Why Not A National Tour?

[Johnnyt]

Has anyone ever thought of a National Pro Tour? If all the purse money stayed in the U.S, more pro players could make a decent living. Promoters are going to say people want to see stars from other countries. Same promoters are saying no one is coming/paying for the live gate now...so what are they missing. Pros that live in the states like Appleton, Shaw and others could not play. They live here and make their money here, but play for their country. That ain't cool IMO. Johnnyt

 

[Celophanewrap]

There was the old Camel Tour. I always thought that was pretty good, at least for the fans. I think they had an event every month or about 10 times a year, or something like that. Each event was in a different part of the country. I think it was usually held side by side with an APA amateur event. Here in Denver it was a real pool event. It was great when those guys came into town. They'd come in for a week or so, hang at different pool halls, some would play ion local events or tournaments, put on exhibitions. I always thought it was great for pool.

 

[336Robin]

Camel was Good until

There was the old Camel Tour. I always thought that was pretty good, at least for the fans. I think they had an event every month or about 10 times a year, or something like that. Each event was in a different part of the country. I think it was usually held side by side with an APA amateur event. Here in Denver it was a real pool event. It was great when those guys came into town. They'd come in for a week or so, hang at different pool halls, some would play ion local events or tournaments, put on exhibitions. I always thought it was great for pool.

From what Ive heard the Camel Tour was good until someone pissed off the sponsors.

 

[macguy]

Has anyone ever thought of a National Pro Tour? If all the purse money stayed in the U.S, more pro players could make a decent living. Promoters are going to say people want to see stars from other countries. Same promoters are saying no one is coming/paying for the live gate now...so what are they missing. Pros that live in the states like Appleton, Shaw and others could not play. They live here and make their money here, but play for their country. That ain't cool IMO. Johnnyt

With out player sponsors it is impossible. It just cost too much to travel and with money almost always top end. Except for a few, it is just an expensive hobby playing pro pool. Players have to somehow on their own find sponsors who want a write off and will foot the bill..

 

[macguy]

There was the old Camel Tour. I always thought that was pretty good, at least for the fans. I think they had an event every month or about 10 times a year, or something like that. Each event was in a different part of the country. I think it was usually held side by side with an APA amateur event. Here in Denver it was a real pool event. It was great when those guys came into town. They'd come in for a week or so, hang at different pool halls, some would play ion local events or tournaments, put on exhibitions. I always thought it was great for pool.

I went to a few of those. They would heard us all to one end so when they played on TV it would look like there was someone there watching. You mention the APA. None of them would even come in and watch the tournaments, at least not at the ones I went to. Pool tournaments no matter how we may try to spin it, just have no market.

 

[Celophanewrap]

I went to a few of those. They would heard us all to one end so when they played on TV it would look like there was someone there watching. You mention the APA. None of them would even come in and watch the tournaments, at least not at the ones I went to. Pool tournaments no matter how we may try to spin it, just have no market.

I couldn't' even be sure ours were televised. A few of the pros were milling around our APA events and I remember they held a couple of qualifiers for local players. The Camel event here had a pretty good turnout, but by pretty good I would estimate that at the peak the attendance would have been a few thousand, the bleachers were always pretty full. It wasn't like trying to go to a Bronco game, but pool wasn't (and isn't) a main stream sport. We were an enthusiastic crowd. It was a good time.
I remember Cory Deuel was this fresh kid about 16 or 17 years old that got scolded for trying to warm up wearing jeans, Mika Immonen was a probably a very early 20's kid with dyed blond hair with dark tips, Steve Mizerak came in to our home room and signed a bunch of autographs and Johnny Archer came in and did an exhibition and played anyone that wanted to for $10 a match - race to 3, Earl Striclkand offered Kunihiko Takahashi $500 (or something like that) if he beat Francisco Bustemonte so Earl didn't have to play him in the final or semi final, and Tang Hoa fleeced a few of the locals when he walked into a few of the local rooms (only a few of us knew who he was back then) with one plain jane cue in a canvass bag. It seemed like more fun that a business

 

[Johnnyt]

I wish everyone could forget about pool tournaments on TV, That has never really worked no matter what some say. Even the few weeks it was on many, many moons ago, it didn't last long. Tournaments on TV now with 100's of channels...forget about it. The women had a good run on TV. Some viewers were even watching the pool part. Johnnyt

 

[DJ14.1]

Unless the prize money is significantly better....like a '0' or '00' better, it's not worth hopping flights and long-distance travel for players. Sadly, pro pool competes for peanuts.

