Why I love slop

Tin Man

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People constantly talk about call shot as if it makes the game more difficult or more professional. There are some very good reasons I prefer slop rules when playing 9 ball or 10 ball. Here are a couple:

1. It disrupts the balance between kicking and safety play. When someone plays safe the kicker is already at a major disadvantage much of the time. When playing 'call shot' the balance tips much, much further. This leads to a more defensive game. With the kicker having less chance of winning it leads to more safeties, and safeties that leave the kicker drawing nearly dead in many cases. It's like baseball- what makes it great is the balance between good pitching and good hitting. If the strike zone was made to be 6x6" the pitchers would be at such an advantage it wouldn't be fun. That's what call shot does to kickers, it makes it so there is so much less risk in letting your opponent back to the table. With slop rules people have to think twice before playing safe, plus they know if they shoot an aggressive shot and miss they might slop something in or getting lucky and get a hook, this leads to more aggression and a more suspenseful and challenging contest.

2. It doesn't eliminate luck. This is absurd. So much luck is involved in the game already. The spread of the balls after the break, whether you get a shot at the lowest ball, where you leave the balls if you miss, where the balls end up after a kick shot, and so much more. If you wanted to make a pie chart of how much luck was in the game, slopped balls would make up less than 5%. And at the top level where players don't miss often it is even less. Yet players insist that this is somehow drastically reducing the luck from the game. It's ridiculous. If you really wanted to eliminate luck you'd have template layouts like bowling or golf and have people demonstrate their ability to navigate through the obstacle courses. But that's pointless anyway because of my next point.

3. Luck isn't a bad thing. The poker player Howard Letterer said "In poker there is skill and there is luck, and one of the skills is handling the luck". Truer words were never spoken. Look, I love Grady Matthews, and I have learned a LOT from him. To this day I watch many matches he commentates because after hearing his voice for so long I feel he is an old friend. But he was terrible at handling the luck. I just watched a player review of him vs. Buddy Hall, and he was grumbling on and on about the luck. How he never gets a shot at the 1 ball when it's down to the wire, how there's not even a good place to push, etc. Then he proceeds to one stroke a stupid shot disgustedly and act like a victim. Never mind that Buddy made a great kick shot and scratched to let him win the rack before. Never mind that the reason he was hooked was because the cue ball followed forward to the end rail. I'm afraid to say he didn't handle the luck well and turned into a negative victim meltdown artist. My point is that a little luck in the game is a good thing, because it rewards those with a positive attitude. It creates adversity in the game and rewards those that have belief and confidence and expect good things to happen. Billy Incardona also said this in a match he commentated once and I agree wholeheartedly.

In general I am put off with the attitude "If it weren't for luck I'd win them all", or "I don't mind losing, I just don't like losing by slop". Look, if you lose 9-8 in a race to 9 due to a slop shot, you didn't lose because of slop, you lost because you let your opponent get 8 games to where one roll would cost you the match. And if you're so good you can win without luck, you can win with luck. If you can't win with luck, you're not as good as you think you are.

We all know the feeling of sitting in your chair sweating your opponents kick, hoping they don't slop in the 9 or something. But your job as a competitor is to deal with those uncomfortable feelings and perform optimally anyway, not to eliminate situations that make you uncomfortable.

Almost all of it is ego trips and inability to manage adversity. Deal with it and don't mess up a good game!
 
Slop Rarely comes into play at a decent level of play, the only time I can remember where it changed my play was when I wanted to pocket a ball while performing safe and the slop rules make you shoot again. No problem (just different) I would say the only real advantage would be not having to call un obvious shots but decent players already know what you're attempting anyway. It's just a simple way of explaining rules to the masses! I'm referring mostly to 8ball but my thoughts are the same for rotation, I rarely see anyone shooting (kicking) and hoping it finds a hole!
 
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If a major tournament were held that allowed slop instead of call shots I'd be willing to bet that the same "cream of the crop" names would rise to the top.

It would make for an interesting experiment...
 
