Who Makes Good Hit Radial Pin Cue/Butt?

[Bavafongoul]

Then how do you explain pro's adding ton of weight at the back end of their butts, i.e. "butt extensions" this alone I think contradict all of what you said? I am not saying you're wrong, but hey they're playing flawlessly.

Gosh, dunno what to write other than I do not know that to be the actual trend line with pros but I am basing my
opinion on the many discussions I’ve had with cue makers, some of whom are famous for their great craftsmanship.

Every cue maker I conversed with, and our discussions were not just a few minutes of quick conversation, stated the
importance of matching shaft wood with a cue butt underway. One of these cue makers actually said he wouldn’t build
a cue any other way even if a client requested it. He’d rather not bother building any cue when it’s not constructed right.

 

[7stud]

This comment of yours is very interesting to me, I don't obviously know what you know but here I am trying to know it if that makes any sense.

You say to figure out the weight of the butt you want, then try to figure the weight of the shaft in relation to the butt and that there is a certain preferable ratio? now is this ratio for everybody? Now to add complexity to the question even further, what happens if a guy use the mid-section extension, CueMax or Balance rite, these things come as 2 inch to 3 inches and add some weight in the middle of the cue which also gives you a feeling of a sort of forward-balance, now does this adds to the ratio equation or not?

Yes, because the balance point is below the joint. So, adding weight to the shaft end of the seesaw, when employing a mid-cue extension, makes the cue more forward balanced. Conversely, adding a weight bolt to the butt end of the seesaw, moves the balance point closer to the butt. Also, butt extensions seem to be popular, which moves the balance point towards the butt of the cue.

I surmise that most people are probably used to butt heavy cues because when they order their first cue, they probably order a low to mid priced cue or a Predator that is 18 ounces without a weight bolt, and then they add 1.0-2.0 ounces of weight to the butt to get the cue weight they like, which ends up moving the balance point towards the butt. I'm unsure whether Predator and the like anticipate that and therefore build cues that have a more forward balance point (lighter butt), so that after a customer adds the weight bolt the cue is more evenly balanced. I've read that in the old days with slow cloth and 9-12' tables, a cue that was weighted toward the butt was preferred because it gave the player more power, while with today's slick cloth and shorter tables, power isn't needed as much so balance points have moved forward to give a player more touch. As far as I can tell, today's custom cues generally have a balance point in the 18.5-19.75 range.

 

[sonoman]

So, I have read so many good comments about Chris Nitti's cues I just ordered a shaft from him. I am putting it on one of my Josey butts.
Chris is matching my ring work, putting on a sniper tip and making the shaft 12.75mm where shaft meets ferrule. Other than that I told him I wanted his taper, joint, ferrule material and his standard length ferrule. He quoted a fair price and delivery time. Excited to check it out.

 

[hang-the-9]

Then how do you explain pro's adding ton of weight at the back end of their butts, i.e. "butt extensions" this alone I think contradict all of what you said? I am not saying you're wrong, but hey they're playing flawlessly.

They were playing the same way before they added all the weight and length. I don't think there has been any rank changes due to changing of equipment. It's the same 10 players in the quarterfinals of the tournaments, it's the same 40 players in the top 16. The way they aim should not change due to the weight or balance change, from talking to some of the people that went to the longer/heavier cue is that it helps them shoot off the rail and over a ball better, it guides the cue in a straighter line.

 

[Bavafongoul]

I am simply sharing my opinion which coincides and directly reflects the conversations I have had with
over a dozen really top notch cue makers, one of whom has a 10 year waiting list for new cue orders.

Extensions and extra weight added in the butt are manifestations of changing a cue to conform to the
preferences, or perhaps peculiarities, of the player. Lots of players just rely on a bridge for long shots
and down through the years have fared incredibly well. What I shared was connected to building a cue
and how the really great cue makers have built cues down through the decades. All of the great names
in cue making I know adhered to this incldg. Rambow, Balabushka, Sazamboti to today’s contemporary
cue makers. When the weight of the shaft gets mismatched with the weight of the butt, tactile feel suffers.
That’s what I learned, believe and had every cue I ordered to be made & even pre-owned cues I purchased.

 

[brilliance]

Josey, all his cues I come across are perfect.

 

[pwd72s]

Josey, all his cues I come across are perfect.

Shhhhh. If the worst happened to my Josey, I'd probably have to wait 2 years for him to build another. At age 77, I might not have those years.

Only sort of kidding here.

 

[14.1'er]

The cue butt is important in terms of construction. If you want a cue butt that weighs 14.75 ozs.,
what diameter do you want, is there a wrap, any design to it such as rings or inlays, any weight
bolt, how much does it weigh, where is it placed, or was the butt completed sans any weight bolt?

Why would you want to specify a weight for the cue butt and specify if it uses a weight bolt? When
you can anticipate the weight of the cue shaft you want to match with the butt, you wind up with a
cue that has the balance ratio you want. The weight ratios of the shaft and butt are very important.

Can you expound on you specific butt to shaft ratio? For me I like a butt approximately 15.0oz paired with a 4.0oz shaft, or as close as possible.

This gives me a cue with the perfect balance for me. Curious what others like, or do most not care?

