Question about table lighting

DogsPlayingPool

DogsPlayingPool

"What's in your wallet?"
Silver Member
I'm installing a 4 bulb fluorescent table light. I can choose to use either 4 foot T8 bulbs or T12's. Being that the T8's are 32 watt and the T12's are 40 watt, I'm thinking of going with the T12's since it will provide more light. I should mention however that the light previously had T8 bulbs (I'm putting in brand new fixtures and that's why I can go either way).

Is there any particular reason that the T8 bulb is better for table lighting and that's why the light previously had these? Or is either fine and I'm better off going with the T12's to get that bit of extra light?

Thanks for any help. I'm kind of "dim" when it comes to electronics. :o
 
Last edited:
DogsPlayingPool said:
I'm installing a 4 bulb fluorescent table light. I can choose to use either 4 foot T8 bulbs or T12's. Being that the T8's are 32 watt and the T12's are 40 watt, I'm thinking of going with the T12's since it will provide more light. I should mention however that the light previously had T8 bulbs (I'm putting in brand new fixtures and that's why I can go either way).

Is there any particular reason that the T8 bulb is better for table lighting and that's why the light previously had these? Or is either fine and I'm better off going with the T12's to get that bit of extra light?

Thanks for any help. I'm kind of "dim" when it comes to electronics. :o
Click to expand...

t8's cost less to use (more efficient that t12's). Its not the wattage that you should be interested in but the lumens and color.
 
Last edited:
I don't know that the lumens are listed on the bulbs and that's why I was going by the wattage. Do the T8's put out more lumens?

I know that the T8's are a little more efficient but this is not for a commercial application so I'm not too worried about the light bill from this. The T8 fixtures cost a little more, the cost of the bulbs is not important for as often as I will need to change them.

I just figured that 4 T12's was basically equal to 5 T8's (wattage-wise anyway).

For color I was going to go with the cool whites in either case. Is this the preferred color for table lighting?

Also, assuming I can get the lumen output for both bulbs, is there such a thing as too much light? Or is the higher light output preferred?

Again, I do appreciate the assistance.
 
Last edited:
DogsPlayingPool said:
I don't know that the lumens are listed on the bulbs and that's why I was going by the wattage. Do the T8's put out more lumens?

I know that the T8's are a little more efficient but this is not for a commercial application so I'm not too worried about the light bill from this. The T8 fixtures cost a little more, the cost of the bulbs is not important for as often as I will need to change them.

I just figured that 4 T12's was basically equal to 5 T8's (wattage-wise anyway).

For color I was going to go with the cool whites in either case. Is this the preferred color for table lighting?

Also, assuming I can get the lumen output for both bulbs, is there such a thing as too much light? Or is the higher light output preferred?

Again, I do appreciate the assistance.
Click to expand...

You should look at the packages for lumens, and you can do this at home depot. 32 watts vs 40 watts could be the same amount of lumens but you pay more for the 40 watts in electricity. The color is something that most people on here don't agree on , but my preference is daylight.
 
Doh, I checked the packaging again and the lumen output is listed. The T12's put out 3200 lumens and the T8's produce 2850 (the wattages of 40 and 32 is the amount of energy used).

So, do I favor the T12's for the higher output, given that I'm not too concerned with the light bill?

Also, is cool white the correct color? I suppose I can just try different colors until I find the one I prefer. So the main thing is deciding between the T8's and T12's.

Much obliged.
 
I'm not sure you have a choice, given that the ballast will determine what size lamp you can use, either t12 (1.25") or t8 (1"). Although the ends will accept either lamp the ballast is designed to run one or the other size lamp. T8 is the way to go if you have a choice like Majic said. Cool white light is usually for warehouse lighting, with a total disregard for color rendering. A phillips 841 T8 bulb is perfect for pool tables, a 741 is a pretty good choice too.
 
InLine said:
I'm not sure you have a choice, given that the ballast will determine what size lamp you can use, either t12 (1.25") or t8 (1"). Although the ends will accept either lamp the ballast is designed to run one or the other size lamp. T8 is the way to go if you have a choice like Majic said. Cool white light is usually for warehouse lighting, with a total disregard for color rendering. A phillips 841 T8 bulb is perfect for pool tables, a 741 is a pretty good choice too.
Click to expand...

