Putting down the LD shaft

L

lunneborgc

Registered
I have been thinking a lot lately about putting down my low deflection shaft. I'm curious to see what other people think, and hear comments from others who have done this. I'm not trying to start a pissing match about which is the best LD or why anyone should/shouldn't play with one, just looking for information.

Here's my situation... I have a few cues that I love and I'd like to play with all of them, the problem is I'm "off" when I'm shooting with my other cues compared to my normal player with the LD shaft. I traded for a Russ Espiritu and a Tim Scruggs sneaky pete at the same time around two years ago. I played with both cues a bunch, but I personally liked the feel of the Scruggs, so it became my playing cue. I tried a friends Espiritu with an OB shaft and instantly I fell in love with the "feel" of the cue and purchased one myself. For the past year and a half or so I have been shooting with that combination. Durring that time I learned a ton about shooting, english, and studied up on the game of billiards. I'm happy with what I've learned any how my ability has advanced, but all this was done while shooting with a LD shaft. I would like to be able to pick up any of my cues and shoot nearly the same as I would with my player but I'm having difficulty executing shots/leaves I know I'm capable of. That's why I'm planning on switching back to plain maple shafts, for better consistency from cue to cue. I recently purchased a new cue, and am planning to use the shafts that came with it from the cue maker. From what I've read the shafts made by him are top notch. I'm on a loosing streak in my leagues and this is probably not the best time to make a change in my game, (is there ever?) but I'm determined. I know in my head the answer is practice, but it's been pretty frustrating so far. I plan on taking lessons from a local guy that's been referred to my by a fellow player. I know sounds like I've already answered my questions, and know what needs to be done, but I'm sure I'm not the first person that's been in this situation. I guess I'm just looking for tips/advice/support.

TIA - Noob
 
That's one of the problems I have as well. Not that I particularly want to play with a regular shaft but the few times I've played with my regular shaft for my Jacoby I really have to concentrate on how I'm hitting whitey because the way you need to apply english changes. I have played a few nights using the regular shaft just to make myself concentrate on some more center ball control but when I need to get the english I think I need I have to switch to a true BHE with the regular shaft vs what I call a mix of BHE and parallel when I use the Predator. Knowledge of how each shaft plays and good concentration can overcome any issues though. Good luck.
 
All I can really say is. I don't know any strong players that can play the same speed with multiple cues. IMO It doesn't really matter if you choose LD or solid maple, to each his/her own, but I what i do know is when you find the cue combination that works for YOU don't keep switching. I've asked some pros how long does it take to get used to a new cue? Answer= could take up to 6 months depends. When I switch cues my game drops a ball or 2 that's for sure. Interesting to see what others think. Good luck in your quest....
 
lunneborgc said:
I have been thinking a lot lately about putting down my low deflection shaft. I'm curious to see what other people think, and hear comments from others who have done this. I'm not trying to start a pissing match about which is the best LD or why anyone should/shouldn't play with one, just looking for information.

Here's my situation... I have a few cues that I love and I'd like to play with all of them, the problem is I'm "off" when I'm shooting with my other cues compared to my normal player with the LD shaft. I traded for a Russ Espiritu and a Tim Scruggs sneaky pete at the same time around two years ago. I played with both cues a bunch, but I personally liked the feel of the Scruggs, so it became my playing cue. I tried a friends Espiritu with an OB shaft and instantly I fell in love with the "feel" of the cue and purchased one myself. For the past year and a half or so I have been shooting with that combination. Durring that time I learned a ton about shooting, english, and studied up on the game of billiards. I'm happy with what I've learned any how my ability has advanced, but all this was done while shooting with a LD shaft. I would like to be able to pick up any of my cues and shoot nearly the same as I would with my player but I'm having difficulty executing shots/leaves I know I'm capable of. That's why I'm planning on switching back to plain maple shafts, for better consistency from cue to cue. I recently purchased a new cue, and am planning to use the shafts that came with it from the cue maker. From what I've read the shafts made by him are top notch. I'm on a loosing streak in my leagues and this is probably not the best time to make a change in my game, (is there ever?) but I'm determined. I know in my head the answer is practice, but it's been pretty frustrating so far. I plan on taking lessons from a local guy that's been referred to my by a fellow player. I know sounds like I've already answered my questions, and know what needs to be done, but I'm sure I'm not the first person that's been in this situation. I guess I'm just looking for tips/advice/support.

TIA - Noob
Click to expand...

