What do y'all think of Bert Kinister's videos?

What do you think of Bert's videos?

  • They're awesome

    Votes: 15 27.3%
  • They used to be awesome, but they've gone downhill

    Votes: 7 12.7%
  • They've always been a mixed bag

    Votes: 29 52.7%
  • They all suck

    Votes: 4 7.3%

  • Total voters
    55

CreeDo

Fargo Rating 597
Silver Member
Sorry if this has been posted already, I'm sure BK gets some discussion here. I've watched a few and it's a mixed bag. Some drills are excellent, and I haven't seen them anywhere else. A few are great but just derived from old and well known drills. Others are... bleh.

One of the recent videos I watched was pretty bad. There was 0 camera work, he didn't explain the rules or specific goals of the drill, and it was just 45 minutes of watching Feijin run through the drill while they chatted and joked with each other. He forgot to turn on the sound during the intro and could easily have reshot it in 5-10 minutes but doesn't bother. I get the impression he started out with a real desire to teach (and no idea whether or not the videos would help him make a living) but after doing a bunch of them, he just got kinda lazy about it and doesn't care, like maybe now he's just crapping them out to refresh his bank account.

Then again it's possible he doesn't explain much on the later videos because after 40 or 50 tapes, the viewer is assumed to 'know the drill' so to speak.

Still, I like the older tapes where he earnestly explains what you're doing and how it's gonna help you, and he uses real students instead of a godly pro who makes it look like you should be finishing the drill every other attempt (when in reality, some of these drills you should be thrilled to get 1 in 5). To his credit, on one tape he does point out 'see, even a world class player can dog this and make the same mistakes you and I do'.

He also seems to be able to practice what he preaches, doing the stated goal himself on seemingly the first or second try without retakes.

So what's the verdict?

I'm inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt even if one or two videos were real letdowns. If you know ahead of time which videos are winners (like the safety ones) and which are losers (the shrinking rectangle of pain) then you're making a good investment.
 
Credeo, you've made a fair assessment of his work.

I think Kinister is a wild man, but in a good way. I've always felt that you have to listen to what he says, not how he says it.

Sure it's presentation can seem a bit grassroots local yokel for some tastes.

Nonetheless, he definitely has put in the time, has serous credentials as an instructor, and has put some really good stuff out there. Even in a few of them are duds. Lets face it; there's not a whole lot of guys out there doing this kind of stuff, and even less who should be.
 
looking a gift horse in the mouth

I was fortunate enough to win twenty of them in the raffle. They were fantastic for free or even the twenty bucks I believe I put up for the AZB room, not caring if I won anything or not.

I viewed video's from very old to the newest and they seemed to indeed be a mixed bag. However, some video's will be more useful to some than others and I have noticed that video's that I viewed when I was tired or in one frame of mind and called useless actually contain valuable information when watched again.

Some of his video's have a great deal of useful information, some have only a nugget or two. Of the twenty I chose, I don't think any are totally without value if you want to improve your game.

Hu
 
Ding Dong Daddy!

I wish he would quit saying that ;)


I have about 50 of his videos I think...well alot of them anyways... Some are good, others are not so good...


Still worth it to me. I think any instructional material is worth readong/viewing. If you read/view all of them, you can combine all the little secrets they let out and actually learn something...


Somebody needs to make a video of secret info that all top players know but never share...
 
I voted mixed bag. Most I have seen are excellent, but a few seemed a little pointless. Sometimes e seems to stretch a series out to one tape to many.

Right now I am working on the "short/middle/long game" series. I really think these are the best set of tapes I have ever seen. I have watched each several times and have been working on the drills each night as recommended. I really thing these are helping my position and pattern play. As the phrase goes, "if you buy just three pool videos this year get the short/middle/long game videos" (the "putting it all together" can be skipped in my honest and worthless opinion.)
 
That's a useful recommendation actually, cuz I was prolly gonna check out putting it all together at some point, and short-middle-long game didn't sound very sexy so I had no immediate plans to look at them. Now I will.

He has some funny verbal tics. I can't stand when he says "that's not bad" like four times in a row. But I can tell he'd be a really fun guy to work with.
I also get a laugh when he wanders off into some weird tangent. At the end of one tape he stops talking about the subject of the tape and suddenly goes out of his way to say how black players don't get the recognition they deserve, and how in black pool rooms there's never any fussing or fighting, and they're always gentlemen and sportsmanlike, and one time a black guy busted him with safeties, etc etc (all of which can be true but still it was really weird how he decided to start talking about it. For my money I'd rather see 5-10 more minutes of useful info than hear him jabber on).
 
mthornto said:
I voted mixed bag. Most I have seen are excellent, but a few seemed a little pointless. Sometimes e seems to stretch a series out to one tape to many.

Right now I am working on the "short/middle/long game" series. I really think these are the best set of tapes I have ever seen. I have watched each several times and have been working on the drills each night as recommended. I really thing these are helping my position and pattern play. As the phrase goes, "if you buy just three pool videos this year get the short/middle/long game videos" (the "putting it all together" can be skipped in my honest and worthless opinion.)

His short game tape is friggin' awesome. I have been practicing some of those patterns to improve for many years now.
 
Oh Boy!

Well I am probably going to get shot for saying this, but I have had the opportunity to watch his tapes. Or should I say been miss fortunate to watch his tapes?