You don't even want to know what Stan and Serena just earned for winning the French Open...it would dishearten us all in this sport

 

[Baxter]

I don't think we need a national tour. There's a few regional tours that are doing well it seems. The Mezz West State tour is doing great and growing every event it seems. It's the best thing to happen in west coast pool in a long time. Nobody is going to get rich playing pro pool, but these regional tours pay well enough that they can draw out the good players and give them some competition without having a big nut to cover every event. There are a few big events every year where the best of the best and the guys that dominate their respective regional tours get together and battle it out. I think that model works just fine.

 

[DJ14.1]

They could have something where the top 1 or 2 players of each regional tour play in some kind of national invitational every 6 months or year. That'd be nice to see. And since it's only one or 2 events a year, perhaps they could get the money into it....

 

[zencues.com]

Just fyi

Billiards
http://www.azbilliards.com/people/azb-money-leaderboard/2015/all/



Money Leaders GOLF

Y-T-D-statistics through: Jun 07, 2015
RANK THIS WEEK RANK LAST WEEK PLAYER NAME EVENTS MONEY YTD VICTORIES
1 1 Jordan Spieth 16 6,063,838 2
2 2 Jimmy Walker 15 4,102,257 2
3 3 Rory McIlroy 7 3,912,533 2
4 4 Dustin Johnson 12 3,448,960 1
5 5 J.B. Holmes 15 3,116,200 1
6 6 Charley Hoffman 19 3,049,871 1
7 14 Justin Rose 11 3,007,424 1
8 7 Bubba Watson 8 2,838,174 1
9 8 Brandt Snedeker 17 2,811,110 1
10 9 Rickie Fowler 12 2,758,848 1
11 11 Hideki Matsuyama 16 2,734,824
12 10 Patrick Reed 17 2,604,191 1
13 12 Jason Day 11 2,400,512 1
14 13 Ben Martin 19 2,396,211 1
15 19 Kevin Kisner 20 2,387,707
16 17 Robert Streb 20 2,317,172 1
17 18 Ryan Moore 15 2,317,101 1
18 23 Jim Furyk 11 2,313,161 1
19 15 Gary Woodland 16 2,305,905
20 16 Chris Kirk 17 2,275,064 1
21 21 Bill Haas 14 2,273,892 1
22 20 Steven Bowditch 20 2,221,037 1
23 25 Kevin Na 17 2,120,147
24 22 Sergio Garcia 9 2,087,631
25 24 Sangmoon Bae 20 2,031,978 1
26 26 Brooks Koepka 12 1,951,213 1
27 27 Paul Casey 13 1,869,573
28 28 Daniel Berger 22 1,802,951
29 29 Henrik Stenson 8 1,746,864
30 113 David Lingmerth 19 1,624,068 1
31 30 Webb Simpson 12 1,607,014
32 31 James Hahn 19 1,605,845 1
33 32 Zach Johnson 15 1,563,930
34 33 Jason Bohn 18 1,559,228
35 34 Shawn Stefani 18 1,543,322
36 35 Ian Poulter 12 1,512,307
37 36 Phil Mickelson 11 1,511,925
38 38 Matt Kuchar 16 1,498,404
39 37 Matt Every 16 1,480,316 1
40 44 Russell Knox 19 1,461,423
41 39 Nick Watney 18 1,454,968
42 46 Kevin Streelman 19 1,449,032
43 40 Russell Henley 16 1,436,182
44 41 Justin Thomas 21 1,418,538
45 42 Ryan Palmer 13 1,398,426
46 43 Cameron Tringale 19 1,397,472
47 45 Brendon de Jonge 20 1,377,467
48 48 Harris English 18 1,368,875
49 47 Boo Weekley 17 1,331,767
50 59 Tony Finau 21 1,322,595
51 49 Scott Piercy 19 1,263,262
52 54 Rory Sabbatini 19 1,240,993
53 51 Brendan Steele 17 1,230,024
54 50 Danny Lee 24 1,221,687