10 ball was created to eliminate slop shots allowed in 9 ball

People constantly talk about call shot as if it makes the game more difficult or more professional. There are some very good reasons I prefer slop rules when playing 9 ball or 10 ball. Here are a couple:

1. It disrupts the balance between kicking and safety play. When someone plays safe the kicker is already at a major disadvantage much of the time. When playing 'call shot' the balance tips much, much further. This leads to a more defensive game. With the kicker having less chance of winning it leads to more safeties, and safeties that leave the kicker drawing nearly dead in many cases. It's like baseball- what makes it great is the balance between good pitching and good hitting. If the strike zone was made to be 6x6" the pitchers would be at such an advantage it wouldn't be fun. That's what call shot does to kickers, it makes it so there is so much less risk in letting your opponent back to the table. With slop rules people have to think twice before playing safe, plus they know if they shoot an aggressive shot and miss they might slop something in or getting lucky and get a hook, this leads to more aggression and a more suspenseful and challenging contest.

2. It doesn't eliminate luck. This is absurd. So much luck is involved in the game already. The spread of the balls after the break, whether you get a shot at the lowest ball, where you leave the balls if you miss, where the balls end up after a kick shot, and so much more. If you wanted to make a pie chart of how much luck was in the game, slopped balls would make up less than 5%. And at the top level where players don't miss often it is even less. Yet players insist that this is somehow drastically reducing the luck from the game. It's ridiculous. If you really wanted to eliminate luck you'd have template layouts like bowling or golf and have people demonstrate their ability to navigate through the obstacle courses. But that's pointless anyway because of my next point.

3. Luck isn't a bad thing. The poker player Howard Letterer said "In poker there is skill and there is luck, and one of the skills is handling the luck". Truer words were never spoken. Look, I love Grady Matthews, and I have learned a LOT from him. To this day I watch many matches he commentates because after hearing his voice for so long I feel he is an old friend. But he was terrible at handling the luck. I just watched a player review of him vs. Buddy Hall, and he was grumbling on and on about the luck. How he never gets a shot at the 1 ball when it's down to the wire, how there's not even a good place to push, etc. Then he proceeds to one stroke a stupid shot disgustedly and act like a victim. Never mind that Buddy made a great kick shot and scratched to let him win the rack before. Never mind that the reason he was hooked was because the cue ball followed forward to the end rail. I'm afraid to say he didn't handle the luck well and turned into a negative victim meltdown artist. My point is that a little luck in the game is a good thing, because it rewards those with a positive attitude. It creates adversity in the game and rewards those that have belief and confidence and expect good things to happen. Billy Incardona also said this in a match he commentated once and I agree wholeheartedly.

In general I am put off with the attitude "If it weren't for luck I'd win them all", or "I don't mind losing, I just don't like losing by slop". Look, if you lose 9-8 in a race to 9 due to a slop shot, you didn't lose because of slop, you lost because you let your opponent get 8 games to where one roll would cost you the match. And if you're so good you can win without luck, you can win with luck. If you can't win with luck, you're not as good as you think you are.

We all know the feeling of sitting in your chair sweating your opponents kick, hoping they don't slop in the 9 or something. But your job as a competitor is to deal with those uncomfortable feelings and perform optimally anyway, not to eliminate situations that make you uncomfortable.

Almost all of it is ego trips and inability to manage adversity. Deal with it and don't mess up a good game!

10 ball was created to eliminate slop shots allowed in 9 ball.
 
10 ball was created to eliminate slop shots allowed in 9 ball.

I hear ya. But unless you're playing league level pool it doesn't matter. Maybe 1shot out of 1000 or something crazy like that. Slop rules were mainly created just to simplify it.
 
Play call shot and two-foul pushout.

That gets rid of a lot of the luck factor and keeps the game honest.
 
I agree wholeheartedly. I love slop. Allowing for it allows for more creative and more exciting play.
 
Strive for perfection

I hear ya. But unless you're playing league level pool it doesn't matter. Maybe 1shot out of 1000 or something crazy like that. Slop rules were mainly created just to simplify it.


Strive for perfection.
 
Playing 2 foul pushout, you only delay the game and make it as long as a One Pocket match. If you want to play call shot 9 ball or 10 ball, go book your game with Corey, Shane or Dennis and pack a fat wallet with you.
 
