and dirty cloth, English translates to unintended swerve and throw, with often disastrous results.
5. Finally, and most importantly, don't let the bad conditions get to you. If you waste energy fretting and getting frustrated about how the table plays, its like giving your opponent some games on the wire. Remember that the balls do indeed roll funny for everybody. Focus and adjust, and keep it simple!

Good luck, and I hope this helps!

Edit: One very important tip that I forgot to add--adjust your goals! When playing on crappy equipment, it is crucial to think strategically. The table simply is not going to allow you to break and runout the same way you would on better equipment. Thus, you will have to pay more attention to defense, table management and outmoving the other player. Put them in the traps and wait for your easy runouts (I assume you're playing eight-ball, but it applies to 9-ball as well). In a sense, really poor equipment puts the stall on your game in terms of not being able to do much fancy stuff, so stall--it will keep your opponent in the box longer than if you were running out left and right as you might on good equipment!

 

[steev]

only use the following: stun, stop, and draw.
never hit it soft if you can do otherwise.
avoid all rails with both OB and CB.
play balls in the corner, not the side.

this last one's huge for me on valley tables, i'll cut the crap out of a ball to avoid the side.

a good list to start out with...

-s

 

[pwd72s]

Keep in mind that your opponent is playing on the same crappy table...that helps your mental attitude, knowing it's a level (or not) playing field...

 

[corvette1340]

I always bet on the don't, but when its your roll try and roll a seven or eleven

 

[Cornerman]

Start with the minimum bet. Play with house money. Walk away a winner.

I always bet on the don't, but when its your roll try and roll a seven or eleven

The other players must love you when you're cheering.

Fred <~~~ almost a crap table addict

 

[supergreenman]

Aim for the centre of the pocket, try to avoid cheating the pocket. Use less english.

 

[corvette1340]

 

[bigskyjake]

ahh yes the old WSOD, don't forget Ashy Larry

 

[Neil]

..............

 

[CamposCues]

Agreed

NOT TRUE!!! If you can't tell, you hit on one of my pet peeves....people saying "it's the same for both of you". If I'm giving up weight to someone, it's because I can do things on the table that they can't. Give me a crappy table and it's like giving up a ball. I can no longer finesse a ball, can't slow roll, have to hit everything harder than I may want to, can't properly use the rails, ect.. He couldn't do that stuff as well as I can to start with. Now I can't do it either, but the opponent still wants the same weight he would need on a good table. Things that may appear equal are not always equal!

I agree. We have a good team and this year we had to play at a local dive that had the worst pool table I have ever played on. It was an old valley that had been tampered with. The angles on two or three of the pockets was all wrong and the table rolled in at LEAST three different directions. When I say roll, I mean the cue ball would do "U" turns. Anyhow, everyone on my team actually plays position (imagine that) so this had us all frustrated. The other team shot with the "hit it hard and pray" method, so the rolls really didn't matter to them, hell it probably helped. Keep in mind this is a Thursday night doubles slop league and they slopped in plenty. As someone mentioned, don't let it get to you...I did (shot even worse) and I think I was pissed off for a week.

 

[VIProfessor]

NOT TRUE!!! If you can't tell, you hit on one of my pet peeves....people saying "it's the same for both of you". If I'm giving up weight to someone, it's because I can do things on the table that they can't. Give me a crappy table and it's like giving up a ball. I can no longer finesse a ball, can't slow roll, have to hit everything harder than I may want to, can't properly use the rails, ect.. He couldn't do that stuff as well as I can to start with. Now I can't do it either, but the opponent still wants the same weight he would need on a good table. Things that may appear equal are not always equal!

I agree wholeheartedly that playing on poor equipment favors the player who has the least tools and that it, to some extent, brings the better player down towards the lowest common denominator, but the fact is that you know that going in. Therefore, you must utilize your power of discernment and choice as to what weight you are willing to give up on that equipment (or on any equipment, for that matter--would you give up the same weight on a tight pocket table that you would on a table that accepts more balls?). After all, you don't HAVE to play! But in any case, if you're already in the box, you've got to live with the game you made and the conditions that you've accepted. At that point, the only thing you can do is to make the best of it and to use your superior skills and smarts to adapt to the situation. Bemoaning your fate will certainly do nothing to improve it!

Edit: This is admittedly easier said than done! You think I don't cry and moan sometimes too? The horribly bitter experience of losing to vastly inferior players as a result of failure to adapt to the conditions, however, has motivated me to improve my attitude regarding this matter, but as we know from the movie, "It's a process!"

 

[ShootingArts]

excellent post!

I can't give you any rep at the moment but this is an excellent post, well thought out and written.

My version: Simplify whenever possible, avoid very fast and very slow shots.

About everyone playing on the same table, it may affect the better player more but if you play smart you are better able to deal with it. I have always felt that the worse the equipment the more the home field advantage too. I beat some monsters on "my" tables. I loved folks gambling with me on one old five by ten. When things got down to the wire the trick was to use as many rails as I needed to come lengthways of the table towards one foot pocket. The sweet spot was about a foot wide by three feet long with a slow roll. A slow rolled ball would roll in without touching a rail aiming at the rail two diamonds out the long rail or maybe ten inches out parallel to the rail. Speed control was the only issue, that pocket sucked slow rolled balls down like a whirlpool. A secret I tried to keep hidden until the last moment.

Hu

Ahh, you've come to the right place, as all players on St. Thomas are experts on this matter. For some reason, whatever action we have down here doesn't usually occur on the few half-decent tables--its almost always on equipment that has hills and valleys, dead spots galore, and if you brush the table in preparation for a match, all the asthmatics have to go outside!

