Tournament repairs...

Zims Rack

Promoting the Cueing Arts
Silver Member
Need suggestions...
I've just built a portable table to put my Mid Size Cue Smith lathe on to set up at tournaments/shows to do cue repair. I only plan on doing tips, ferrules and shaft cleaning. What are some suggestions of things to have accessible? I have a list of things, just want to see some other suggestions!
- tips
- shaft cleaner
- shaft sealer
- sand paper
- leather
- paper towels
- extra lights
- cutting tools
- razor blades
- tip glue
- epoxy for ferrule
...anything that you can tell me from your experience that I'm forgetting or should think about doing or bringing?
What about prices at tournaments? Here's what I have so far:
- LePro/Triangle tip $15
- Moori $40
- Shaft cleaned $15
- Shaft cleaned and dents removed $20+
* SPECIAL at this tournament; Shaft cleaned/new tip (LePro/Triangle) $20, Moori tip installed is $30, with shaft cleaning $45.
I'm setting up at my first tournament in February! Should be around 100-120 players there, not counting any ACTION players!

Thanks,
Zim
 
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I've never worked a tournament before, but I would go in with the attitude of expect the un-expected. I'd take every tool that I could manage to fit in my vehicle. I've come across so many repair jobs that were "hacked" jobs from someone else that you never know what you might encounter when you start to do a "simple" repair. I'd hate to take on a repair for someone and not have the tools to complete the job, before they play their next match. Good Luck with your tournament.
 
Zims Rack said:
What about prices at tournaments? Here's what I have so far:
- LePro/Triangle tip $15
- Moori $40
- Shaft cleaned $15
- Shaft cleaned and dents removed $20+

If you can get it, great!!

At the tournaments I have had things done, I know that the main guy in these parts charges:

- LePro/Triangle $10
- Tiger/Moori $25
- Shaft clean $4
- Tip cleaning (reshape) $4
 
Zims Rack said:
- tips
- shaft cleaner
- shaft sealer
- sand paper
- leather
- paper towels
- extra lights
- cutting tools
- razor blades
- tip glue
- epoxy for ferrule

- Mr Clean Magic Erasers
- denatured alcohol
- collets
- tenon dowels (just in case)
- cyanocrylate remover
- small first aid kit
- business cards
- small receipt book
- a guest book
- a box full of :) :) (first impressions and all)

Good luck, with your first tournament and have a good time.

Tracy
 
Michael:
If you have a repair list on your web site. Those are the prices, I would charge. If your regular customers pay that price why would you change just because of a show.
 
Zims Rack said:
Need suggestions...
I've just built a portable table to put my Mid Size Cue Smith lathe on to set up at tournaments/shows to do cue repair. I only plan on doing tips, ferrules and shaft cleaning. What are some suggestions of things to have accessible? I have a list of things, just want to see some other suggestions!
- tips
- shaft cleaner
- shaft sealer
- sand paper
- leather
- paper towels
- extra lights
- cutting tools
- razor blades
- tip glue
- epoxy for ferrule
...anything that you can tell me from your experience that I'm forgetting or should think about doing or bringing?
What about prices at tournaments? Here's what I have so far:
- LePro/Triangle tip $15
- Moori $40
- Shaft cleaned $15
- Shaft cleaned and dents removed $20+
* SPECIAL at this tournament; Shaft cleaned/new tip (LePro/Triangle) $20, Moori tip installed is $30, with shaft cleaning $45.
I'm setting up at my first tournament in February! Should be around 100-120 players there, not counting any ACTION players!

Thanks,
Zim


Try to do good work, not just fast. I have seen some "really" bad work done at tournaments. Ferrules may be a problem to do at tournaments, they have to be done right, You could spend an hour just doing one ferrule, (Not including the drying time for the epoxy, even 5-minute should not be touched for more then an hour). most I have seen do quick hack jobs at the tournaments. Use it more for making contacts and not just making money. Anything that may be a problem take with you and send to them in a day or so. If they want it done right they should not mind.
 
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Mike Webb- I'm charging the same thing as advertised on my site, just thought I'd run a special. Maybe I'll save the special for the second day!
I have collets, alcohol, business cards, flyers, and many other extras I didn't list earlier. Keep the suggestions coming! Remember, I only plan on doing tips, ferrules and shaft cleaning. I'll take wrap and other orders, but I'll do it at home.