I agree wholeheartedly. I love slop. Allowing for it allows for more creative and more exciting play.

I don't mind "called slop" as much as "over there" slop.

If a 4-railer is a "possibility" and you say, "damn, I may make this 4-railer" and you make it while at the same time playing a safety, I consider that "controlled luck".

If you just blast shit around and holler "over there", it becomes a bit too much.

I have a habit of calling difficult shots most all the time, whether my opponent likes it or not. If I get "lucky", I'll acknowledge it, like Efren. I don't just blast the balls a 100 MPH and make one and pretend that is what I intended.
 
Playing 2 foul pushout, you only delay the game and make it as long as a One Pocket match. If you want to play call shot 9 ball or 10 ball, go book your game with Corey, Shane or Dennis and pack a fat wallet with you.

It only delays the game as long as one-pocket for some people, others not quite so much.

It was the game of choice before the BIH BS was thought up.

If you ask the old-school players (Buddy Hall, CJ, Efren, Earl, Parica, McCready, etc.), I'd bet you'd have 90% of them say it is a "better" game.

To each, their own. Play what you want to play.
 
I hate slop!!

When I see slop it makes me want to grab my opponents cue and snap it into many pieces.

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What I'm saying is that "call shot" kills the two-way shot, and hitting a kick good and lucking one in. "Call shot" takes away from rewarding imaginative solutions that may require a bit of luck.

I don't mind "called slop" as much as "over there" slop.



If a 4-railer is a "possibility" and you say, "damn, I may make this 4-railer" and you make it while at the same time playing a safety, I consider that "controlled luck".



If you just blast shit around and holler "over there", it becomes a bit too much.



I have a habit of calling difficult shots most all the time, whether my opponent likes it or not. If I get "lucky", I'll acknowledge it, like Efren. I don't just blast the balls a 100 MPH and make one and pretend that is what I intended.
 
10 ball was created to eliminate slop shots allowed in 9 ball.

I'm calling bullshit on that...
...I played ten-ball in the 70s....same rules as nine-ball.

The bar-rules, snowflake thinking is a modern thing that hurts the game.
 
I don't mind "called slop" as much as "over there" slop.

If a 4-railer is a "possibility" and you say, "damn, I may make this 4-railer" and you make it while at the same time playing a safety, I consider that "controlled luck".

If you just blast shit around and holler "over there", it becomes a bit too much.

I have a habit of calling difficult shots most all the time, whether my opponent likes it or not. If I get "lucky", I'll acknowledge it, like Efren. I don't just blast the balls a 100 MPH and make one and pretend that is what I intended.



How often do you see top level players just blast shit around and hope for the best? Like never, right? Now if you're talking about gambling then it's still a non-issue.

I believe game theory would dictate that if you're the player that DOESN'T need to blast shit around, then it's more profitable for you in the long run to play against guys that DO need to blast shit around.
 
I'm calling bullshit on that...
...I played ten-ball in the 70s....same rules as nine-ball.

The bar-rules, snowflake thinking is a modern thing that hurts the game.

I played 10-ball way back then, too.

Pool has went downhill since that era, IMHO.
 
If I come across a situation where it is say a 40% chance of a run out, a 40% chance on a

two way shot on the 10 ball or a straight out safe, which one gives me the most chance of

a win? Now I know if executed correctly and make the ten, I win, but if it goes two rails

and in the side I think it was a calculated risk with a higher chance of reward. Should

count. Call shot can change the game immensely, imagine instead of breaking up a cluster

you just call a different pocket make the ball and let your opponent shoot the lower percentage

shot. You do two things this way, one you only have to worry about the cue ball, the object

ball will be pocketed, making the safe so much easier to execute. I do not agree with call

shot, but understand why some people would like to see it more. No one likes to lose having

the 9/10 ball go two or more rails for the loss. I know I play one guy, who is one LUCKY

SOB but it takes a different kind of game to beat him, I have to lock him down every chance I get...

100 MPH and 5 rails bank combo, carom and the nine falls...Not a fun way to lose...
 
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