55 53 Pat Perez 18 1,200,778
56 66 Keegan Bradley 15 1,199,882
57 52 Padraig Harrington 15 1,192,539 1
58 56 Matt Jones 17 1,189,511
59 55 Sean O'Hair 18 1,182,554
60 65 Billy Horschel 18 1,174,882
61 57 Louis Oosthuizen 11 1,166,508
62 60 John Senden 18 1,153,875
63 58 Hunter Mahan 15 1,148,990
64 64 Brendon Todd 17 1,141,731
65 61 Scott Pinckney 18 1,108,060
66 62 Alex Cejka 19 1,064,014 1
67 63 Chesson Hadley 21 1,061,129
68 67 Nick Taylor 20 1,006,519 1
69 70 Charles Howell III 21 999,798
70 68 Tim Clark 6 997,715
71 69 Martin Laird 16 997,382
72 77 George McNeill 17 973,423
73 71 Jerry Kelly 16 957,469
74 72 Scott Stallings 17 906,018
75 73 Jason Kokrak 20 895,615
76 74 Jim Herman 19 892,450
77 75 Jon Curran 19 864,955
78 76 Jamie Donaldson 11 858,438
79 78 Will MacKenzie 12 850,507
80 79 Brian Harman 18 839,963
81 104 Marc Leishman 15 833,825
82 80 David Hearn 20 814,431
83 81 Morgan Hoffmann 17 809,075
84 82 Colt Knost 20 788,617
85 85 Zac Blair 22 785,775
86 130 Francesco Molinari 11 781,424
87 83 Carlos Ortiz 20 777,265
88 84 Daniel Summerhays 19 774,224
89 90 Jason Dufner 15 773,746
90 87 Troy Merritt 18 752,848
91 88 Hudson Swafford 20 750,202
92 86 Lee Westwood 10 749,036
93 89 Kyle Reifers 20 724,443
94 91 Johnson Wagner 13 713,388
95 92 Scott Brown 22 713,071
96 93 Andres Gonzales 19 698,770
97 94 John Peterson 18 695,020
98 95 Adam Scott 9 692,683
99 99 Retief Goosen 18 685,280
100 96 Blayne Barber 17 674,871
101 97 Steve Wheatcroft 19 672,749
102 98 Bryce Molder 16 665,872
103 101 William McGirt 20 648,643
104 105 Graham DeLaet 17 634,967
105 102 Kevin Chappell 16 633,275
106 100 Charlie Beljan 18 630,849
107 103 Adam Hadwin 22 629,685
108 106 John Huh 23 602,070
109 126 Vijay Singh 15 590,871
110 107 Graeme McDowell 9 568,711
111 108 Ryo Ishikawa 18 560,473
112 109 S.J. Park 18 548,726
113 114 Erik Compton 19 534,515
114 110 Spencer Levin 20 531,653
115 111 Nicholas Thompson 22 530,705
116 112 Alex Prugh 18 512,356
117 124 Jeff Overton 21 500,527
118 117 Ken Duke 20 499,933
119 115 Geoff Ogilvy 11 496,759
120 120 Brian Stuard 22 496,568
121 116 Chad Collins 16 491,367
122 118 David Toms 14 486,264
123 119 Charl Schwartzel 13 483,863
124 121 Brice Garnett 20 466,738
125 122 Mark Wilson 17 455,798
126 123 Luke Guthrie 19 455,495
127 125 Chad Campbell 20 451,133
128 127 Billy Hurley III 19 437,828
129 128 Fabian Gomez 16 431,664
130 129 Brian Davis 22 431,644
131 134 Lucas Glover 19 427,417
132 131 Luke Donald 11 421,498
133 132 Jonas Blixt 17 417,684
134 133 Freddie Jacobson 14 416,259
135 136 Andrew Svoboda 21 397,495
136 135 Martin Kaymer 8 389,370
137 147 Chris Stroud 19 383,994
138 137 Michael Putnam 20 382,836
139 138 Whee Kim 14 375,180
140 139 Jhonattan Vegas 19 371,959
141 140 K.J. Choi 14 371,719
142 141 Sam Saunders 19 370,803
143 144 Bo Van Pelt 20 369,804
144 142 Will Wilcox 8 366,049
145 150 Camilo Villegas 17 364,514
146 143 Cameron Percy 15 354,432
147 152 Scott Langley 20 348,794
148 145 Derek Fathauer 19 347,638
149 146 Martin Flores 21 347,415
150 154 Carl Pettersson 22 346,469