Five tips:

1. Learn your terrain--take whatever time you can to at least roll a ball around the table so you can determine where the table leans, and hit a few kicks or banks to get a feeling for the rails.
2. Don't slow roll balls unless you absolutely have to--choose angles and position routes that will allow you to stroke firmly to keep the hills and valleys out of play.
3. Simplify your patterns and choose routes that require minimum cueball movement or area shape. The longer the cueball route and the more rails you contact, the more the table affects the outcome. Thus, try to avoid long routes, particularly to small target areas.
4. Minimize your use of sidespin where possible. With dirty balls and dirty cloth, English translates to unintended swerve and throw, with often disastrous results.
5. Finally, and most importantly, don't let the bad conditions get to you. If you waste energy fretting and getting frustrated about how the table plays, its like giving your opponent some games on the wire. Remember that the balls do indeed roll funny for everybody. Focus and adjust, and keep it simple!

Good luck, and I hope this helps!

Edit: One very important tip that I forgot to add--adjust your goals! When playing on crappy equipment, it is crucial to think strategically. The table simply is not going to allow you to break and runout the same way you would on better equipment. Thus, you will have to pay more attention to defense, table management and outmoving the other player. Put them in the traps and wait for your easy runouts (I assume you're playing eight-ball, but it applies to 9-ball as well). In a sense, really poor equipment puts the stall on your game in terms of not being able to do much fancy stuff, so stall--it will keep your opponent in the box longer than if you were running out left and right as you might on good equipment!

 

[bigskyjake]

we used to have a table with a sweet spot like you are describing at a place where I play alot. The sweet spot on our table was directly in front of one of the side pockets. All you had to do was roll a ball by the side pocket nice and slow, then poof it disappeared

 

[Bugz]

A story about people using that 'home field advantage' and Karma

Just last night, my APA team had to go and play the first place team. The match was the playoff finals with the winning team going to Challenge of Champions and the losing team going home.

We walk into this bar and the breath just shot right out of us. The table looked like it hadn't been cleaned since christmas. They insisted we used a 'mud' ball and refused to play with my Aramith Magnetic cueball.

The object balls looked like they just were taken out of a flower pot. Then hit with a hammer and screw driver.

All of the rails had different effects on the cueball.

The worst part of all, the felt was worn and torn. We couldn't spread our bridge hand on the table. I actually had to make my bridge in thin air and then slowly place on the table. The felt was so loose that if I just tried to bridge on the table, any surrounding balls would move.

It actually looked like they took the time to put the table in the worst possible playing condition possible.

We smoked them 3-0, simply because they had as much trouble playing on the table as we did. We forced them to take long shots in which Efren himself couldn't make on this table, while we would make one ball and play safe.

Ahhhh I love the saying "paybacks a *****"

 

[Russ Chewning]

I agree with all of what's been posted above, and I'll expound on a few things...

Use as little cue ball movement as possible. This does not necessarily mean try for short shots all the time.. It can also mean plan your pattern to have more straight in shots. Trust me, on a chewed up barbox, straight in shots are your BEST friend. The reason is, there is a WIDE range of speeds you can hit the ball, and still get the SAME stop shot position.

Try to get into the habit of taking every step possible to "feel" how the table reacts in certain areas, because when it comes time to spin a ball in with a lower speed, you need to know how well you can rely on position in certain parts of the table.

If pattern play is important on good quality 9 footers, it is even more important on good quality 7 footers. And ULTRA important on horrible 7 footers. Often, on a very bad table, you will have ONE chance to get on a particularly difficult ball playing eight ball, and if you don't work the pattern correctly up to that ball, you have no chance to get out.

Get more used to just taking position when you have it already, rather than playing an extra two rail "9 footer pattern". The pattern is easy on a 9 footer, it's not on a 7 footer.. The reason, because the pattern where you follow two cushions out of a corner requires better speed on a 7 footer, lest you end up on a rail, than it does on a bigger table. So, given the opportunity to just bounce a little off the rl and play a ball in the middle of the table into one of the far corners, take it. It's not a choice we usually make on a big table, but it greatly simplifies bar table position.

I don't necessarily agree with the person who said use less english when possible. Remember, since the balls are often really dirty, you can THROW the balls on purpose, much easier. Often, throwing a ball in rather than shooting it in and dealing with more angle os often preferred. Since on a really bad barbox, the less cueball movement, the better, t behooves you to use dirty balls to your advantage, and learn how to kill the ball in situations that are just not possible with clean balls.

Last but not least.. Let your imagination run wild... I remember I was playing on a bad barbox, and had a cluster on one side of the table by a corner pocket, which did have one of my balls free by it, but I could not easily play position to break the cluster off my ball.. I tried getting a thin cut on a ball by the other corner, in order to let the cue ball run into the cluster off the cut, with my lone ball by the corner as an insurance ball..

The table got me and the cueball drifted too far, leaving me no shot but a bank. I don't know to this day if it was the right shot, but something in me told me that if I banked the ball off my other ball, the second ball would carom into the cluster, with the cue ball running two rails for position. Like I said, this might not have been the right shot, but sometimes on the barboxes, it's best just to "know" you're gonna make the wackiest shots you can think of, and just MAKE them, and run out..

That's what I like about the barboxes.. You can make some of the craziest shots in the world, and make yourself a legend amongst the bangers, lol!

Russ

 

[MichaelKendall]

Gotta love them crappy tables...I would give you some advice but I am not real sure I have every played on a good one.