I have never made the change from a Maple shaft to a lower deflection for shaft for the exact problem you are outlining. First no shaft Non-deflection or other wise is going to make you a great player only each of us can do that for ourselves. I think you did completely answer the question yourself, I mean the companies making the shafts you are speaking of certainly do not want you to do this. Lets face it, in ever sport soemthing new comes along that is going to make us equal to the great players we immulate, but in the end if it is to good to be true, it time to be suspicious. In most cases these products make you a slave to them like in your case, and in the end they cause more problems than they fix.

Take care.
 
softshot said:
ok... lemme get this straight...

YOU... are buying high end cues on a whim often enough to have several of them...

YOU choose not to use the entire cue you paid for...


You Choose to pay a fraction of the amount you paid for the ACTUAL shaft for a GIMICK shaft...

and yet somehow cannot FEEL why YOU paid so much money...

Bill Gates CANNOT buy a pool game... you have to earn it.. I don't care how much money you have...

you sound like a rich child with too many legos

they cost a lot

I gave it a half assed effort

but I can't make them work..


THEY are defective....

I am NOT the problem...
\
\





Grow Up..
Click to expand...

YOU completely missed my point...

I have one "high end cue" that I've owned for 2 years, not "several". The others are Lucasi, Nick Varner, and my scruggs. If you want to call the scruggs sneaky pete a high end cue that's your preference, mine's beat up with a bad finish, probably not worth much. My break cue is a plain jane with a phenolic tip.

You may consider the LD shaft a gimick, again that's your preference.

I'm not a "rich kid" and this has nothing to do with money.

I'm not trying to "buy a pool game".

I've given a lot of effort, and am very happy with what I've accomplished, even though I still have so much to learn.

I never said "I am not the problem", in fact I think I've said the opposite, the equipment I've used is great, so much so, that I'm having difficulty using "standard" shafts. I've found I'm not capable of making the same sort of shots with my other cues, and I'll have to learn how to become a better player through lessons and practice. I'm just simply looking for helpful information from others.

If you're only trying to flame me why are you even posting? As I stated earlier I don't want to start a pissing match.
 
softshot said:
ok... lemme get this straight...

YOU... are buying high end cues on a whim often enough to have several of them...

YOU choose not to use the entire cue you paid for...


You Choose to pay a fraction of the amount you paid for the ACTUAL shaft for a GIMICK shaft...

and yet somehow cannot FEEL why YOU paid so much money...

Bill Gates CANNOT buy a pool game... you have to earn it.. I don't care how much money you have...

you sound like a rich child with too many legos

they cost a lot

I gave it a half assed effort

but I can't make them work..


THEY are defective....

I am NOT the problem...
\
\





Grow Up..
Click to expand...

Damn softshot ............ kinda harsh on a newbie with only 4 posts aren't you? I think his post was just what he says it was, a way to get tips/advice/support. WTF?
 
Almost every pro, if not every money player around here uses an LD shaft, so lets not get into that issue again. LD gets you consistency, that's it. No magic pill. But if you are going pure maple, there are only a handful that can switch back and forth between maple shafts, never mind LD vs. maple. All that being said, let me chime in with the most often stated saying of this board.....that is so true.....ITS THE INDIAN, NOT THE ARROW! In other words, get your butt back to practice. You only get out what you put in. Oh, and if you are on a losing (spell check ?) streak, its probably because of other issues that just your shaft, like sequence, patterns, the types of shots you can and can't execute, etc.

So, get back on the road like everyone else and start walking towards whatever the heck pool players walk to. But to be sure, we're all walking......the same path. SOme are simply further on down the road.....

One final note to all. This board is one of the most consistently kind boards in all of cyberspace. For that, I and many others are very, very grateful. Rule of thumb: If you can't say something negative nicely, then please refrain from posting until you can. We're all adults and can read between lines. No need to shed blood making a point.

later,
tim
 
leaguedude said:
All I can really say is. I don't know any strong players that can play the same speed with multiple cues. IMO It doesn't really matter if you choose LD or solid maple, to each his/her own, but I what i do know is when you find the cue combination that works for YOU don't keep switching. I've asked some pros how long does it take to get used to a new cue? Answer= could take up to 6 months depends. When I switch cues my game drops a ball or 2 that's for sure. Interesting to see what others think. Good luck in your quest....
Click to expand...

I agree with you.
 
The Switch

I personally think its more about what you prefer in terms of hit!!!

Whether you use LD or Maple the hits are very different, this in my opinion is what means the most. I have tried numerous different LD shafts and in my opinion the olny shaft which come close to a maple shaft is the Mezz Hybrid Pro II.

You can execute the same shots using both shafts, however for LD shafts it can be easier to generate more spin. The main problem that you will have is the adjustment in you swinging arms fingers, in terms of the closing of the fingers when you actually hit the cueball.

