Who is doing full-splice cues these days?

Really? White/Mottey are doing their own blanks? Interesting, excellent news!

I was just looking at a James White this past weekend... You can certainly tell it comes from Mottey's shop! Without the signature, you can hardly tell who made it!

Anyway, I will add them to the list... May have to contact James White too...:)
 
Full-splice Russian pool cues

Folks:

Evgeny Stalev has a beautiful full-splice that is both his break cue and playing cue. The fact that he, one of the most powerful breakers, breaks with this full-splice playing cue, says a lot about its construction.

There was a thread about Russian pool cues here:

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?p=1807588

Alexander Efremov, the cue luthier that made Evgeny's cue, has other full-splice work on display here:

http://efremovcues.com/eng/efrcue_eng.htm

Truly beautiful craftsmanship on display in both those links!
-Sean
 
Cue Guru said:
I saw his site, (Murray Tucker) but beleive he is getting blanks from Prather or Cue Components- I haven't seen any with veneers. I was trying to keep it to that croud, but he does in fact offer full splice cues, as your link shows.

If he is making his own blanks, and does offer veneers, I would like to know, and will gladly add him to the roster in that case.;)
Click to expand...


Early on, Murray did a few non-veneered FS cues using Schmelke blanks. However, he has not used a pre-made FS blank for a while now. He has re-tooled his shop to be able to make his own, both veneered and non-veneered, FS blanks.

The first Brazilian rosewood FS on his site with the ivory butt plate was completed for a member here fairly recently. The next one from there is BdR, and was made for me, the next one is PH/Ebony and was made for a member here, the last one shown is another Brazilian rosewood, and that one was made for himself...but I hear that his wife has appropriated it. :wink: All of the aforementioned are from FS blanks that he crafted himself.

I have seen an example of his veneered FS blanks...but he will not use them until he has them perfect. They are actually pretty good right now, but Murray is a stickler for getting to as close to perfection with his blanks as possible. Also, he has been incredibly busy with his family business, and has produced very very few cues in the last couple of years. It may be a little bit before we see one of these surface as a cue...but I am fairly sure that we will. :)


As to the Prather shop...it is my understanding that Jeff Prather is the one actually making the veneered FS blanks....Dan Sr's son. Their veneered FS blanks are of very high quality....I am actually expecting my Prather blank cue to be delivered tomorrow evening. :D

Lisa
 
Thanks, Lisa!

I'l add Murry to the list.

As to Prather, I think that name is "the company" Prather, and not Dan himself. I don't think he makes many cues at all these days (but he still does) and if he did/does a full-splice he will use a Prather blank (that aparently his son makes) in his cue.

So, yes, the one maker is not making the ENTIRE cue; however it is all the same family!

I beleive Tascarella falls into this catergory as well- Pete and Pete Jr. working as a team at the moment, with Jr. doing the bulk of the work.

Anyone correct me if I'm wrong...:)
 
Cue Guru said:
Thanks, Lisa!

I'l add Murry to the list.

As to Prather, I think that name is "the company" Prather, and not Dan himself. I don't think he makes many cues at all these days (but he still does) and if he did/does a full-splice he will use a Prather blank (that aparently his son makes) in his cue.

So, yes, the one maker is not making the ENTIRE cue; however it is all the same family!

I beleive Tascarella falls into this catergory as well- Pete and Pete Jr. working as a team at the moment, with Jr. doing the bulk of the work.

Anyone correct me if I'm wrong...:)
Click to expand...


No problem...just make sure to spell it right....LoL. Murray Tucker III/Tucker Cue Works.

Lisa
 
sfleinen said:
Folks:

Evgeny Stalev has a beautiful full-splice that is both his break cue and playing cue. The fact that he, one of the most powerful breakers, breaks with this full-splice playing cue, says a lot about its construction.

There was a thread about Russian pool cues here:

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?p=1807588

Alexander Efremov, the cue luthier that made Evgeny's cue, has other full-splice work on display here:

http://efremovcues.com/eng/efrcue_eng.htm

Truly beautiful craftsmanship on display in both those links!
-Sean
Click to expand...

Very interesting information! I'm sure it will be checked out by many members here...:thumbup:
 
Is there any differnce in the quality between full splice and the other cues? I mean did they hit very differntly and which is better option-full splice or for example 4,6,8 point cue?I will be very happy, if somebody can explain me,because I don't have any idea.. Thanks ;)
 
Last edited:
jus7_1nsan3 said:
Is there any differnce in the quality between full splice and the other cues? I mean did they hit very differntly and which is better option-full splice or for example 4,6,8 point cue?I will be very happy, if somebody can explain me,because I don't have any idea.. Thanks ;)
Click to expand...