Zim
 
macguy said:
Try to do good work, not just fast. I have seen some "really" bad work done at tournaments. Ferrules may be a problem to do at tournaments, they have to be done right, You could spend an hour just doing one ferrule, (Not including the drying time for the epoxy, even 5-minute should not be touched for more then an hour). most I have seen do quick hack jobs at the tournaments. Use it more for making contacts and not just making money. Anything that may be a problem take with you and send to them in a day or so. If they want it done right they should not mind.
I have a 36" Quick Grip vise that can be mounted on my table to brase the shaft if I need to ferrule work. It will give a ferrule repair 2 hours to fix.

Zim
 
You need to make sure you have a set of brushes for your motor, an extra pinion gear and an extra belt. If it happens to be the unlucky time you break one of the above you lose the rest of the tournament as you won't find them locally. It is not likely that you will break one at that moment, but I wouldn't gamble that much dollars of repairs on $30 worth of items. Murphy's law!
Chris
www.hightowercues.com
 
Zims Rack said:
I have a 36" Quick Grip vise that can be mounted on my table to brase the shaft if I need to ferrule work. It will give a ferrule repair 2 hours to fix.

Zim
What are you saying? I don't understand what you mean by this. Do you have a picture? :confused:

Tracy
 
Zims Rack said:
Need suggestions...
I've just built a portable table to put my Mid Size Cue Smith lathe on to set up at tournaments/shows to do cue repair. I only plan on doing tips, ferrules and shaft cleaning.
Speaking of tournaments and shows, is anyone here going to the Derby City Classic? I am driving down on the fourteenth. I'll get to see the banks ring game,
then heading home Sunday the fifteenth.

Tracy
 
Zim,
Ted Harris is a registered poster here and on the CCB. He may lurk on the CCB a little more often than here.
You may want to contact him via PM or email him directly.
http://www.tedharris.com/
Ted used to travel the country doing cue repair at all of the major tournaments. He probably knows as much, or more, about that sort of thing than anyone.
 
Zims Rack said:
Need suggestions...
I've just built a portable table to put my Mid Size Cue Smith lathe on to set up at tournaments/shows to do cue repair. I only plan on doing tips, ferrules and shaft cleaning. What are some suggestions of things to have accessible? I have a list of things, just want to see some other suggestions!
- tips
- shaft cleaner
- shaft sealer
- sand paper
- leather
- paper towels
- extra lights
- cutting tools
- razor blades
- tip glue
- epoxy for ferrule
...anything that you can tell me from your experience that I'm forgetting or should think about doing or bringing?
What about prices at tournaments? Here's what I have so far:
- LePro/Triangle tip $15
- Moori $40
- Shaft cleaned $15
- Shaft cleaned and dents removed $20+
* SPECIAL at this tournament; Shaft cleaned/new tip (LePro/Triangle) $20, Moori tip installed is $30, with shaft cleaning $45.
I'm setting up at my first tournament in February! Should be around 100-120 players there, not counting any ACTION players!

Thanks,
Zim


I would say, that Being you have plenty of advance notice, you are in good shape. We actually were not prepared for the first wpa event in our area, because we were'nt sure We had it until the final weeks, and therefore did not setup. We did altough still offer pickup for those that really needed work done. since we were close by, It only took about 15-30 minutes to get a shaft back to them. Wish we would have setup anyway, if nothing more just for more of the conversation with the shooters then we had.
I would have to agree that If you would want to pe prepared for anything, get whatever you can get on your truck, providing you can lock It up in case you do not take It in with you. as to have what you need, for whatever may come up.

On the tips If you want to have all your bases covered, try building your stock, mainly on the most common tips you think you will need, but don't count out the others. We still get alot of old schoolers that like the softer blue tips for example, altough the tips are a little harder to work, We still want to provide for those people, and We do still get request ocasionally, so try to keep a few around just in case. We Usually buy most common tips through suppliers by the box & mooris we ofcoarse also get from suppliers, but sometimes on the less common used $1 type tips I will just search ebay for someone that sells a variety of tips in singles or small lots for decent price, and work something out on a variety pack of various type tips , and combined shipping. That way we have atleast a few of each of anything that may come up.
Requests we've had are anything from lepro, tria., triuph.,everest, hercules, elk master,Tiger, moori, and many of the others. used to get alot of request for champions in the earlier years, but rarely hear anything anymore about them. Anyway Guess point being, you can never be overprepared just in case something arrises, sometimes just having a few of each of the lesser requested tips can payoff. Really probably depends on the shooters that are at the tournament or fans watching that may decide to have work done on their cue while there. Sounds Like a pretty good turnout at the one you are working, so probably would not hurt to be prepared.
our non tournament prices are pretty much around the usual with a few exceptions-