It will usually take more time to learn the precise closing of the fingers for maple shafts rather than LD.

LD is a great invention no doubt but it all comes down to personal feel. I recently moved from a Mezz Hybrid Pro II to a Purpleheart SW. The transition has not been easy, however with time it gets better.

I personally like to use custom cuemakers shafts with my cues, i feel that they keep you on track with your stroke and you develop a good quality stroke. As they are not as forgiving as LD shafts can be.

My only advise i could give to smooth out the transition is to use a maple shaft, set up a standard shot, Then hit it over and over again. Then change the tip placement to 1 o'clock and keep going until you have practiced over and over again hitting different spots on cueball clock face.

I think if you did this for a week you would know quite well how to adjust for the deflection on your maple shaft pretty well. (Practice hitting the cueball at different speeds too)



i hope this helps:D




Roy
 
Bugs

Bugs Rucker comes to mind here. Recently deceased, Bugs, in his prime, was one of the best bank pool and one-pocket players on the planet. He was known for just grabbing a cue off the rack to play with. Didn't care what the weight was, just grabbed a cue and played at the highest levels. There is a famous story about him grabbing a cue and shooting 3-4 shots with it before realizing it had no tip, he was just shooting with the ferrule!

What's my point? I guess my point is that you can adapt to just about any cue, although I must admit that for most of us that adaptation can take a while.
 
lunneborgc said:
I have been thinking a lot lately about putting down my low deflection shaft. I'm curious to see what other people think, and hear comments from others who have done this. I'm not trying to start a pissing match about which is the best LD or why anyone should/shouldn't play with one, just looking for information.

Here's my situation... I have a few cues that I love and I'd like to play with all of them, the problem is I'm "off" when I'm shooting with my other cues compared to my normal player with the LD shaft. I traded for a Russ Espiritu and a Tim Scruggs sneaky pete at the same time around two years ago. I played with both cues a bunch, but I personally liked the feel of the Scruggs, so it became my playing cue. I tried a friends Espiritu with an OB shaft and instantly I fell in love with the "feel" of the cue and purchased one myself. For the past year and a half or so I have been shooting with that combination. Durring that time I learned a ton about shooting, english, and studied up on the game of billiards. I'm happy with what I've learned any how my ability has advanced, but all this was done while shooting with a LD shaft. I would like to be able to pick up any of my cues and shoot nearly the same as I would with my player but I'm having difficulty executing shots/leaves I know I'm capable of. That's why I'm planning on switching back to plain maple shafts, for better consistency from cue to cue. I recently purchased a new cue, and am planning to use the shafts that came with it from the cue maker. From what I've read the shafts made by him are top notch. I'm on a loosing streak in my leagues and this is probably not the best time to make a change in my game, (is there ever?) but I'm determined. I know in my head the answer is practice, but it's been pretty frustrating so far. I plan on taking lessons from a local guy that's been referred to my by a fellow player. I know sounds like I've already answered my questions, and know what needs to be done, but I'm sure I'm not the first person that's been in this situation. I guess I'm just looking for tips/advice/support.

TIA - Noob
Click to expand...


i've been there man. i switched from LD shafts to a maple shaft and it takes a lot of getting used to. i didn't really think that it did at first but when i look back i had to relearn a lot of shots.

it might take 3-4 weeks or it might take 6-8 months but you'll adjust. after you do going back every now and again will be a lot easier. basically after you've decided to make the change be don't mess around. just practice all the shots you miss over and over until you know how to adjust

just keep doing it over and over until it becomes second nature
 
This is something that i have struggled with too. on my first diveney i bought an OB1 and then an OB2 and really like both of them and played really well with them. I sold my cue to a friend and had to start shooting with a maple shaft and was terrible for a couple weeks. Now that ive gotten use to it I feel like my stroke is 100 times better and im playing better than i ever did w/ LD shafts. that could just be right now but like i said im positive that my stroke has improved since the switch. im going to stick with the maple for a while now and work on my game. just my 2c
 
I went throught the exact same thing. The LD shaft masked my crappy stroke and allowed me to get away with flaws that a standard shaft would not. I finally gave up the LD and it took me a year working on my stroke to get back to the level that I played with the LD shaft. My stroke is very straight now and I have passed that LD shaft plauteu.

My suggestion,
Get rid of the LD shaft. Get a quality instructor and ONLY focus on your stroke until it is perfectly straight. At that point you can switch between almost any cue with only a slight drop in your game. When I was addicted to LD, If I went to a bar, I looked helpless with any normal cue. Now that I am finished with Rehab, I can play good with a Homer Simpson Walmart Special.

