PracticeChampion
Well-known member
Alot of truth to that atleast on big tables, bar box not so much. Too much congestion and cue ball movement must
Using too much inside English??
- Thread starter judochoke
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A long time ago I worked with a millwright and he was teaching me the basics of welding. He told me, that whenever possible use my off hand (left). Of course I asked him why. The response was: "Once you know how to weld, doing it with your right hand will be easy. However the first time you're in a spot where you need to use your left, you'll be screwed."
I'm paraphrasing a little but the point stands. Shooting with outside is easy. Shooting with inside is literally just as easy but the vast majority don't train themselves to do it so it seems "more unnatural" than outside.
I get the advantage of developing patterns that may or may not require the use of both, or neither inside or outside. I tend to default to inside if there's an option. Believe it or not but it's actually a hair demoralizing for your opponent when you display a level of control/options greater than theirs. Enjoy it...
Inside English is a blessing when needed.
A little inside keeps a ball from jamming along the rail but most importantly it will kill the speed of the cue ball when coming off the rail
especially on very thin cut shots.
Use the English that is called for.
Inside, outside, center ball, whatever is called for and it is importatant to be comfortable using all of the above.
A little inside keeps a ball from jamming along the rail but most importantly it will kill the speed of the cue ball when coming off the rail
especially on very thin cut shots.
Use the English that is called for.
Inside, outside, center ball, whatever is called for and it is importatant to be comfortable using all of the above.
Centerball is the best way to hold the cue ball (stop shots, soft rolls, soft stuns). Spin is the best way to move the cue ball around. TOR Lowry is a centerball fanatic, and in his video on Center ball training he even confirms that spin is a more accurate way to control speed and direction for cue ball movement (45:47-46:33 on this link:
How much spin you need depends on if you're playing a hold game or a move game. Straight pool and 8 ball are hold games. You will use mostly center ball. Spin will still be needed to move around though, and those situations are often the critical transitions that will take two 4 ball runs and turn it into a complete table run. I'd say you use spin in 8 ball about 25% of shots.
9 ball and 10 ball are move games. You can't pick a pattern to work around movement, you have to do what you have to do. Here you'll be using spin on 50% of your shots on average.
I truly believe if more people quit screwing around with their fundamentals and learned to spin balls with a soft touch they'd play much better. You don't need a powerhouse stroke with laser accuracy if you have ball in hand shape on every shot, and that is what spin unlocks for you once you learn how to use it correctly and assemble the right patterns and angles.
Zerksies
Well-known member
Spin is needed, people just use it to damn much or use it very uneducated.
I'm sitting in the poolhall and i hear some uneducated players taking and i overhear "what spin do you need to pocket that ball?" I'm just sitting their keeping quite thinking, you don't need shit for spin to pocket that ball, You need spin on the ball to get onto the next ball. I could pocket that ball with anything you put on it.
The problem with inside english is that the needed contact point is much different than what you are usually shooting (no side spin or outside).
You have to forced yourself to adjust for the "push" that inside english imparts on the object ball.... in other words, you have to over-cut shots from what seems like the correct angle.
Fairly easy on short/medium shots, but takes precision on anything over 4 feet or so.
I doubt I use inside english on more than 1 in 15 shots... or very minimally.
You have to forced yourself to adjust for the "push" that inside english imparts on the object ball.... in other words, you have to over-cut shots from what seems like the correct angle.
Fairly easy on short/medium shots, but takes precision on anything over 4 feet or so.
I doubt I use inside english on more than 1 in 15 shots... or very minimally.
Depending on the angle the cue ball is coming in to the cushion, inside spin can speed up the cue ball off the cushion.
lameMy CJ reference was just a bad joke. I LOVE ME SOME CJ
Yes, that’s a perfect example of a shot that requires inside, that a lot of players are not comfortable shooting.
What many players forget including myself sometimes, is because of the way the inside spin will grab when it hits the end rail, you have to shoot the shot with considerable pace, otherwise you won’t get the cue ball far enough back up the table to leave yourself a high percentage shot on the next ball.
Out of stroke right now so I would probably use more side spin than normal for me but I rely on speed and angles for the most part. Then I work up and down the center line usually with a little side. More than a half tip is unusual and I might play all evening with less than a handful of shots needing a lot of side spin. Sometimes I pour it on just for grins on the last ball or two when playing somebody else to make the following balls just tap ins to make which makes it safe to juice to get to the next ball after that. Often it is how I play the ball before the one I am going to juice that matters.