==========================================



Men's | Women's TENNIS
ATP Tour Money Leaders
Rank Previous Rank Name Country Earnings
1 1 Novak Djokovic Serbia $5,993,123
2 2 Andy Murray Great Britain $3,067,582
3 3 Tomas Berdych Czech Republic $1,895,174
4 4 David Ferrer Spain $1,661,382
5 5 Roger Federer Switzerland $1,619,605
6 6 Kei Nishikori Japan $1,544,339
7 7 Stanislas Wawrinka Switzerland $1,390,749
8 8 Rafael Nadal Spain $1,366,041
9 9 Milos Raonic Canada $901,570
10 10 Fabio Fognini Italy $791,796
11 11 Simone Bolelli Italy $682,524
12 12 John Isner USA $667,203
13 13 Guillermo Garcia-Lopez Spain $561,004
14 14 Kevin Anderson South Africa $557,375
15 15 Feliciano Lopez Spain $543,419
16 16 Grigor Dimitrov Bulgaria $538,350
17 17 Gilles Simon France $519,793
18 18 Pablo Cuevas Uruguay $492,985
19 19 Jack Sock USA $492,323
20 21 Nick Kyrgios Australia $481,388
21 20 Gael Monfils France $475,674
22 22 Bernard Tomic Australia $466,051
23 23 Martin Klizan Slovakia $458,951
24 26 Juan Monaco Argentina $437,594
25 24 Roberto Bautista Agut Spain $431,670
26 25 Vasek Pospisil Canada $429,422
27 28 Pablo Andujar Spain $423,119
28 27 Richard Gasquet France $419,556
29 40 Dominic Thiem Austria $406,383
30 29 Viktor Troicki Serbia $400,383
31 30 Fernando Verdasco Spain $389,305
32 31 Marcel Granollers Spain $387,193
33 32 Ivan Dodig Croatia $360,144
34 34 Adrian Mannarino France $355,468
35 33 Andreas Seppi Italy $349,860
36 46 Leonardo Mayer Argentina $338,352
37 35 Jeremy Chardy France $334,621
38 36 Gilles Muller Luxembourg $333,967
39 48 Joao Sousa Portugal $331,775
40 37 David Goffin Belgium $330,575
41 60 Thomaz Bellucci Brazil $326,682
42 38 Bob Bryan USA $325,662
42 38 Mike Bryan USA $325,662
44 41 Ivo Karlovic Croatia $314,358
45 47 Santiago Giraldo Colombia $313,350
46 45 Lukas Rosol Czech Republic $311,195
47 44 Sergiy Stakhovsky Ukraine $310,619
48 42 Philipp Kohlschreiber Germany $309,758
49 43 Jiri Vesely Czech Republic $307,438
50 50 Steve Johnson USA $283,221
51 49 Rohan Bopanna India $276,694
52 51 Andreas Haider-Maurer Austria $267,871
53 54 Sam Querrey USA $266,159
54 59 Borna Coric Croatia $263,764
55 52 Florin Mergea Romania $258,804
56 53 Tommy Robredo Spain $258,479
57 55 Donald Young USA $254,292
58 56 Alexandr Dolgopolov Ukraine $248,263
59 58 Victor Estrella Burgos Dominican Republic $243,684
60 57 Marcelo Melo Brazil $239,239
61 61 Jerzy Janowicz Poland $228,875
62 62 Benjamin Becker Germany $224,098
63 63 Albert Ramos Spain $223,580
64 71 Ernests Gulbis Latvia $211,957
64 59 Anna Karolina Schmiedlova Slovakia $226,420
65 69 Sam Groth Australia $209,144
66 64 Nicolas Almagro Spain $207,402
67 65 Edouard Roger-Vasselin France $206,936
68 66 Nenad Zimonjic Serbia $206,349
69 70 Jean-Julien Rojer Netherlands $205,938
70 67 Thanasi Kokkinakis Australia $205,454
71 68 Robin Haase Netherlands $203,477
72 72 Horia Tecau Romania $202,176
73 76 Pablo Carreno Busta Spain $196,586
74 73 David Marrero Spain $195,180