I can go either way because I'm putting in new fixtures that have the ballasts in them, so I can get either the T8 or T12.

Why is T8 the way to go if the T12's put out more light? Is there something other than the lower light bill that makes the T8 the better choice? Is it the way it throws light or less glare, or something that makes it better? Again, I did note the light had T8's in it and I'm just wondering if there is a good reason the T8 is preferred over the T12 for table lighting. The light was in a pool hall so I can see for a commercial application with 20+ tables on all day and night long, the light bill could make a difference but I don't care about that. I just want the best lighting.

Also, in regard to color, what are#741 and #841 bulbs? I've not seen colors labeled by numbers, but more with descriptive labels like "cool white" or "daylight".

Thanks.
 
Last edited:
If you have a choice of lamps, why not just go with the High Output t8 lamp?
You could have bulbs 86w or even 105w that way. It's always better to be safe than sorry. Right now i have a lamp with 4 75w t12's and the lighting is great. Also in regards to which color, i find that for pool the "soft white" is the best. It has a yellowish color to it like the bulbs in pool halls. The cool white is too "white" for pool.
 
I just looked at the standard 4 foot T8 and T12 fixtures at Home Depot. Can I put the high output bulbs into them or do I need special fixtures for the high output bulbs with special ballasts? Or can I put any watt T8 bulb in the fixture as long as it has a T8 ballast?

The bulbs I was looking at there were just the standard 4 foot bulbs and that was what they were (2850 lumens/32 watts for the T8 and 3200/40 watts for the T12). So they have higher output bulbs that I just didn't happen to see? Then the questiuon is do they require special fixtures/ballasts.
 
Last edited:
DogsPlayingPool said:
I just looked at the standard 4 foot T8 and T12 fixtures at Home Depot. Can I put the high output bulbs into them or do I need special fixtures for the high output bulbs with special ballasts?

The bulbs I was looking at there were just the standard 4 foot bulbs and that was what they were (2850 lumens/32 watts for the T8 and 3200/40 watts for the T12). So they have higher output bulbs that I just didn't happen to see? Then the questiuon is do they require special fixtures/ballasts.
Click to expand...


Yes, they require a special lamp for them. You can see the High Output bulbs have different ends on them. The regular bulbs have 1 pin where as the high output bulbs have like a thin slot thing. They sell the fixtures as Home Depot or Lowe's and they aren't that much more money than regular fixtures. All of the lights should be on display so you can see how bright they are.
 
DogsPlayingPool said:
I just looked at the standard 4 foot T8 and T12 fixtures at Home Depot. Can I put the high output bulbs into them or do I need special fixtures for the high output bulbs with special ballasts?

The bulbs I was looking at there were just the standard 4 foot bulbs and that was what they were (2850 lumens/32 watts for the T8 and 3200/40 watts for the T12). So they have higher output bulbs that I just didn't happen to see? Then the questiuon is do they require special fixtures/ballasts.
Click to expand...
HO tubes require HO ballasts
My suggestion is T8 32 watt with cool white tubes
This is what the Brunswick lights come with and they are terrific!!!!
 
The T-8s are the direction of the future, and eventually the T-12s will be phased out. This will take a very long time, though, so it probably won't have much of an effect on you, given how many of them are out there.

I was surprised to see that the lumen output on the T-12s was higher than that of the T-8s. On my bulbs it was just the reverse. I used T-8s and got more light and higher efficiency. Maybe it's related to color temperature.

My preference is for 6500K bulbs. They are the closest to daylight you can get for anything like a reasonable price. I love the color, but YMMV. Go with what you like.
 
fish on said:
HO tubes require HO ballasts
My suggestion is T8 32 watt with cool white tubes
This is what the Brunswick lights come with and they are terrific!!!!
Click to expand...

This is why you need to look for yourself. Personally, i find the t8 32watt bulbs way too dark and not enough light. Also, the cool white is an awkward color for pool. You probably notice almost all pool halls have that yellowish tinted light to it, which is the color of the "soft/warm white"
 
I'll have to check but I'm guessing that going to the high output set up (6500K) will significantly increase the cost since I'm talking about fixtures and ballasts in addition to the cost of the bulbs.