I do not think that any one construction technique, with regards to full (long) splice and short splice, that is 'better' than the other. Makers have been using the short splice technique for many many moons now, and it has held tried and true. In days past, most full (long) splices were actually crafted in a production type setting...Brunswick, and later on...Helmstetter, Adams, Dufferin, etc. I would suspect that this was partly due to the fact that crafting a full (long) splice requires special jigs, and a lot of material waste.

Then along came Burton Spain...who developed a special full splicing technique that was all his own. That same technique can still be found today in the cues of Joel Hercek, and in the blanks and cues of John Davis, Burton's protege.

I think the differences between the full and short splices, with regards to play, is simply a matter of preference. For those, like myself, who came up playing with the barstick off the rack, it is a familiar feel in the hand...and so I have found that I really prefer playing with a wrapless full splice cue. I also happen to generally prefer the looks as well. However, there are many makers who make a bang-up playing short spliced cue...and have for a long time.

Lisa
 
ridewiththewind said:
I do not think that any one construction technique, with regards to full (long) splice and short splice, that is 'better' than the other. Makers have been using the short splice technique for many many moons now, and it has held tried and true. In days past, most full (long) splices were actually crafted in a production type setting...Brunswick, and later on...Helmstetter, Adams, Dufferin, etc. I would suspect that this was partly due to the fact that crafting a full (long) splice requires special jigs, and a lot of material waste.

Then along came Burton Spain...who developed a special full splicing technique that was all his own. That same technique can still be found today in the cues of Joel Hercek, and in the blanks and cues of John Davis, Burton's protege.

I think the differences between the full and short splices, with regards to play, is simply a matter of preference. For those, like myself, who came up playing with the barstick off the rack, it is a familiar feel in the hand...and so I have found that I really prefer playing with a wrapless full splice cue. I also happen to generally prefer the looks as well. However, there are many makers who make a bang-up playing short spliced cue...and have for a long time.

Lisa
Click to expand...

Thanks for the answer !!! I believe that all big manufacterers don't use full splice.I mean Predator,schon,viking and so on.
 
jus7_1nsan3 said:
Thanks for the answer !!! I believe that all big manufacterers don't use full splice.I mean Predator,schon,viking and so on.
Click to expand...

That is why in my post I stated 'in days past'. :) Most of the manufacturers that you have listed above have actually moved almost all their cue lines into that of large production CNC. In this case, most of the points are inlayed, as opposed to spliced in.

Lisa
 
Is the full splice technique better?

In my opinion, yes.

Now, that being said, ever hit with a Szamboti? Both Gus and Barry do (did) short splice points- four separate pieces set into the v-grooves. They hit as good, if not better, than a full splice does. I had the unique pleasure of hitting with a very old Gus years ago- the chance to buy it too, but I couldn't come up with all the money fast enough. That is a big regret- it went to a collector in Japan in stead.:mad:

The reason is in Burton's book: Burton made full-splice blanks for Balabushka and once George got them, he would cut the handle off to add "bushka" rings. So Burton figured why the hell am I doing all this work, when I can send him short splices (by the way, I hate that term for this method)- just a forearm with four seperate points and veneer stacks. WAY easier to make perfect, and he is quite happy with them, and I can control the quality to a higher standard. Everyone is happy.

So, that became the norm in the industry and the full-splice was nearly a totally lost art.

Then Burton's last hoorah was to re-introduce the world to the full-splice blank, and the price of old Titlist cues went through the roof shortly thereafter.

I was always facinated with the 'technology' if you will of just how that joint is done. So, with Burton's book in hand, I made one.:)

People once again realized that splicing the wood produces a continuous circuit from the joint through the handle, and I fell (as do some others out there) that this is the way to do it. I equate it to the neck-through design of guitar making. Yes, the bolt-on Strat and glued-on Gibson sound great, but the idea of a complete circuit from the nut to the bridge and the strings on top makes (in my opinion) a superior instrument. More sustain, better tone, no problems with alignment. Just better. BUT, it is expensive, and not every custom guitar buyer wants that technique...

Making a full splice with high-precision is not easy- milling four or more points into a turned forearm running on centers IS easy- easy in the fact that a very high level of precision is achievable with relatively low cost equipment. Mill, dividing head, 90 degree cutter, patience. That's all you need to make great forearms.