75 88 Federico Delbonis Argentina $194,139
76 75 Jarkko Nieminen Finland $193,287
77 81 Marin Cilic Croatia $193,266
78 74 Nicolas Mahut France $192,462
79 78 Marcos Baghdatis Cyprus $189,440
80 84 Dusan Lajovic Serbia $187,835
81 77 Jo-Wilfried Tsonga France $187,166
82 82 Denis Istomin Uzbekistan $186,761
83 79 Malek Jaziri Tunisia $182,048
84 80 Diego Schwartzman Argentina $181,005
85 85 Mikhail Kukushkin Kazakhstan $177,820
86 86 Teymuraz Gabashvili Russia $175,435
87 83 Marcin Matkowski Poland $173,548
88 87 Paolo Lorenzi Italy $173,215
89 89 Joao Souza Brazil $167,420
90 92 Jurgen Melzer Austria $164,210
91 90 Marin Draganja Croatia $157,315
92 91 John Peers Australia $156,843
93 95 Jan-Lennard Struff Germany $153,955
94 93 Henri Kontinen Finland $152,810
95 94 Daniel Gimeno-Traver Spain $151,893
96 104 Yen-Hsun Lu Chinese Taipei $150,832
97 103 Mikhail Youzhny Russia $149,526
98 96 Ryan Harrison USA $147,915
99 100 Daniel Nestor Canada $147,530
100 97 Marc Lopez Spain $147,266
101 98 Jamie Murray Scotland $147,148
102 102 Marinko Matosevic Australia $146,812
103 99 Dustin Brown Germany $146,512
104 101 Marsel Ilhan Turkey $143,894
105 107 Richard Berankis Lithuania $137,631
106 105 Andrey Golubev Kazakhstan $135,359
107 109 Carlos Berlocq Argentina $134,676
108 112 James Duckworth Australia $133,935
109 106 Pierre-Hugues Herbert France $133,654
110 111 Tim Smyczek USA $130,242
111 108 Alejandro Gonzalez Colombia $128,349
112 110 Bruno Soares Brazil $126,433
113 114 Benoit Paire France $124,034
114 118 Andrey Kuznetsov Russia $123,138
115 121 Juan Sebastian Cabal Colombia $121,668
116 120 Lucas Pouille France $120,882
117 113 Julien Benneteau France $118,644
118 115 Aljaz Bedene Slovenia $117,097
119 116 Alejandro Falla Colombia $116,978
120 117 Luca Vanni Italy $115,606
121 119 Max Mirnyi Belarus $112,267
122 122 Filip Krajinovic Serbia $106,012
123 123 Dudi Sela Israel $105,605
124 124 Austin Krajicek United States $104,084
125 125 Igor Sijsling Netherlands $103,249
126 126 Dominic Inglot England $100,483
127 137 Robert Farah Colombia $100,151
128 127 Go Soeda Japan $98,577
129 128 Lukas Lacko Slovakia $98,458
130 131 Aisam-Ul-Haq Qureshi Pakistan $94,357
131 129 Steve Darcis Belgium $93,038
132 130 Marius Copil Romania $93,015
133 133 Alexander Peya Austria $92,614
134 135 Philipp Oswald Austria $90,831
135 132 Denis Kudla United States $90,410
136 134 Alexander Zverev Germany $89,572
137 136 Blaz Rola Slovenia $88,108
138 138 Leander Paes India $86,254
139 139 Hyeon Chung Korea $86,245
140 140 Michael Berrer Germany $85,795
141 145 Damir Dzumhur Bosnia $84,784
142 144 Maximo Gonzalez Argentina $82,281
143 141 Blaz Kavcic Slovenia $82,256
144 142 Lleyton Hewitt Australia $82,052
145 147 Rajeev Ram USA $80,453
146 143 Thiemo De Bakker Netherlands $79,619
147 146 Paul-Henri Mathieu France $78,211
148 148 Tobias Kamke Germany $78,011
149 149 Elias Ymer Sweden $77,956
150 150 Albert Montanes Spain $76,226

