Which spot would you pick, and why?

[jsp]

9 ball race to 9 racks, which bet would you pick? Getting the 8 on all racks, or playing each rack even but getting one rack on the wire? Assume your opponent is slightly better than you, such that on average you would win 8 racks for every 9 racks your opponent wins.

I would guess which bet you pick is dependent on your skill level. If you're an A player and your opponent is an A+ player, I doubt getting the 8 is as significant, since both of you would run out a wide open table easily. If that were the case, I would choose one rack on the wire.

However, if you're a C player and your opponent is a C+ player (if there is such a thing), I think spotting the 8 would be much more advantageous, cuz there's no guarantee that you'll finish your run if the 7, 8, and 9 are left on the table.

Just want to know what some of you experienced gamblers would choose and why. (If you can't tell, I have never gambled.)

 

[macguy]

9 ball race to 9 racks, which bet would you pick? Getting the 8 on all racks, or playing each rack even but getting one rack on the wire? Assume your opponent is slightly better than you, such that on average you would win 8 racks for every 9 racks your opponent wins.

I would guess which bet you pick is dependent on your skill level. If you're an A player and your opponent is an A+ player, I doubt getting the 8 is as significant, since both of you would run out a wide open table easily. If that were the case, I would choose one rack on the wire.

However, if you're a C player and your opponent is a C+ player (if there is such a thing), I think spotting the 8 would be much more advantageous, cuz there's no guarantee that you'll finish your run if the 7, 8, and 9 are left on the table.

Just want to know what some of you experienced gamblers would choose and why. (If you can't tell, I have never gambled.)

Without trying to do some complicated calculation, I always prefer giving up games on the wire rather then like the 6 or 7 or what ever. It seems to be, for me anyway, easier. You are just down a few games no big deal it happens all the time anyway as opposed to the guy having extra money balls he can do something with at any time. I always try to negotiate little bit longer sets because it's to my advantage. Also often once you catch up and even up the score the guy seems to fade a little. I once had a guy beat me 13 in a row making one of his three money balls either on the break or a combo without me getting a shot. In 20 minutes he got back all the money that had taken me five hours to grind out.

 

[BigRed]

I would definately take the ball.... The one game in a fairly long race is too easy to overcome.

 

[Craig Fales]

Without trying to do some complicated calculation, I always prefer giving up games on the wire rather then like the 6 or 7 or what ever. It seems to be, for me anyway, easier. You are just down a few games no big deal it happens all the time anyway as opposed to the guy having extra money balls he can do something with at any time. I always try to negotiate little bit longer sets because it's to my advantage. Also often once you catch up and even up the score the guy seems to fade a little. I once had a guy beat me 13 in a row making one of his three money balls either on the break or a combo without me getting a shot. In 20 minutes he got back all the money that had taken me five hours to grind out.

If I'm spotting anyone balls, I tell them they can only be made after the break....
________

 

[Mike Templeton]

I would definately take the ball.... The one game in a fairly long race is too easy to overcome.

I agree with Big Red. If he wins the first game, then you are playing even the rest of the match. If you take the 8, you are starting even, but getting weight every game of the match.

Mike

 

[macguy]

If I'm spotting anyone balls, I tell them they can only be made after the break....

They were wild on the break thats how we were playing. The guy was not all that good a player and he needed the balls to be wild for us to play. It was the 6 and 7 but the whole time we played it was just remarkable how many time he made the balls out of order during the session beside the barrage at one point making them on the break. We both quit even a few hours later and were mutually tired of the game. He wasn't used to playing such long sets, we played around eight hours and I was tired of watching him luck balls in.

 

[Egg McDogit]

it's easier for b/c players to give games on the wire than money ball spots

However, if you're a C player and your opponent is a C+ player (if there is such a thing), I think spotting the 8 would be much more advantageous, cuz there's no guarantee that you'll finish your run if the 7, 8, and 9 are left on the table.

Just want to know what some of you experienced gamblers would choose and why. (If you can't tell, I have never gambled.)

 

[Snapshot9]

Thoughts ...

I think it would be more like 2 or 3 games on the wire rather than 1, and if you are playing an A player or above, always take the games on the wire,
because out of a set, you may get to shoot the 7 or 8 maybe 2 or 3 times,
and there is no guarantee you will make them, so the games on the wire are better because they are 'Sure Wins'.

 

[sjm]

On very tight equipment, the eight is worth more than a game on the wire. On very loose equipment, it's probably worth less. Hence, there is insufficient information to judge.

 

[JoeyInCali]

I'd take the 8-ball anytime against a player slightly better than I am.

 

[frankncali]

On very tight equipment, the eight is worth more than a game on the wire. On very loose equipment, it's probably worth less. Hence, there is insufficient information to judge.

I would think that on any table that the wild 8 would be worth more than
1 game in a race to nine. Some people really know how to make that
one extra ball come into play and can utilize it to take the opponnet
off their normal game.
Over a nine game race I would that the player would have more chances to make up for being one game down compared to how many chances the
8 might come into play.

I once broke even with a guy for several sessions. He joked once that I needed to spot him the 8 for him to win. I said I would if he would give me the same wild 8. Strange game but I won three straight sessions.
I tried to use it against him all i could. Not so much in caroms and combos but with kicks and possible combos. I think it threw him off a little.

 

[CaptiveBred]

I'd take a game before the 8 unless it was wild.

