Turning shafts

[Canadian cue]

I started using this setup for doing squares to rounds and found lt saves a fair amount of time. I am not sure how many out there are doing the same but it beats putting the centers in by hand with hammer and punch.
Short explanation I cut the corners off in the jointer then grab it in a self centering four jaw. I use the sqaure at the bottom to unsure it is perpendicular to the drill. I am using a 60 deg countersink to drill the centre that way it shallow in case I want to change centers after first turn.
Just thought I would share

 

[JoeyInCali]

Nice setup.
I center by hand though. Almost all of the shaft squares/rounds I have, end up getting offset centers.

 

[MVPCues]

I once made a post about my 3 different jigs I use for 3 different amounts of offset for hand drilling the ends of shaft dowels. These were for center drilling round dowels. It hardly made a stir.

That set up is nice. I have to admit though, for center drilling squares or octagons (I cut corners off a lot as well) when I don't care to offset I just use the plastic center finder. I make marks, then press into the cross hair with a dart, then center drill by hand.

Kelly

 

[JoeyInCali]

I once made a post about my 3 different jigs I use for 3 different amounts of offset for hand drilling the ends of shaft dowels. These were for center drilling round dowels. It hardly made a stir.

That set up is nice. I have to admit though, for center drilling squares or octagons (I cut corners off a lot as well) when I don't care to offset I just use the plastic center finder. I make marks, then press into the cross hair with a dart, then center drill by hand.

Kelly

Same here. Since I started offsetting, my yield has gone up.

 

[Cue Crazy]

Same here I do them by hand. I have a hand square I made for locating the centers, but I rarely use that on shafts because more times then not I have to offset at least one of the centers to get the grain running straight inline with them.

 

[Canadian cue]

I hear ya on the offsetting the centers, this is why I use a countersink rather than a center drill. I treat the first pass as though I was using a dowelling machine. Each to there own, one of the things I liked about this trade was that it didnt come with a manual. Every one learns to do it a little different then the next.

 

[MVPCues]

I hear ya on the offsetting the centers, this is why I use a countersink rather than a center drill. I treat the first pass as though I was using a dowelling machine. Each to there own, one of the things I liked about this trade was that it didnt come with a manual. Every one learns to do it a little different then the next.

I certainly meant no criticism. Yes, I saw the part about the countersink. You don't have that extra nipple length so to speak so you can keep it shallow. Most of my blanks are round already, so the grain direction is a little easier to judge. Turning the octagon round, and then judging and deciding on an offset when it might be a little easier to grade is a good idea, I see what you are saying.

Kelly

 

[Cue Crazy]

Yeah I don't think anyone meant to criticize. I don't think there is any set way to do It, I have asked people in the past, and several people do It differently, just different strokes for different folks. When I do squares they start out centered in the middle, It's only at dowel form that I get into offsetting. I think It's a cool little setup You have there.

 

[JoeyInCali]

Yeah I don't think anyone meant to criticize. I don't think there is any set way to do It, I have asked people in the past, and several people do It differently, just different strokes for different folks. When I do squares they start out centered in the middle, It's only at dowel form that I get into offsetting. I think It's a cool little setup You have there.

I have found that if I offsetted my squares, it'd be the same if I offsetted them after they are rounded.
Not cutting the corners can be reaaaaallly dusty, but I can turn a square to round in two passes with a 3-wing slot cutter on my caveman cnc taperer.

 

[Cue Crazy]

I have found that if I offsetted my squares, it'd be the same if I offsetted them after they are rounded.
Not cutting the corners can be reaaaaallly dusty, but I can turn a square to round in two passes with a 3-wing slot cutter on my caveman cnc taperer.

Yep, It is the same, just the way I have done them. I'm very wasteful to begin with, I often start with 1.5 and cut no corners for points, so I have plenty of room and loads of dust:wink: Anyway I guess I have the room to play with, and for some reason I just see the the grain better when round. Most shafts that I turn, start out from dowel anyway, well, with the exception of some that I got that look like someone skived them round with a hand plane, It's good shaft wood though. makes It a bit tricky to align the grain though cause some are slightly flat sided in places, and don't leave much wiggle room. I haven't tried turning with the 3 wings yet, I have them, only used for slotting so far though. I know they will cut deep, but from some of the horror stories we have heard, they scare the scooby doo out of me. I will say Must be nice to be able to change tapers with a cnc program and no tooling changes, I'm still living in the dark ages, been so busy I still haven't found the time to get My tapering project off the ground. I'm guessing Yours is working out well for ya. I'll probably be moving before too long, so mine may stay on the back burner until then.