 

[Johnnyt]

Thanks for the #'s but it has nothing to do with my question. Johnnyt

 

[PINKLADY]

i'll say it again: the players have no-oooo exposure. they need a PR man. their posts on FaceBook are to their friends, who don't shoot pool nor put $$$$ in their pockets. they "block" those invested, in posted therein, due to conflict & inability to respond properly.

follow the $$$$$$....

leagues don't know WHO-is-WHO. laypeople don't know WHO-is-WHO. i've done the polls & seen it way too many tourneys to post. the PRO room is empty while HUNDREDS are outside watching the on-going matches.

the promoters are done with the Pros' piety & improprieties. (except Barry B) they cut their losses, cause the players weren't invested. as consumers, we have too. how many "pros", do you see here promoting themselves & their branding sponsors?????

they're big boys; not our problem. we'd rather be shooting pool.

 

[DJ14.1]

i'll say it again: the players have no-oooo exposure. they need a PR man. their posts on FaceBook are to their friends, who don't shoot pool nor put $$$$ in their pockets. they "block" those invested, in posted therein, due to conflict & inability to respond properly.

follow the $$$$$$....

leagues don't know WHO-is-WHO. laypeople don't know WHO-is-WHO. i've done the polls & seen it way too many tourneys to post. the PRO room is empty while HUNDREDS are outside watching the on-going matches.

the promoters are done with the Pros' piety & improprieties. (except Barry B) they cut their losses, cause the players weren't invested. as consumers, we have too. how many "pros", do you see here promoting themselves & their branding sponsors?????

they're big boys; not our problem. we'd rather be shooting pool.

I think alot of this is just what results from the real problem....people love to play pool but people don't like to watch it on TV.

 

[zencues.com]

Thanks for the #'s but it has nothing to do with my question. Johnnyt

Actually, it answers your question exactly. You just have to read between the lines I guess.
The answer, in case you missed it, is money, or lack of it. That's why there
is no national professional billiard league or tour tournaments.

 

[PINKLADY]

I think alot of this is just what results from the real problem....people love to play pool but people don't like to watch it on TV.

DING! DING! DING!
:dance::happydance::happydance::dance:

it's not rocket-science. leagues know exactly who their competition are & are obviousy involved in said. short of that, they don't give a shit -

- i might tune into pool TV at 3am if absolutely nothing else is on, pour a shot of whiskey, and pray that i fall asleep.

 

[dnschmidt]

I no longer play pool but I've flown across the country many times to watch it. The problem is many fold but primarily is caused by pool rooms turning into bars and the people that play pool doing so more to drink and socialize than learning and developing in the game.

Only people that have really tried to be good want to watch the best. The average league player could care less. He's far more concerned with getting laid than he is with improving his pool game.

When pool transitioned from pool rooms to bars the die was cast. It's over now. Mark putting on a Pro Tournament on bar tables is the final nail. It's not his fault that this has happened he's simply realizing that it has happened.

 

[spktur]

From what Ive heard the Camel Tour was good until someone pissed off the sponsors.

The Camel tour bit the dust because of the liberal left at the federal level. A law was passed restricting tobacco from sponsoring sporting events. Got the Winston cup at the same time.

 

[spartan]

You don't even want to know what Stan and Serena just earned for winning the French Open...it would dishearten us all in this sport

That isn't an apples vs apples comparison
A better comparison will be sedentary sports like darts, chess
Yes many more of them earn 6 or 7 digits in those so called boring sports like darts, chess
Go figure

 

[dnschmidt]

Here to me is what killed pro pool. When I was a kid and went into a pool hall I, and everybody else that was there, since alcohol was by state law (Pennsylvania) prohibited from being sold in a pool room, considered pool to either be a sport or a very difficult and challenging game at which we had chosen to get good. Therefore, we respected and watched the best players in an attempt to get better at our sport/game. Now pool is a pastime, who gives a damn what the best players do when the activity is considered a pastime. You're in a bar killing time playing pool between drinks trying to hit on chicks. THIS IS WHAT HAS KILLED THE GAME ON THE PROFESSIONAL LEVEL. People respect sportsmen, if pool's lost its position as a sport who cares about the best practitioners of something considered a pastime.