In a full-splice, if you do not make the splice cuts absolutely perfectly, the forearm and handle will not splice together perfectly, and the points will not be even when it is turned- there can be NO run out at this joint, because run out leads to uneven points. Some corrections can be made if your stock is large enough, but in general, no one wants to use such huge pieces.

This is why my first cue does not have even points- it was not cut to the level of precision needed for even points. And you see the result.

Think about this- the angle you cut in the forearm is (if I remember back the 10 years ago) 1 degree or so. that shallow angle has zero tolerance for run-out. 0.003 run out will equate to a clearly visible disparity in finished point height. 0.003 is the thickness of a sheet of paper- not a lot...

I also feel I have a greater respect for those who make a full splice, because I DO understand what is involved in the process first hand, and when a nice even set of points are the result, it is a truly beautiful thing to see and most importantly, to play with!:thumbup:
 
maldito said:
Great looking cues - design (simple ,elegant, classy) - but it looks like you are gonna wait if you got one in the making - and he is not taking orders currently - don't know how they play - anyone out there got one???


http://murraytucker.com/
Click to expand...

I do!! http://www.murraytucker.com/bdrfs1.htm

Murray never really did take orders, in the traditional sense. He typically makes what he likes, and then finds the 'right' person for the cue OR he pays attention to what someone may be wishing for in a cue, and if it sounds interesting to him, then he makes it...but he still does what he likes with regards to the design element. This keeps it fresh and interesting for him.

People are forewarned going in by Murray himself, that he is not going to break any land speed records with regards to the build time. Murray is a self-admitted 'hobbyist' cue maker. He works at his family's extremely busy business: http://www.tuckerbuilt.com/ He is also a dedicated family man, and spends as much time with them as he can when not working. If there is time left over for him to get in to the shop, then he does. However, summertime is when he is likely to go 'walkabout'...preferring to spend his free time with his family doing some saltwater fishing or playing golf.

It is for those reasons mentioned above that he does not really take orders, nor accepts deposits. He will not accept payment of any kind until the cue is ready to ship. Patience is an absolute requirement.

With all that said...his cues are even cleaner than they look in the pics, if that is even imaginable. I have been told by another Tucker owner who did do side-by-side comparisons with a SugarTree, and a Zylr...that the Tucker's hit and play is very comparable. This Tucker owner sold off both his ST and Zylr in favor of the Tucker. That is saying a LOT! Also, the fact that you very very rarely ever see one come available for sale is another testament of how well these cues are made and play. I know that I will never part with mine, and have been made some very generous offers for it.

Murray is a great guy to work with, and I would do it again in a minute. I suspect that as his children get older, he will find his way back in to the shop and start making more cues...maybe even more frequently. I do know that at one point, he was planning on setting up his shop to do strictly full splice cues. Only time will tell what Murray has in store for us next!! :thumbup:

Lisa
 
Add Ed Prewitt to the list. No blanks for planned for sale but they will appear as Ed's cues real soon.

Martin



Cue Guru said:
Hello everyone.

I was curious about something.

We all know that less than 10 years ago, there wae very few cue makers still doing a full splice butt (other than house cue conversions).

Burton Spain always did that (with a few exceptions I assume) and he handed his knolege over to Joel Hercek, so he's doing it now.

So, like Joel, who is making their own full splice blanks and completing them into cues these days?

Anyway, here's a list of the ones I know of... (Thanks to members who have clarified and added to this list!!!)

John Davis
Peter Tascarella
Joel Hercek
Paul Mottey
James White
Prather
S&S Cues
Blackcreek Cues
Fanelli
Mark Bear
Murray Tucker

There are others who are offering full splice cues, but I don't know if they make their own blanks. Even Prather is a bit off an odd one, as he makes the blanks and he makes the cues, but not necessarily makes a specific blank for a specic cue if you know what I mean, but regardless, he makes full splice blanks and cues (or his compoany does anyway).

Back on track- who makes full splice blanks and cues these days? Am I wrong in my list above (which I will continue to edit as other cue makers are brought to my attention)? In general, this is a blank with veneers I am refering to. Joe Barringer makes full splice blanks with no veneers (that I am aware of) again- please correct me as I want a reliable list when I am done for everyone who is interested, to rely on.

Anyway, thanks for the input guys. I love the full splice, and want to see that art form continue long after we are gone.:thumbup:
Click to expand...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top