Hey Nathan, your plan sounds quite ambitious and I certainly wish you the best of luck in your venture. I agree there are certainly a growing number of people and households that have eschewed typical cable and satellite tv for internet content. I would argue though that as this trend continues, the amount of content delivered by the internet would be orders of magnitude greater than what's available through traditional mediums. Attracting casual viewers and growing a fan base will still be a challenge because there will be so much other content available. I think the key will be in making it easy for people to find you as well as *want* to find you. So I guess the question would still remain, how many people actually *want* to watch pool? Clearly ESPN believes it's not a huge amount given the number of times of they'll replay a trick shot tournament over regular pool, not to mention the sacrificial time slots pool gets when it is televised.
Trick Shots on ESPN - lame
- Thread starter tonmo
- Start date
you make an excellent point. this thread and others like show that most "serious" poolplayers hate trick shots. however ESPN does tend to replay them so someone is watching. usually in a market driven ecomony what the customer wants is the customer gets. apparently the customer wants to see trick shot competition. the poolplayers get all pissy b/c its not real pool. maybe the industry just needs to learn a lesson hear.
brian
I don't know if your comments are just rhetorical but there is a simple answer why trick shots draw an audience.
Pool is not a sport that is driven by personality. No one has any idea who the players are or cares who wins. They just want to watch the game played, see the shots made and so on. Pool is basically to the average spectator just an exhibition sport and not a real competition. Again, no one cares who wins. That is why they love the trick shots. It is an interesting exhibition, in fact it captures the interest of the average spectator far more then watching two people play who mean nothing to them.
Until pool players can make themselves important to the spectator because of who they are it will always be this way. I am sure that ESPN knows that the trick shots draw far more then a pool match. In fact the women will always out draw the men just due to the novelty of seeing women play at that level. They are I am sorry to say more of a curiosity to the public then real sports players.
To sum up, to the public all pool is just an exhibition, not a sport and the players mean nothing.
Last edited:
gonna disagree with you here macguy. the world cup of trick shots had a 50K purse. you really wanna call that an exhibition? tell tom rossman, andy segal, bruce bartholette, mike massey, nick nikolaidis, stefan pelinga, luke szwala or ralph eckert that it was only an exhibition and i am sure that they would laugh right in your face. competition, a team to root for, patriotism and plenty of character (think tom rossman here) made this an excellent event to watch live and again on tv. again maybe promoters could find a lesson here?
also women playing pool is not a curiosity. they actually have a tour that is able to get their matches televised. any men's event could equally be on ESPN if the promoter wasnt too cheap to pay ESPN's production fee. that is the real reason you see mostly women playing pool on ESPN (although again billiards internation did have the internation tournament of champions on ESPN as well)
brian
No argument that the women have done well to get a real tour and therefor real TV time. But I think mac had a point about pool not being driven by personalities (even though there are plenty of them in pool). I am reasonably into pool and have heard of many pros but I dunno almost half the names in that list. If I don't, then we're lucky if the average ESPN channel surfer recognizes just one.
They are watching to see amazing shots, not the personalities behind them. Ask them a week later who came in 2nd place and they won't be able to tell you unless it's mike massey (in which case they won't be able to name the first place guy).
youre right about that of course. its kind of 50/50 though. if pool was a better spectator sport and watched more heavily then folks would know the personalities and if the sport was driven more by personality folks might recognize the players. i think that is one benefit of trick shots-it allows a little more of a players personality to show thru while entertaining the crowd.
brian
That makes sense to me. They're expected to be entertainers and so they are. The top 9ballers or straight pool players aren't, and pretty much keep their game faces on the entire time.
That's pretty sad for pool........I'm pretty sure I heard on TV that pool had more participants than any other sport.......What is it about the US that gives pool so little TV coverage and in other countries it's broadcast in prime time? Do the network big shots not get it?.......
James
I expect them to be entertainers. Jeanette Lee and Vivian have it right. Men don't put on any kind of show and then complain that there is no money in pool.
There is nothing worse than this. How does that even come about? Are the producers asking the audience to do that prior to the match? Or is it a voluntary reaction people have to watching a professional pool player do a 4" stop shot on a ball hanging in the pocket?
I dunno, I think you're right in the sense that if they chose to be entertaining they'd draw more viewers. But it kind of sucks if they're almost forced to do that. The golfers can just go out there and play the game. So can the football players. Some of them ham it up to the crowd but it's strictly optional for them. For that matter even the guys in darts make good money and I wouldn't be shocked if they don't need to perform for it, outside of their performance at the dartboard.
I haven't got time to read this whole thread, today. But, I've read and skimmed enough to give me reason to comment.