After playing a few years I had gotten into the "inside english is evil" club. Then I decided this was BS and worked on my inside english game . It wasn't long before shooting inside was just one more way to hit a ball. As somebody mentioned earlier, it does open up a bunch of options that people not comfortable shooting inside don't have.
Shooting with inside is maybe slightly harder than shooting with outside, maybe not harder at all. It is definitely a weapon to have in your arsenal. I have surprised a lot of people who thought the only option was around the table in heavy traffic to get shape when inside would kill the cue ball nicely.
It has already been said over and over but use the simplest shot that accomplishes your objectives. Part of my objectives include minimalizing cue ball travel and keeping out of traffic as much as I can. Pretty much one and the same. My goal is to play boring pool to watch!
Hu
After playing a few years I had gotten into the "inside english is evil" club. Then I decided this was BS and worked on my inside english game . It wasn't long before shooting inside was just one more way to hit a ball. As somebody mentioned earlier, it does open up a bunch of options that people not comfortable shooting inside don't have.
Shooting with inside is maybe slightly harder than shooting with outside, maybe not harder at all. It is definitely a weapon to have in your arsenal. I have surprised a lot of people who thought the only option was around the table in heavy traffic to get shape when inside would kill the cue ball nicely.
It has already been said over and over but use the simplest shot that accomplishes your objectives. Part of my objectives include minimalizing cue ball travel and keeping out of traffic as much as I can. Pretty much one and the same. My goal is to play boring pool to watch!
Hu
Aha, but you're not correct here. There are times where you may need to throw the OB with CB spin to generate the necessary potting line. I had the situation come up just last night. Admittingly, these circumstances are not common, but still a reality.
How is the above any different when shooting with outside english...? The corrections are merely the opposite.
For any amount of "push" you experience with inside. There's an equal amount of "pull" when applying the same amount of english on the opposite side of the CB.
I can't say I've ever really paid attention to how frequently I use whatever, but you had me pondering it. For sake of perspective and from what I've seen in the past. If a player doesn't require shape and is shooting their last ball with a slight cut. They generally use low/outside. That seems to be the defacto standard for most. In this circumstance I personally opt to hit the same shot with high/inside. Not saying that's the better option. It's just what I tend to do as someone who doesn't hesitate to play with inside.
When I consider it low outside and high inside are sorta reciprocals of each other. You are rolling the cue ball on the same axis, one with forward spin, one with reverse spin.
I can't really say what I hit most with when I get down to where shape doesn't matter. The shot will decide the spin I use, if any. For awhile I would catch myself loading up with spin to shoot a ball that didn't need it like the last ball or one of the last balls on the table. Why do it? I had just gotten in the habit for awhile, no need for it. Setting myself up for unintended consequences to bite me in the butt!
Hu
Hu
More often than that you need to unthrow a cut due to speed requirements. I used to stubbornly avoid doing this; no longer.
Nothing prettier though, than a smooth inside 3 railer spinning its way to the other far end of the table. Sometimes used killing the cue off a cushion or straight pool, a Mike Sigel chewing a rack and spinning perfectly to the middle of the table. It can be dangerous (skids and such) but a needed art.
thenaturalpoolplayer
Active member
OMG stop looking at it as TIPS of english! There are an infinite amount of "tips" of english so you can't possibly do this deliberately!. Not to mention you have to take into account the deflection, swerve and throw. You are rattling the pocket because you don't have a feel for it yet. The only way to fix this is keep shooting until you get a feel for it.
There is no such thing at too much anything english...you use the english you need to get the position you want...or just accept what the table is giving you and play a more conservative shot.
Definitely... With one caveat though.
When playing high/inside, you know that no matter the table (cloth) condition the CB will roll forward after contact. With a very predictable carom line. When striking with draw however the cloth variables come into play. You could potentially end up with draw, kill, stun, or even under bad conditions roll through. That may not matter in the specific circumstance, but it is something you need to factor in when playing with otherwise 'inconsequential' CB control.
thenaturalpoolplayer
Active member
Centerball is a theoretical impossibility. Also, you use whatever english you need to get the shot...you don't force centerball to emulate what a little bit of lefts or rights can do more effectively. Anyway, you aren't really using more centerball...you are playing less english with a little bit of bottoms.
So much wrong here I can't even bother...
Hopefully the other readers will have picked up on your posting trend and move on without too much consideration.