 

[j2pac]

I have no idea why, but Radial pin cues just feel / hit different / better in my experience.

It's because you're wearing womens underwear. Today was your lucky day bub. I usually charge $12.50 for those pearls.

 

[j2pac]

Then how do you explain pro's adding ton of weight at the back end of their butts, i.e. "butt extensions" this alone I think contradict all of what you said? I am not saying you're wrong, but hey they're playing flawlessly.

Those same pros will also make sure that the front end adjustments necessary for a "proper" cue balance, are made.

 

[songj2096]

Can you expound on you specific butt to shaft ratio? For me I like a butt approximately 15.0oz paired with a 4.0oz shaft, or as close as possible.

This gives me a cue with the perfect balance for me. Curious what others like, or do most not care?

I care the weight combination more than cue maker or how it looks. My personal preference is 15.2-15.4oz butt paired with 3.8oz-4oz shaft, total weight around 19.2oz. I like SW cue a lot, but most their butt weight is around 16oz, which is not playable for me.

 

[14.1'er]

I care the weight combination more than cue maker or how it looks. My personal preference is 15.2-15.4oz butt paired with 3.8oz-4oz shaft, total weight around 19.2oz. I like SW cue a lot, but most their butt weight is around 16oz, which is not playable for me.

That is the exact weight combination of my current player, and it about perfect. It's the weight ratio I've always preferred. On a super fast table, I can bring the butt weight down to 14.5 with a 4.0 shaft for 18.5 total, and be good. The shaft always needs to be 4.0 with no insert though. A lighter shaft to me is too light, and weak. Also a 4.0 shaft paired with a butt weight as above gives the cue a nice forward balance without a steel joint. I prefer this especially when shooting off the rail. I'm guess I'm kinda anal when it comes to my cues weight, and weight ratio. This is one reason I only buy in person, or online from a seller I trust completely to give me the true cue specs. It took me a long time to find my current player in these exact specs, and the maker, and design I was searching for. It actually took a few years without actually ordering from the maker. Yeah, I'm a PITA, ... Like you, I love SW, but it's very hard trying to find one that's not butt heavy. I had a beautiful Kersenbrock about 25 years ago in these specs, and kick myself all the time for letting it go. It was a Birdseye Merry Widow, and played lights out.

I'm willing to bet most players don't know what their preferred ratio is, or the weight ratio of their playing cue is.

 

[Cornerman]

For the OP,

Best bang for the buck - Dale Perry.

Other than that, just about every competent cuemaker anymore can make a great playing butt . The only radial-pin cur that I’ve played with that didn’t feel good had something wrong with the shaft.

 

[Tony_in_MD]

That is the exact weight combination of my current player, and it about perfect. It's the weight ratio I've always preferred. On a super fast table, I can bring the butt weight down to 14.5 with a 4.0 shaft for 18.5 total, and be good. The shaft always needs to be 4.0 with no insert though. A lighter shaft to me is too light, and weak. Also a 4.0 shaft paired with a butt weight as above gives the cue a nice forward balance without a steel joint. I prefer this especially when shooting off the rail. I'm guess I'm kinda anal when it comes to my cues weight, and weight ratio. This is one reason I only buy in person, or online from a seller I trust completely to give me the true cue specs. It took me a long time to find my current player in these exact specs, and the maker, and design I was searching for. It actually took a few years without actually ordering from the maker. Yeah, I'm a PITA, ... Like you, I love SW, but it's very hard trying to find one that's not butt heavy. I had a beautiful Kersenbrock about 25 years ago in these specs, and kick myself all the time for letting it go. It was a Birdseye Merry Widow, and played lights out.

I'm willing to bet most players don't know what their preferred ratio is, or the weight ratio of their playing cue is.

Well we just don't know, we also don't care.

 

[14.1'er]

Well we just don't know, wee also don't care.

Well we just don't know, we also don't care.

Speak for yourself, not others.

 

[Tony_in_MD]

Speak for yourself, not others.

So your statement:

"I'm willing to bet most players don't know what their preferred ratio is, or the weight ratio of their playing cue is."

Is not true, and if it is that most don't know what their preferred ratio is, would they not care?

I am speaking for myself and everyone I have worked with.

 

[sonoman]

So, I have read so many good comments about Chris Nitti's cues I just ordered a shaft from him. I am putting it on one of my Josey butts.
Chris is matching my ring work, putting on a sniper tip and making the shaft 12.75mm where shaft meets ferrule. Other than that I told him I wanted his taper, joint, ferrule material and his standard length ferrule. He quoted a fair price and delivery time. Excited to check it out.

Chris got me the shaft in less than 2 weeks. I have played for about a week with it 3 hours a day. The shaft has a perfect fit and finish. Chris suggested I try his Wizard tip which I did. Both Nitti and Josey have a solid, crisp hit with good tone ( love that bonk sound). I like the wizard tip. The Josey and Nitti shafts play very much the same. So having played with Josey for 12 years I can say I am very happy with both shafts. It would be hard to pick a favorite with out having the same tip on both shafts. You cannot go wrong with either. I am glad I got the Nitti and will be playing with it a lot.