I had bought the T12 fixtures but now may return them and go with the T8. Heck, 4 bulbs putting out 2850 lumens each ought to be sufficient. That Brunswick uses that set up in their light is pretty goods testimony. And that is the set up that was in the light to begin with, and the light was in a pool hall.

As far as color, I suppose I can dink around with that and see what I like. If I try cool white and decide I like soft white or daylight better, I'm only out the cost of the bulbs. Not the end of the world.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like 4 X 2850 T8's will be good quality table lighting.
 
DogsPlayingPool said:
I'll have to check but I'm guessing that going to the high output set up (6500K) will significantly increase the cost since I'm talking about fixtures and ballasts in addition to the cost of the bulbs.

I had bought the T12 fixtures but now may return them and go with the T8. Heck, 4 bulbs putting out 2850 lumens each ought to be sufficient. That Brunswick uses that set up in their light is pretty goods testimony. And that is the set up that was in the light to begin with, and the light was in a pool hall.

As far as color, I suppose I can dink around with that and see what I like. If I try cool white and decide I like soft white or daylight better, I'm only out the cost of the bulbs. Not the end of the world.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like 4 X 2850 T8's will be good quality table lighting.
Click to expand...
I just checked previous post and the 20 Brunswick lights each have 6- 4' T8 cool white tubes ie 2- 3 tube lights inside 8' light box!
nobody that plays there have complained since I installed them!
 
Last edited:
Well, I went back to Home Depot and Lowe's today. It appears the high output stuff is a specialty item. They had some HO bulbs but no 4 footers. And I would have to special order the fixtures.

So I'm going with the standard T8's. They are actually pretty bright and with four bulbs right over the pool table it should be good. After all this is the set up the light had before and it was in one of Jay Helfert's pool halls.

I looked at the colors and I'm going to start out trying the daylight. According to the descriptions of the various colors, this is the one that produces truer colors and I think that's what I want. The daylight is also about the brightest of all of them so it should be plenty of light. They also had a color called "natural sun" that I may try just for the ducks of it.

Thanks for all your help, I really appreciate it as I want to get this right. I also appreciate the quick assistance as I need to get this handled since the table and light are scheduled to go up Friday.

Rep to all you guys. :thumbup:
 
DogsPlayingPool said:
Well, I went back to Home Depot and Lowe's today. It appears the high output stuff is a specialty item. They had some HO bulbs but no 4 footers. And I would have to special order the fixtures.

So I'm going with the standard T8's. They are actually pretty bright and with four bulbs right over the pool table it should be good. After all this is the set up the light had before and it was in one of Jay Helfert's pool halls.

I looked at the colors and I'm going to start out trying the daylight. According to the descriptions of the various colors, this is the one that produces truer colors and I think that's what I want. The daylight is also about the brightest of all of them so it should be plenty of light. They also had a color called "natural sun" that I may try just for the ducks of it.

Thanks for all your help, I really appreciate it as I want to get this right. I also appreciate the quick assistance as I need to get this handled since the table and light are scheduled to go up Friday.

Rep to all you guys. :thumbup:
Click to expand...
This is my home table and I went to homedepot and got the cool white for my lights . It's not too bad but it works for now .


DSC03454.jpg
 
T-8 is the way to go................

My light that I built for my GC1 has two fixtures. They are 8 foot tandem fixtures that take 4 T-8 lamps each. I built a really nice fixture for around 200.00 with all the material,stain and finished trim pieces. I started with the daybright bulbs but found that after a few hours on the table they caused eye strain which let to the mother of all headaches. I changed to the cool white bulbs #781. I've been using them over a week and it's perfect on my tournament blue simonis cloth. As a master electrician I can tell you to stay clear of the T-12 fixtures as they will cause you untold grief over the life of the fixture. They are heavy as they use a magnetic ballast filled with tar that can seep when the ballast is near the end of it's life and make a mess all over your beautiful table, not to mention the fire hazard. When a T-12 bulb takes a dump, the entire fixture goes out. With a T-8 electronic ballasted fixture, when a bulb goes out, the rest of the fixture stays lit. It is also more energy efficient and stays a lot cooler.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top