Tips- we run $12 pluss tip cost, but for regulars we will sometimes do for $10 with a $1 priced tip installed. We also take care of house cues at a more discounted rate due to the bulk work. Altough We use mooris on our personal cues, we have only recently started having alot of requests for them in our area now, so up to this point only bought in smaller quatities and price depended on what costs we had in the tips at the time. Looks like We are going to need to start buying those in a little more bulk now, so We should be able to determine a set cost on them soon.

On shaft cleaning, I will not touch for less than $15-$17 by It'self, and it goes up from there. ofcoarse with other work done It becomes extremely discounted though. I leave It up to My father what He wants to charge when he does one, but for me when I clean a shaft I usually determine the condition and quote a price. I have had some that were a breeze and others that were a nightmare, so condition does make a difference to me in the amount of work that goes into it. When I clean a shaft I don't skip any steps, in fact in many cases have to add a few. The pores are opened, deep cleaned, dents worked out, sealed, sanded, and polished various times, all to the best of My ability, in fact sometimes I have more time in them, then My time allowance on what was quoted. 4 bucks is a great price if this much work is put in, and a quality job done. Heck, wish there was someone near me that would do It at that price, I'd give My shaft cleaning work to them. ofcoarse if all I had to do to freshen them up was clean the surface up and polish would probably be alot less, if the sealer was still good enough for It, and they did not want anything underneath cleaned, but even with that, don't think I could do It at that price.

We will usually do a combo common tip job (lepro,WB, and so priced tips) with shaft cleaning for $20-$25 as a special, but depends on amount of shaft work needed.

I would think that to really be prepared, bring whatever you could in your cue shop not dedicated to cuebuilding, and more to do with shaft/tip work. what ever you usually use for that, you would definently want by your side. Also anything to do with other stuff that you may have time and are willing to take on while there. Wraps for one - If you are comfortable doing those, you never know, but you may end up with the time for them, and may be asked about It. I could probably think of others, but what ever you usually offer and can make portable I would bring just in case.


I have come accross hack jobs also, so would think that is a good idea, would not hurt to be prepared. The suggestions mentioned by rsb are good ones also, a few of those might have slipped me by If I was preparing Myself.

Good Luck with the tournament, May the Pool Gods look down on you, and Bless you with quality work & plenty of happy customers to provide that work to You.


Greg
 
Zims Rack said:
Mike Webb- I'm charging the same thing as advertised on my site, just thought I'd run a special. Maybe I'll save the special for the second day!
I have collets, alcohol, business cards, flyers, and many other extras I didn't list earlier. Keep the suggestions coming! Remember, I only plan on doing tips, ferrules and shaft cleaning. I'll take wrap and other orders, but I'll do it at home.

Zim

Here's your specials
Your here
You do it correctly
Take everyone in order, no favorites.
Try not to take any work home, that's not why your there.
Control your booth.
Any thing that will go wrong, will go wrong while the customer is watching. If something happens don't panic, act professional and repair it.
Have fun, Your there to offer quality, make contacts and get paid for your professionalism.
 
Michael Webb said:
Control your booth.
I would take a friend to help cart stuff in and out. They would also make good security guards, for when nature calls ;) .

Michael Webb said:
Any thing that will go wrong, will go wrong while the customer is watching.
That is why I included, cyanocrylate remover and a first aid kit, on the list.

