What's in a pocket? The answers.

Tbeaux

Tbeaux

Angelic Hotdog
Silver Member
The recent tight pocket thread by RealKingCobra ( http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=145007 ) got me to thinking. First I can't think of any better way to compare pocket tightness than Roger Longs formula. However as RKC indicated there are exceptions and other factors that play into how tight a pocket is and how "fair or tough" it plays.

The following posts show all of the things that I am aware of that play into judging a pocket and have added "MY PERSONAL RATINGS FOR EACH ASPECT". Your opinion may differ. My ratings are based partly on WPA and BCA specs, partly on what forum mechs have indicated and partly on personal preference.:p

So without ado.......
 
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Pocket Mouth Opening

Pocket Mouth Opening

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cut2.JPG
 
Pocket Cut Angle

Pocket Cut Angle

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cut4.JPG

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This is only intended to indicate proper angle.
 
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each mechanic will have different formula's they use. And there pockets will play differently. And each mechanic will have a different idea on how a pocket should play. When choosing a mechanic to tighten pockets you should chose someone who specializes in this area.
 
Great post. Nice to see someone go through that much trouble to share their knowledge. If others could agree on it or maybe edit just a bit where any editing might be needed if any then it would make for a great sticky for people such as myself or others who aren't installers so we would have something to judge against when some one comes over to do a rail or recover job! Thanks again.
 
sdbilliards said:
each mechanic will have different formula's they use. And there pockets will play differently. And each mechanic will have a different idea on how a pocket should play. When choosing a mechanic to tighten pockets you should chose someone who specializes in this area.
Click to expand...

Yep, what you say is very true. These measurements are mainly based on WPA and BCA tournament specs and even they vary from one another slightly. For home tables, some of the manufacturers seem to use slightly different "formulations" (like different pocket cut angle which can cause a change in mouth opening which will change shelf setback).
 
bayoublaster400 said:
Great post. Nice to see someone go through that much trouble to share their knowledge. If others could agree on it or maybe edit just a bit where any editing might be needed if any then it would make for a great sticky for people such as myself or others who aren't installers so we would have something to judge against when some one comes over to do a rail or recover job! Thanks again.
Click to expand...

Thank you. That is my hope also regarding the table mechs input. For instance my ratings of facing thickness and material composition. That one is partially surmised by a statement from RKC on the other thread. If it's off in his or others opinions I hope they will state so, and why. It's just meant to be a general guide.:smile:
 
Actually most are busy we all have read it something's need a little tweaking but it is a good start. I think were just waiting for others to post up what they think are waiting for more question. I think alot of people need time to study it observe it and look at the table they are playing on to really see what was drawn out and understand it.

I almost added drawing to mine but didnt just getting used to auto cad 2009 again.

Lets keep bumping to the top and see what happens I think a few tweaks and we could maybe use it as a sticky also for future answers.


Most pool players are not mathmatitions. It takes time


Craig
 
My thanks to Tbeaux for starting this thread, and to TableTek for bumping it; I missed it the first time around. Along with Roger Long's formula, this explains a number of things I've noticed, particularly why my current table - a ten year old Olhausen - seems to me to play tighter than the pocket mouth width alone would indicate.

I'm not a mechanic by any means. As a customer, though, I would really like it if manufacturers would make all tables meet the WPA pocket (and other) specifications. I realize those aren't perfect; in particular, the shelf depth specification allows far too much variation (1.0" to 2.25", which is silly - better would be something like 1.75" to 2.0"). However, those would at least make a reasonable start toward standardization, even if it would take two or three decades for the majority of "non-standard" tables to be replaced.
 
Take into concideration a family table, commercial coin op, Tournament or gambling table.

1 Family loose pockets more fun for the family to hang out and enjoy the time together.

2 Commercial table loose pockets faster income then hourly rented.
tight pockets more beer sales less table income longer games for average players.

3 tournament then what specs WPA, BCA, USPPA, or tournament promoters specs stock or custom.

4 Gambling table Deep shelf tight pocket big target or small target big pocket or small target and small pocket.

Now which game 8,9,10 one pocket, banks, asian one pocket, Honolulu?

Some want corner pockets to line p on the diamonds and centerof pocket to line up on center of side pocket . Others think corner should line up to top of side pocket and first diamond below side pocket.

I can put more in here but most have heard what there buddy thinks is right.

Craig
 
For the users in this thread interested in how to measure and characterize how difficult a table plays, check out the new Table Difficulty Factor (TDF) thread.

I would appreciate any suggestions of feedback you might have regarding this new system.

Thanks,
Dave
 
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