 

[josie]

I assume you are offsetting centers to minimize runout. If that is the case can you explain how you look at a shaft and get it centered. If it is not to minimize runout can you explain why this is done. I get my shafts in dowel form and have always just center drilled them but I would like to learn a way to improve on what I am doing.

Thanks for the info.

 

[Cue Crazy]

I assume you are offsetting centers to minimize runout. If that is the case can you explain how you look at a shaft and get it centered. If it is not to minimize runout can you explain why this is done. I get my shafts in dowel form and have always just center drilled them but I would like to learn a way to improve on what I am doing.

Thanks for the info.

Well, others may be able to explain better then I, but basically what I am trying to straighten out is the annual ring's runoff from center to center. Well It's not like the grain is twisted on all shafts, so if runoff is the correct term to describe It, then Even on some #1 grade shafts, which are still basically straight grain for the most part, the annual ring within the dowel can deviate up to as much as "1/4 from center to center, the lower the grade generally the more deviation there is, as well as other quality issues, but generally speaking as with a #1 grade, many times You still need to get the annual ring aligned with the centers. To do that I off set the center hole. This can be done differently depending on what the maker prefers. On some shafts the GPI is a slightly higher count on one end then It is on the other, I prefer to have the tighter side at the ferrule end, so My hopes are usually that this end is the one where the shaft deviates the most on, because due to the shape of the taper of a shaft there is more room on the ferrule end for any material being lost during this offsetting adjustment. I'm also trying to make sure both sides of the annual ring center out, because It's easy to get one side centered only to spin the shaft over and have the other still slightly deviate from the other side, so when ever I'm off centering I'm also trying to take that into consideration when setting My center hole. In a perfect world I would want that ring running straight through the center holes like one of the lines in a set of cross hairs on a scope. I don't know that this is the correct way to do it, as I've never had any formal training in this area, but It's how I do It, and It has worked for me.

 

[MVPCues]

I assume you are offsetting centers to minimize runout. If that is the case can you explain how you look at a shaft and get it centered. If it is not to minimize runout can you explain why this is done. I get my shafts in dowel form and have always just center drilled them but I would like to learn a way to improve on what I am doing.

Thanks for the info.

To add to what Greg responded with...

1. Take a dowel and look at the face on one end, and find the grain line that is most in the center of the dowel. If you are lucky, there will be a lot right in the center, and you will have to try and find one easily seen that is in the center.

2. Get a good pencil and start tracing it to the other end of the dowel.

3. If the grain line you are tracing completely disappears out of the side of the shaft, it is mostly likely not worth fooling with for that dowel. You can start tracing the center grain line from the other end, and see which one follows the center the longest. One option is make that end the tip end, but offsetting is still not worth that much given the severity of the run off.

4. If the grain line makes it all the way to the other end of the dowel, and is still at the center, smile and center drilling normally.

5. If the grain line makes it all the way to the other end of the dowel, but is all the way over on the edge, offset the center drill on both ends in opposite directions to straighten the line to center it from end to end as much as possible. You can decide which end will be the tip end, and offset that one a little more since you are cutting away more material there anyway. You can't offset the butt ends all that much.

6. If the grain line makes it all the way to the other end, and is only a little off, you can just offset one end of the dowel an appropriate amount.

Up to the individual whether they offset using the eyeball, or use a jig to offset standard amounts. For round shaft dowels, I went the later approach, and made 3 jigs with 3 different offset amounts. When mixing and matching on tip and butt end, it gives me enough options. I offset butt blanks (not the butt end of a shaft, pieces for the butt of the cue) by eyeball since there is usually a lot more meat to work with.

There are several other grading things to look at when doing this as other factors come into play, but this should be plenty to get you started doing this if you feel it is worth your time. Let each shaft tell you what to do.

Kelly

 

[josie]

Thanks for the replys. I think I get what you guys are talking about now.

 

[JoeyInCali]

There are several other grading things to look at when doing this as other factors come into play, but this should be plenty to get you started doing this if you feel it is worth your time. Let each shaft tell you what to do.

Kelly

tap tap tap
I do the same for forearm, coring dowels and handles.