Whats the next step?

Southpaw

Southpaw

Swing away, Meril....
Silver Member
Just curious as to what everyone thinks the next step should be if no one is paid by the time the next IPT event starts.....Can players seek legal action? (even though I'm sure not all of the players report tourney winnings as income...) What are their options to seek retribution?

Southpaw
 
There are none, the IPT can legally fold and the players will be screwed.

What they should do is unite and demand prize money be held in an Escrow account.

What will probably happen, as alluded to in another thread, is KT will offer some type of installments plan.
 
The players should all unite and form a gang to hunt down KT. When they find him , they should tap his forehead with the 5 ball repeatedly until he whips out his checkbook. After he writes a few checks, they should make him read "Natural Cures" aloud while they take turns chalking his back with the sharpened end of a high end Paul Mottey Cue. If this doesn't make him repent and see that he errored and change his ways, then I guess they have no choice but to resume their road trips and regional tour events.
 
I just posted something very similiar to this in another thread, but because I really do think that this is important information for anyone owed money from the IPT/KT, I am posting it here as well.

Although I still hope that everyone gets paid what they are owed voluntarily, at this point I would suggest that anyone owed money by these entities consult with their personal attorneys. I believe that monies awarded or judgements granted by the courts are paid on a first filed, first paid basis, so iit may make a good amount of sense to not let too much time pass before doing so.

It can also be a benefit to do so before the debtor files for insolvency or bankruptcy.

Filing a suit for non-payment is also withdrawable if you are eventually paid or settle. Good luck to all.

This is NOT legal advice.
 
Since it all happened in Reno I would imagine that any action would have to take place in Reno. Just my best guess.

Stop in and have a talk with the local States Attorney. he is the voice of the people and can tell you if there are criminal charges that he can persue if he gets a complaint.

The other side is civil suit. Depending on how much is lost you might be able to go to small claims court.

Or you can hire an attorney.

I personally would just wait since it has only been 18 days. In fact I would wait and see what Charlie Williams is going to do. He has a lot of legal minds there on the UPA that can advise him. Wait and see what they tell him to do.

Jake

I am no attorney and I haven't stayed at a Holiday Inn for a long time. And truth be known I don't know squat what you should do. I'm just glad that I am not in your position.
 
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Hi again jimmyg. We have exchanged similar views in the other thread you referred to.
<<so iit may make a good amount of sense to not let too much time pass before doing so. It can also be a benefit to do so before the debtor files for insolvency or bankruptcy.>>

Having been a creditor in a bankruptcy matter I can tell you for a fact that there is NO priority between unsecured creditors as a class...they are all treated the same...and clearly the players would be unsecured creditors in any bankruptcy action.

As a matter of fact, it might be wise for players NOT to file suits on the theory that if the IPT doesn't pay it would file for bankruptcy voluntarily or be forced into it by any two or more creditors. If that were to happen then ALL existing suits would be halted under the "automatic stay" in the bankruptcy court and would essentially become history...except that the legal fees associated with the civil matter would be flushed down the drain.

So, with respect for your views, being first in a civil matter might be a waste of time and money. Remember, the "pioneer" is often the guy with the arrows in his back!
Regards,
Jim
 
av84fun said:
Hi again jimmyg. We have exchanged similar views in the other thread you referred to.
<<so iit may make a good amount of sense to not let too much time pass before doing so. It can also be a benefit to do so before the debtor files for insolvency or bankruptcy.>>

Having been a creditor in a bankruptcy matter I can tell you for a fact that there is NO priority between unsecured creditors as a class...they are all treated the same...and clearly the players would be unsecured creditors in any bankruptcy action.

As a matter of fact, it might be wise for players NOT to file suits on the theory that if the IPT doesn't pay it would file for bankruptcy voluntarily or be forced into it by any two or more creditors. If that were to happen then ALL existing suits would be halted under the "automatic stay" in the bankruptcy court and would essentially become history...except that the legal fees associated with the civil matter would be flushed down the drain.

So, with respect for your views, being first in a civil matter might be a waste of time and money. Remember, the "pioneer" is often the guy with the arrows in his back!
Regards,
Jim
Click to expand...

For the reasons I stated above, (or in the other thread, I don't remember) I think the players might actually be behind unsecured creditors in line. At best they are employees and at worst partners. Even if they are independent contractors, I don't think they'll fare well if the IPT goes into bankruptcy. Basically, if KT has treated them as partners or investors, which he may very well have if he's talking about sponsorship revenue sharing and profit sharing....then they are not considered creditors at all. They would be splitting the proceeds after all the creditors were paid off. The odds of being paid anything in that scenario are very slim.

