Weird Shaft Issue

[Mickey Qualls]

Hi all,

Over at my buddy Joe's tonight, he just picked up "Shaft A" (a respectable brand synonymous with pool).

The joint is a 3/8x10 pin.

For kicks, we put Shaft A on three different cues. And here's what we're having trouble trying to figure out...

Shaft A on:
- Mickey's custom - rolls fine
- Joe's custom - considerable wobble, so much that the tip leaves the table
- Mickey's jump butt - rolls fine

Figuring it might be a issue with Joe's cue, Joe and I played butt and shaft roulette for a bit...

- Each owner's shaft and butt together roll fine
- Joe's shaft on Mickey's butt - rolls fine
- Mickey's shaft on Joe's butt - rolls fine
- Mickey's custom shaft on jump butt - rolls fine
- Joe's custom shaft on jump butt - rolls fine

Joe contacted the manufacturer. They want him to send the shaft and his custom butt, and they'll 'match it up'. Joe's a little hesitant to do that just yet.

Why does Shaft A roll with wobble on Joe's custom butt, but any other combination rolls 'true' ?

Input, thoughts, and suggestions are appreciated.

 

[LHP5]

Holy crap, it's like a logic game from the LSAT but in pool terms.

Well, if everyone's shaft rolls fine and true with their own matching butt and the butt of each others custom cue and jump cue, the only real variable is "shaft A". Is the pin of both Mickey's and Joe's cue the same length? Cannot be a facing issue as the other shafts would probably not roll normally either. Can't be a a threading issue in the joint area or pin as its a flat-faced 3/8x10 right? Only real possibility would probably be the pin itself is maybe sitting oddly inside the shaft due to length in Joe's cue? My best guess...

How does shaft A roll on jump butt?

 

[ideologist]

The facing or pin on his butt may be a hair off and the new shaft A is less tolerant of that imperfection.

 

[Shawn Armstrong]

Are all of the joint diameters the same on all of the cues? If the shaft diameter (at the joint) is larger than the butt joint diameter, the cue "rolls" on the shaft, and not the joint. If the butt joint diameter is larger than the shaft joint diameter, the cue rolls on the butt joint only. If the shaft isn't centred on the butt, you can see a wobble. I'd check the fit of all the joints on all of the butts. Also, rolling a cue isn't really an indication of straightness. If you roll a cue with a compound tapered butt, none of them roll straight.

 

[Mickey Qualls]

Thanks for the responses so far...

We did a little more investigating last night, sans caliper.

Mickey's 3/8x10 pin is about 1/8" longer than Joe's pin. The pin on Mickey's jump butt is the same length as Joe's pin.

When Shaft A is on both Mickey's custom and jump butt, there is a very, very slight ridge on one side of the joint, opposite the shaft's logo, where the shaft and butt meet. Smooth enough that with a thumb/finger the ridge is minimal, but will 'catch' your fingernail (if that makes sense).
If someone didn't know about the backstory, they might say that Shaft A is a good fit on Mickey's custom butt (and jump butt).

Shaft A on Joe's butt has a significant ridge at the joint, enough to feel with a thumb/finger. When this ridge (on Joe's butt) is down and on the table (opposite the logo), the tip of Shaft A raises up off the table roughly 1/8"-3/16".

The manufacturer wants Joe to send his custom butt back with Shaft A, and they will 'match it up'.

For Joe's (and my) piece of mind, what will the manufacturer do to this combination to make Shaft A work with his custom butt ?

Input, suggestions, and advice are appreciated...

 

[Sunchaser]

I recommend keeping your shaft away from your friends butt, and vice versa. Sorry...couldn't resist ...but seriously, I agree with ideologist that the tapped shaft tolerances are not exact on the butt in question.

 

[ideologist]

Thanks for the responses so far...

We did a little more investigating last night, sans caliper.

Mickey's 3/8x10 pin is about 1/8" longer than Joe's pin. The pin on Mickey's jump butt is the same length as Joe's pin.

When Shaft A is on both Mickey's custom and jump butt, there is a very, very slight ridge on one side of the joint, opposite the shaft's logo, where the shaft and butt meet. Smooth enough that with a thumb/finger the ridge is minimal, but will 'catch' your fingernail (if that makes sense).
If someone didn't know about the backstory, they might say that Shaft A is a good fit on Mickey's custom butt (and jump butt).

Shaft A on Joe's butt has a significant ridge at the joint, enough to feel with a thumb/finger. When this ridge (on Joe's butt) is down and on the table (opposite the logo), the tip of Shaft A raises up off the table roughly 1/8"-3/16".

The manufacturer wants Joe to send his custom butt back with Shaft A, and they will 'match it up'.

For Joe's (and my) piece of mind, what will the manufacturer do to this combination to make Shaft A work with his custom butt ?

Input, suggestions, and advice are appreciated...

They will face off the joint and probably make sure they are the same diameter through sanding.

 

[playdoubles]

... Joe and I played butt and shaft roulette for a bit...

You know how that sounds...? :rotflmao1::killingme:

 

[Shawn Armstrong]

Thanks for the responses so far...

We did a little more investigating last night, sans caliper.

Mickey's 3/8x10 pin is about 1/8" longer than Joe's pin. The pin on Mickey's jump butt is the same length as Joe's pin.

When Shaft A is on both Mickey's custom and jump butt, there is a very, very slight ridge on one side of the joint, opposite the shaft's logo, where the shaft and butt meet. Smooth enough that with a thumb/finger the ridge is minimal, but will 'catch' your fingernail (if that makes sense).
If someone didn't know about the backstory, they might say that Shaft A is a good fit on Mickey's custom butt (and jump butt).

Shaft A on Joe's butt has a significant ridge at the joint, enough to feel with a thumb/finger. When this ridge (on Joe's butt) is down and on the table (opposite the logo), the tip of Shaft A raises up off the table roughly 1/8"-3/16".

The manufacturer wants Joe to send his custom butt back with Shaft A, and they will 'match it up'.

For Joe's (and my) piece of mind, what will the manufacturer do to this combination to make Shaft A work with his custom butt ?

Input, suggestions, and advice are appreciated...

If that's how poorly the shaft fits on Joe's cue, there is no salvaging the existing shaft. I'd check Joe's cue to see if the pin is centred on the cue. Also, I'd roll or eyeball the butt of Joe's cue to check for a warped butt.

What the shaft company will do is most likely use a blank, and fit a new shaft to the cue. I look for existing problems beforehand, though. I had a Carolina cue I bought directly from them. The joint pin was not installed centred. So badly so that any other shaft except the Carolina shaft would roll crooked on the cue. Your friend may have the same problem. Happens a lot more often in custom cues than one would think.

 

[hang-the-9]

The facing or pin on his butt may be a hair off and the new shaft A is less tolerant of that imperfection.

Winner ^^^

 

[stevekur1]

the original shaft for Joe's cue was made for that cue, so the cacing on the shaft matches the butt.

the new aftermarket shaft was not made exactly for that cue, so the facing will not be perfect causing the wobble.

i have the same problem when i add the "Balance Rite" cue extender to my cues.

-Steve