Getting the 8 is no big deal since combos and caroms don't come up often enough to assure you an extra W. At least with the game o the wire, you are guaranteed the extra win. Whereas, the 8 would require a slop, combo, or carom to be advantageous. If I can get to the 8, I most likely, will get to the 9.

 

[Godfather]

Bill Cress used to tell me that as far as ball weight is concerned, if a person is good enough to get out when he's supposed to, he can give up almost any weight. And if a person isn't good enough to get out when he should, he can't give up any ball weight. Other champs have said that they would much prefer the game on the wire, as that is a sure thing and the ball weight might never come up. In a match-up of two strong players, the game is bigger and two weak players, the eight is huge, depending on how weak they are.

 

[jsp]

Bill Cress used to tell me that as far as ball weight is concerned, if a person is good enough to get out when he's supposed to, he can give up almost any weight. And if a person isn't good enough to get out when he should, he can't give up any ball weight. Other champs have said that they would much prefer the game on the wire, as that is a sure thing and the ball weight might never come up. In a match-up of two strong players, the game is bigger and two weak players, the eight is huge, depending on how weak they are.

My thoughts exactly. For strong players, I've always felt that ball weight is a phantom advantage, as in what seems to be an advantage really isn't a significant advantage at all.

Just watch a professional 9ball match, and observe the outcome. Then rewatch the match and keep score as if one opponent is spotted the 7 or 8. I doubt that the match results would be siginifcantly different at all.

 

[macguy]

I'd take a game before the 8 unless it was wild.

Getting the 8 is no big deal since combos and caroms don't come up often enough to assure you an extra W. At least with the game o the wire, you are guaranteed the extra win. Whereas, the 8 would require a slop, combo, or carom to be advantageous. If I can get to the 8, I most likely, will get to the 9.

It comes up often that you can make one ball but not get on the next. I.E. you end up straight in or shooting off a rail and can't do anything with the cueball. In those cases just having to make the 8 and you win is a lot. It is a shorter run out as well in general. It's of more value then just you can luck it in or make a combo, you can just cinch the 8 and you win. you can have layouts with three balls left on the table and it could be hard to get out even with ball in hand, it's nice to not have to run them all.

 

[macguy]

If I'm spotting anyone balls, I tell them they can only be made after the break....

If you are giving someone the 8 then it has to be wild all the time or you are not really giving them the 8 but something less.

 

[mapman72]

Getting the 8 is no big deal...

I couldn't disagree with you more. The eight ball, called or not is a huge spot. So many people say, "well, the eight's nothing because if i'm good enough to get to the eight, i'm going to make the nine." Look at how many times in your life you have failed to get shape on the 8 ball and had to pull a difficult shot. That's fine when you're getting the eight ball, cause it's just a difficult shot and you bare down and make it. But if you fail to get shape on the eight with the nine after it, then you have problems my friend. You have to now make a difficult shot on the eight while getting shape on the nine. And this doesn't even include the times you totally tank position on the nine, dog the nine, or get on the wrong side of the eight ball during your run out. IMO, anyone who takes the 1 game on the wire to a race to 9 over the 8, called or not, is just crazy.

In addition to what I said above, piggy backing on an earlier post as well, once the once game advantage is gone, then your spot is gone. If you're shooting against someone slightly better and getting the eight, you can conceivably be down 3 or 4 games early and still be confident you can come back. But if you're down 5-1 against someone who plays better with no spot per game, you might as well get ready for the next set - and hopefully renegotiate.

 

[jsp]

I couldn't disagree with you more. The eight ball, called or not is a huge spot. So many people say, "well, the eight's nothing because if i'm good enough to get to the eight, i'm going to make the nine." Look at how many times in your life you have failed to get shape on the 8 ball and had to pull a difficult shot...

I agree with what you're saying to an extent. I would definitely prefer the 8 ball spot if I was the one playing. That's because I'm not a professional player, and it's definitely not a given that I can runout the last 3 balls on the table. I'm just arguing that professionals, or very good players, spotting the 8 is somewhat a negligible advantage.

In addition to what I said above, piggy backing on an earlier post as well, once the once game advantage is gone, then your spot is gone.

This argument doesn't make much logical sense to me. Your one game spot doesn't go away, it's always there. Your opponent still has to win one more game than you have to. What if the race was only to 3? Or what if you have a 5 game spot? Can you still say that once your opponent strings 5 racks on you at the start, then your spot is gone?

Thanks to all who have replied. From your posts, I don't think my opinion has changed from what I originally posted.

 

[erikido]

I'd take a game before the 8 unless it was wild.

Getting the 8 is no big deal since combos and caroms don't come up often enough to assure you an extra W. At least with the game o the wire, you are guaranteed the extra win. Whereas, the 8 would require a slop, combo, or carom to be advantageous. If I can get to the 8, I most likely, will get to the 9.

Completely agree. I will take a game over the 8...probably even if it were wild.

 

[Bustah360]

If you're an intermediate to advanced player then you'd want your opponent to have games on the wire. If you're a beginner, then you'd want spot balls, due to it giving you at least 2 game balls every single rack. The more advanced player can easily run a rack or two and end up playing the opponent even up for the rest of the set. I'm a C player in the tri-state circuit and I sure as hell would rather have the 7 or 8 ball spot for a race to 7 or more on every rack rather than give the A or B player 2 or 3 more racks to run. I know they'd do that easily on any spread table.