The legal philosophy is that why should the players, who have really given nothing but time and expenses, be ahead of creditors and vendors who have suffered material damages from the bankruptcy. Legally, they shouldn't profit from the spoils of a failed business at the expense of people who have suffered losses.

I know that is going to raise some hackles, but I'm just trying to explain the law as I understand it.

Cheers,
RC
 
av84fun said:
Hi again jimmyg. We have exchanged similar views in the other thread you referred to.
<<so iit may make a good amount of sense to not let too much time pass before doing so. It can also be a benefit to do so before the debtor files for insolvency or bankruptcy.>>

Having been a creditor in a bankruptcy matter I can tell you for a fact that there is NO priority between unsecured creditors as a class...they are all treated the same...and clearly the players would be unsecured creditors in any bankruptcy action.

As a matter of fact, it might be wise for players NOT to file suits on the theory that if the IPT doesn't pay it would file for bankruptcy voluntarily or be forced into it by any two or more creditors. If that were to happen then ALL existing suits would be halted under the "automatic stay" in the bankruptcy court and would essentially become history...except that the legal fees associated with the civil matter would be flushed down the drain.

So, with respect for your views, being first in a civil matter might be a waste of time and money. Remember, the "pioneer" is often the guy with the arrows in his back!
Regards,
Jim
Click to expand...
Jim, Yes, it might be a waste of time, but I'd rather be the first to file a lawsuit than, perhaps, the one hundreth. Pioneers may often be the one's with the arrows in their backs:) , but they also get first pick at the prime land and the Chief's daughters:D .

Seriously, at this stage, I would certainly place the IPT on official notice and document their debt to me. I would let them know of my intentions to file legal action unless I heard from them with an offer of resolution within a reasonable period of time. If there was still no official contact from the IPT, with either a promise to pay or an attempt to negotiate the debt, I would definitely file a lawsuit. If KT wants to continue the tour, I would not allow him to do so at my, and the other player's, expense. If he does not intend on paying the players, either if full or part, then he should be forced into backruptcy. Why should he be permitted to continue a pryamid scheme and find a new group of players to do the same thing thing to?

And if he does intend to continue the tour he will be happy to resolve these issues before lawsuits are actually filed. That's the course of action that I would follow.

I don't think that things look very good for the players and I really feel for their loss, not just the money, but the dream and the future. Good luck to all.
 
If I was in this mess I believe I would be in contact with the players I knew who won more than 10K and see what they were doing. Did they contact an attorney? How about Rodney, what is he doing? I'm sure that Rocky (Rodney's sponsor) knows an attorney or two.

At the very least I would open up the yellow pages and contact an attorney and make an appointment to discuss this matter. At least that way I would know where I stood legally and what kind of action I could take. The first visit with the attorney most likely would be free, or just a nominal fee. He might tell me that I have absolutely no legal standing, or that his expenses would eat up anything that I might recover. And what state must the action be filed in? Reno, Illinois, or the home state? A real bag of worms. And of couse since the attorney does not want to be in your same state of affairs he will want his payment up front.

What is really surprising is that there is no response at all from any of the players as to what action they will take. Are all of them playing the waiting game? Or do they know something that the rest of us don't.

Has anyone contacted Charlie Williams. What are his attorneys telling him about his options. I'm sure there are some smart minds in the UPA. Now is the time to use them.

I doubt that Ewa, Allison or Earl will just roll over and forget about it. Earl did fight for his million dollars. Maybe he is ready for another fight.

Jake
 
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I don't think there will be a "next step".

2007 & 2008 tournaments are possibly fictitious.

Honesty is always an open situation. Silence is most always followed by bad news. Anyway, who among us would trust this situation again? Big time MEDIA & ADVERTISERS won't ever be a part of this, they have been warned offhandedly.

KT & company saw the handwriting on the wall when the attendance to these extravaganzas was pitiful. No coverage by the media, about the winners & the lavish sites spelled disaster for me.

Imagine the 6 o'clock news picking up the story or Sports Illustrated doing a feature story & adding a monthly column. Anytime the media gets involved, money follows.

We've all watched trouble brew from Bernie's tournaments, how long did it take for that scene to be leveled. Now we've all been setup by a "billionaire in a suit". Scams come in all sizes, this one must seem like a WHOPPER to the Players.
 
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