The other thing I will mention...I used to hear good players/pros talk about deflection/squirt like it was not a huge concern. Now that I have a straight stroke, I agree. It is not nearly as difficult to adjust for when your cue goes back and forth in a straight line.
 
xianmacx said:
I went throught the exact same thing. The LD shaft masked my crappy stroke and allowed me to get away with flaws that a standard shaft would not. I finally gave up the LD and it took me a year working on my stroke to get back to the level that I played with the LD shaft. My stroke is very straight now and I have passed that LD shaft plauteu.

My suggestion,
Get rid of the LD shaft. Get a quality instructor and ONLY focus on your stroke until it is perfectly straight. At that point you can switch between almost any cue with only a slight drop in your game. When I was addicted to LD, If I went to a bar, I looked helpless with any normal cue. Now that I am finished with Rehab, I can play good with a Homer Simpson Walmart Special.

The other thing I will mention...I used to hear good players/pros talk about deflection/squirt like it was not a huge concern. Now that I have a straight stroke, I agree. It is not nearly as difficult to adjust for when your cue goes back and forth in a straight line.
Click to expand...

i'm surprised you struggled adjusting even on bar tables. deflection is kind of a non issue on bar tables.
 
softshot said:
ok... lemme get this straight...

YOU... are buying high end cues on a whim often enough to have several of them...

YOU choose not to use the entire cue you paid for...


You Choose to pay a fraction of the amount you paid for the ACTUAL shaft for a GIMICK shaft...

and yet somehow cannot FEEL why YOU paid so much money...

Bill Gates CANNOT buy a pool game... you have to earn it.. I don't care how much money you have...

you sound like a rich child with too many legos

they cost a lot

I gave it a half assed effort

but I can't make them work..


THEY are defective....

I am NOT the problem...
\
\





Grow Up..
Click to expand...

Geez softshot the guy was just looking for some opinions no need to be so rude to him.

I have used a predator 314 for over 10 year now and wouldn't use anything else. However I think every individual will have their own preference. I have noticed when playing with a standard maple shaft it definatly takes getting use to again. But when you change cues with anything it will take some adjustment. As we all know there is no magic cue it's hard work that brings people games to the top. A lot of cue makers make top quality standard shafts. I think a lot of the problem is in our heads when it comes to this subject. I know myself have to be comfortable that my cue will work for me in tough situations... and it is just myself doing it not the cue. Good luck to you on your experiments & making your game better.
 
Once i got a OB1 for my olney i made up my mind i was not going to buy another shooting cue. Why screw with a good thing ?
 
I play much, much, MUCH worse with an LD shaft. I play very well and seldom miss with a Pechauer proto of mine with a regular shaft, but recently I was playing with a Cory Barnhart PJ I just got that has a laminated shaft made by Cory that is supposed to be LD I think. I can't even aim the same way I used to or I miss ever single shot! I've had to completely adjust my aiming system to do anything at all. I actually contemplated quitting pool after missing some straight in shots that required slight left/right english.
 
troyroy78 said:
I personally think its more about what you prefer in terms of hit!!!

Whether you use LD or Maple the hits are very different, this in my opinion is what means the most. I have tried numerous different LD shafts and in my opinion the olny shaft which come close to a maple shaft is the Mezz Hybrid Pro II.

You can execute the same shots using both shafts, however for LD shafts it can be easier to generate more spin. The main problem that you will have is the adjustment in you swinging arms fingers, in terms of the closing of the fingers when you actually hit the cueball.

It will usually take more time to learn the precise closing of the fingers for maple shafts rather than LD.

LD is a great invention no doubt but it all comes down to personal feel. I recently moved from a Mezz Hybrid Pro II to a Purpleheart SW. The transition has not been easy, however with time it gets better.

I personally like to use custom cuemakers shafts with my cues, i feel that they keep you on track with your stroke and you develop a good quality stroke. As they are not as forgiving as LD shafts can be.

My only advise i could give to smooth out the transition is to use a maple shaft, set up a standard shot, Then hit it over and over again. Then change the tip placement to 1 o'clock and keep going until you have practiced over and over again hitting different spots on cueball clock face.

I think if you did this for a week you would know quite well how to adjust for the deflection on your maple shaft pretty well. (Practice hitting the cueball at different speeds too)



i hope this helps:D




Roy
Click to expand...

I'll be going to practice for a few hours today, I'll certainly take your advice setting up standard shots, then begin working my way around the cue ball with english. Thanks!
 
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