Now I know that Bert is a great player, and what he is trying to do is help people. I get that, but I think his presentation on any of the videos I have watch lacks a little to be desired. In other words I think he should stick to individual lessons, or playing. There is good information in some of his videos, but he doesn't present it well on tape.

Can you imagine someone brand new to pool trying to understand what he is talking about, let alone trying to duplicate it? There aren't enough examples or explanations in his videos. He just say something and goes up and shoots it. He doesn't care if the audio is good, or the camera angle or anything. So he might tell you what he is doing, but you don't actually get to see it!

In my mind this would hurt many new pool players, but that is just my thoughts on it.

I think there is good material in some of his videos, but I still believe they are presented wrong.

Maybe he just wanted to see himself in a video or something, or maybe money has something to do with it?

I have also seen some others like Joe Tucker and Buddy Hall. I must say that Joe explains himself a lot better, and has multiple diagrams and examples. A beginning pool player wouldn't have any problem understanding what he is trying to explain. Even Buddy Hall explains himself better.

Can't say the same for Bert cause it looks like he just sets the camera on a tripod and then BS his way through it! Glad I didn't have to pay to see any of his videos! :eek:
 
Yeah, he definitely does seem to BS his way through a lot of them. You maybe had the bad luck to catch the shoddy ones. In a few of them he explains what you're doing and supposed to be trying pretty well. I don't think any aspiring player would have trouble understanding his safety video or the mighty X. I also think the hanger video was pretty informative but maybe it would have stumped me if I were still a beginner.

But anyway, you're right, the presentation kills it. In some videos he has multiple camera angles and one of them tracks the cueball, and in other videos it's just a home camera mounted on a tripod that never moves. He looks like he can afford to make a sort of studio room for his pool table, but instead he's in a rec room or basement, and it's cluttered and distracting, and he's always complaining it's 115 degrees. He has made it to a point where his videos are the most popular instructional series, he should reinvest some of the money into making the next videos perfect, with a studio and multiple cameras and good sound and lighting, plus maybe people to help with commentary, people who can re-shoot and splice the footage, etc. The later videos are somehow less professional than the earlier ones, wtf?
 
Nicer

CreeDo said:
Yeah, he definitely does seem to BS his way through a lot of them. You maybe had the bad luck to catch the shoddy ones. In a few of them he explains what you're doing and supposed to be trying pretty well. I don't think any aspiring player would have trouble understanding his safety video or the mighty X. I also think the hanger video was pretty informative but maybe it would have stumped me if I were still a beginner.

But anyway, you're right, the presentation kills it. In some videos he has multiple camera angles and one of them tracks the cueball, and in other videos it's just a home camera mounted on a tripod that never moves. He looks like he can afford to make a sort of studio room for his pool table, but instead he's in a rec room or basement, and it's cluttered and distracting, and he's always complaining it's 115 degrees. He has made it to a point where his videos are the most popular instructional series, he should reinvest some of the money into making the next videos perfect, with a studio and multiple cameras and good sound and lighting, plus maybe people to help with commentary, people who can re-shoot and splice the footage, etc. The later videos are somehow less professional than the earlier ones, wtf?


You said it a lot more nice than I did, but you are exactly right!
 
Breakin' 'em Down

I took the time to Categorize the Kinister videos I have seen into three categories. They are : 1) Great Info, worth the investment for all skill levels. 2) Good info, worth the investment for intermediate players and below (some golden nuggets for all). 3) Poor. not worth the investment.


Category 1)

Video 1: "The 60 minute workout" *****

Video 6: "Using the 6 pointed Star" ****

Video 8: "Using the 9 pointed Star" ****

Video 12: "The Mighty X" *****

Video 20: "The Advanced 60 minute workout" ****

Video 35: "The Short Game" ****

Video 36: "The Middle Game" ****

Video 37: "The Long Game" ****

VIdeo 45: "The Rectangle of Doom" ****

Video 46: "Pro Shotmaking Drills Part 1" ****

Video 53 "8 & 9" Ball execution 101" *** 1/2



Category 2)


Video 2: "Run out 9-ball" ***

Video 3: "Secret 9-ball Knowledge" **

Video 5: "Building the 6 pointed Star" **

Video 7 "Building the interior of the Star" **

Video 11 "Advanced Fundamentals" ** 1/2

Video 14 "The Big Bang" **

Video 18 "The Shotmakers Workout" ***

Video 19 "The Deflection Tape" **

Video 22 "Aim to Win & Basic 1 pocket" ***

Video 23 "Intermediate 1 pocket" ***

Video 26 Winning 1 Pocket" ***

Video 30 "It's a Hanger" ***

Video 38 "Putting it all together" ***

Video 41 "Problems & Solutions for 9-ball" **

Video 47 "Pro Shotmaking part 2" ** 1/2

Video 55 "Secrets to Long, Hard Shots" ***

Video 56 "Secrets of Shotmaking" **



Category 3)


Video 48 "The Soft Break in 9-ball" *

Video 49 "Bank your way to improved concentration" *

Video 50 "Secrets of 8 & 9 Ball patterns" 0


These are the Ones I have seen and my opinion of them.

If anyone has seen Video 60 "The $100.00 Video" I would like to have your opinion on it. I have not seen it. If it was one of his earlier releases I would have gotten it for sure.

THanks and I hope this list is helpful to some.
 
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