A few years ago, I was not at all impressed with trick shots. I thought it was all set up stuff and not nearly as much fun or as challenging or skillful as playing 8 ball. But, my husband, being the good cuemaker that he is, started watching youtube videos of some of the guys... Tim Chin, Eric Yow, etc.. I finally got a little jealous, since he was spending more time watching these guys than with his wife. He had already begun making masse' cues, but he wanted to build them to endure the punishment the players would give them. Understanding the shots they would use them for was vital to his purpose. I couldn't fault him for that, right?
In our marriage, we usually try to become involved in the activities / interests that the other one is into, even if we're not so crazy for it. So, I began watching some of the videos when he wasn't home. I wanted to surprise him with my knowledge of who the guys were, etc..
When Gene first started making masse' cues, I thought he was absolutely nuts. I figured NOBODY would buy them, because they were for trick shots, not REAL POOL. Boy, was I wrong!! Now, I'm so glad he chose to build them. We sell a lot of masse' cues every year, partly because Gene builds so many of them that the customers trust his knowledge and skills. Not a lot of cuemakers would dedicate the time and effort Gene has given to making masse' cues.
During all this time of learning, we decided we wanted to sponsor Tim "The Dragon" Chin and Jamey "Sharpshooter" Gray. These guys are not only very skilled in trick shots, but they are excellent people and we have been proud to be associated with them. We wish them well in all their competitions. Whenever possible, we attend their competitions, because we really enjoy being present to visibly show our appreciation for those we sponsor.
I can tell you, as a person who previously felt trick shots were a bunch of bunk, I'm so glad I decided to open my eyes and learn more about it. I have learned a lot about the supreme dedication of these talented people that I will always appreciate. And the format for most of their competitions is well designed for their "game".
Another thing... If 8 Ball / 9 Ball supporters REALLY wanted the games on tv as much as the trick shot folks want their competitions there, they would gladly put up the same $$ to make it happen.
A lot of folks don't understand the different games. Their usual response is to claim how terrible those games are. I challenge each person who thinks they don't like a particular game to spend more time learning about it. One Pocket and 3 Cushion are some spectacular games that will really enhance your 8 Ball and 9 Ball skills -- especially in the area of mental strategy and special shots. Even some artistic pool shots might give you some help in a regular game of 8 Ball or 9 Ball. Do some research and educate yourselves, so you can appreciate all the games, not just the ones you play most.
A few years ago, I was not at all impressed with trick shots. I thought it was all set up stuff and not nearly as much fun or as challenging or skillful as playing 8 ball. But, my husband, being the good cuemaker that he is, started watching youtube videos of some of the guys... Tim Chin, Eric Yow, etc.. I finally got a little jealous, since he was spending more time watching these guys than with his wife. He had already begun making masse' cues, but he wanted to build them to endure the punishment the players would give them. Understanding the shots they would use them for was vital to his purpose. I couldn't fault him for that, right?
In our marriage, we usually try to become involved in the activities / interests that the other one is into, even if we're not so crazy for it. So, I began watching some of the videos when he wasn't home. I wanted to surprise him with my knowledge of who the guys were, etc..
When Gene first started making masse' cues, I thought he was absolutely nuts. I figured NOBODY would buy them, because they were for trick shots, not REAL POOL. Boy, was I wrong!! Now, I'm so glad he chose to build them. We sell a lot of masse' cues every year, partly because Gene builds so many of them that the customers trust his knowledge and skills. Not a lot of cuemakers would dedicate the time and effort Gene has given to making masse' cues.
During all this time of learning, we decided we wanted to sponsor Tim "The Dragon" Chin and Jamey "Sharpshooter" Gray. These guys are not only very skilled in trick shots, but they are excellent people and we have been proud to be associated with them. We wish them well in all their competitions. Whenever possible, we attend their competitions, because we really enjoy being present to visibly show our appreciation for those we sponsor.
I can tell you, as a person who previously felt trick shots were a bunch of bunk, I'm so glad I decided to open my eyes and learn more about it. I have learned a lot about the supreme dedication of these talented people that I will always appreciate. And the format for most of their competitions is well designed for their "game".
Another thing... If 8 Ball / 9 Ball supporters REALLY wanted the games on tv as much as the trick shot folks want their competitions there, they would gladly put up the same $$ to make it happen.
A lot of folks don't understand the different games. Their usual response is to claim how terrible those games are. I challenge each person who thinks they don't like a particular game to spend more time learning about it. One Pocket and 3 Cushion are some spectacular games that will really enhance your 8 Ball and 9 Ball skills -- especially in the area of mental strategy and special shots. Even some artistic pool shots might give you some help in a regular game of 8 Ball or 9 Ball. Do some research and educate yourselves, so you can appreciate all the games, not just the ones you play most.
Check out this post to see how this trick shot event wasn't at all like Ray had imagined.
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showpost.php?p=2133918&postcount=1
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showpost.php?p=2133918&postcount=1