Tracy
 
I meant to ask you guys what you all charge for ferrules? both with tenon work, and without. I aggree there is some time involved in them, Therefore hard to price, with all the extra work that can be required in some cases. I have had some threaded tenons that were a motha to clean the glue off the threads before cleaning/recutting them to replace the ferrule. They can be time consuming, and sometimes I don't know what I have until I get them back to the shop and open them up. I am speaking of capped ferrules for the most part, that even after removing the tip can be difficult to tell without facing the ferrule down untill It opens and reveals the end of the tenon to give you some idea of what you have. Regardless, the ferrule jobs can be easier & quicker, or tougher & slower in any given case, Therefore hard to quote price, unless the amount of work is obvious as in the case of the ferrule coming off before hand or likewise.
I have also run accross threaded capped ferrules that are filled on the end of the tenon, between It, and the inside of the cappped face of the ferrule. what Is the best thing to do in these situations where the threads are too short to reach the end of the ferrule? should you get the rest off the shoulder and add the rest of the threads loosing just a hair of lenth, replace the tenon altogether to keep the lenth, or fill It like It was? I will not mention whos work this was, but lets just say It was a good cuemaker that has been building Great playing cues for a while now. We even own one and love it. One thing I know from experience with them is that if you get one like this and don't fill It the way It was, it might hit different therefore not what the player was used to, and can cost them some time relearning their shaft depending on how well the adapt. This leads me to wonder regardless of how well of a repair job was done, or not, in the first place, if i should even change it, even if I think I should, as to do a better repair. Even though the repair might be better, It may not be the hit the player is use to from the shaft, therefore fooling them in to thinking you did not do something correct when you fixed the problem. someone else that did not shoot with it before the repair, could pick it up and play Great with it, because they do not know how the hit was before, therefore not used to It they way it was and influenced by It. Any opinions?


Thanks Guys,

Greg
 
Cue Crazy said:
I meant to ask you guys what you all charge for ferrules? both with tenon work, and without. I aggree there is some time involved in them, Therefore hard to price, with all the extra work that can be required in some cases. I have had some threaded tenons that were a motha to clean the glue off the threads before cleaning/recutting them to replace the ferrule. They can be time consuming, and sometimes I don't know what I have until I get them back to the shop and open them up. I am speaking of capped ferrules for the most part, that even after removing the tip can be difficult to tell without facing the ferrule down untill It opens and reveals the end of the tenon to give you some idea of what you have. Regardless, the ferrule jobs can be easier & quicker, or tougher & slower in any given case, Therefore hard to quote price, unless the amount of work is obvious as in the case of the ferrule coming off before hand or likewise.
I have also run accross threaded capped ferrules that are filled on the end of the tenon, between It, and the inside of the cappped face of the ferrule. what Is the best thing to do in these situations where the threads are too short to reach the end of the ferrule? should you get the rest off the shoulder and add the rest of the threads loosing just a hair of lenth, replace the tenon altogether to keep the lenth, or fill It like It was? I will not mention whos work this was, but lets just say It was a good cuemaker that has been building Great playing cues for a while now. We even own one and love it. One thing I know from experience with them is that if you get one like this and don't fill It the way It was, it might hit different therefore not what the player was used to, and can cost them some time relearning their shaft depending on how well the adapt. This leads me to wonder regardless of how well of a repair job was done, or not, in the first place, if i should even change it, even if I think I should, as to do a better repair. Even though the repair might be better, It may not be the hit the player is use to from the shaft, therefore fooling them in to thinking you did not do something correct when you fixed the problem. someone else that did not shoot with it before the repair, could pick it up and play Great with it, because they do not know how the hit was before, therefore not used to It they way it was and influenced by It. Any opinions?


Thanks Guys,

Greg


Set a fair price and take the bad with the good. Some are easy and some are hard. You don't go back to the customer and say, " This was an easy job so I am charging you less". Don't charge more if it turns out to be a little harder. You should also be custom making every ferrule to each job, not filling it up with epoxy. Work with raw rod and make your own ferrules.
 
Cue Crazy said:
should you get the rest off the shoulder and add the rest of the threads loosing just a hair of lenth, replace the tenon altogether to keep the lenth, or fill It like It was?

Thicker cap - First choice.
New tenon - Second choice.
Make existing tenon longer - Never, no way. That would get you a bad rep real quick.

Tracy
 
RSB-Refugee said:
What are you saying? I don't understand what you mean by this. Do you have a picture? :confused:

Tracy
I will do the necessary work to replace the ferrule on the lathe. Once it's time for the epoxy to set, it will be placed in a vice and set aside so I can continue to use the lathe for another repair job. Let it set for about 1hour-1.15mins and then cut the ferrule down to size and retip! Sorry if I sounded a little confusing at first.

Zim
 
Zims Rack said:
I will do the necessary work to replace the ferrule on the lathe. Once it's time for the epoxy to set, it will be placed in a vice and set aside so I can continue to use the lathe for another repair job. Let it set for about 1hour-1.15mins and then cut the ferrule down to size and retip! Sorry if I sounded a little confusing at first.

Zim
Ah, a sleeved ferrule, I didn't think of that. Makes sense now. Duh :o

Tracy
 
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