cuesmith deluxe crossfeed question

tableman

tableman

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Let me start by saying I have 2 deluxes and use them every day. I really like my machines. My question is, why is there so much "play" in the crossfeed? When I turn the dial it turns about 1/2 of a turn before the cutter actually moves. Both have done this since I got them. Doesn't this make the numbers on the dial basically useless if my cutter doesn't start moving as soon as I turn the dial. Anyone else had this problem? I have used many machine lathes in the past and never had this problem. Thanks for any help.
 
I have a 5 year old cross feed and the new cross feed with the thrust bearing in it. The new one turns 5 times easier, but they both have the same play.

When using my router and my handle is anywhere between 6 and 12 o'clock you better remember where it was before you move it next time because it falls back to 6 from the vibration. Kind of like playing the wind in the outfield. :)
 
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Seems like a bit of a guessing game doesn't it. Is there not some way to make this more of a direct drive from handle to crossfeed? It's pretty frustrating sometimes. I was just comparing the 2 machines. The newer machine has little to no play whereas the older has nearly 1/2 turn of play. The biggest difference I have been able to find is the brass "nut" underneath that the crossfeed threads into. On the machine with the slack, that "nut" sets into it's hole loosely whereas on the machine with no slack that nut sets in it's hole with almost a pressed fit having to be pryed out with a screwdriver. I'll continue to tinker today.
 
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I'd say that you've found the source of your excessive play; the feed-screw nut.
It should be anchored in such a way as to not be allowed to move. Any movement in that nut will result in excessive wear of the threads within the nut.
It may be too late to save this nut. Brass is used in this application because of it self-lubricating properties. A replacement nut could be fabricated from steel but would need to be lubricated routinely. Again, that nut should not be allowed to move.
 
In most applications where brass is used, it is intended to be a wear item to prevent wearing of other more expensive parts to replace. May be the case here. I'm sure Chris is at the SBE now but I'll get in touch with him next week and order 2 or 3 of these nuts to keep on hand. Shouldn't be too expensive I wouldn't think. :confused:
 
The dial knob its self is threaded, and you can't tighten it on the machine, take the slide off and hold the threaded rod where their is no threads with a pare of pliers and tighten the dial, after it is tight tighten the brass nut. I had to drill a hole in my brass nut because it wasn't going down far enough to secure the dial. That should help. Good Luck
 
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tableman said:
Let me start by saying I have 2 deluxes and use them every day. I really like my machines. My question is, why is there so much "play" in the crossfeed? When I turn the dial it turns about 1/2 of a turn before the cutter actually moves. Both have done this since I got them. Doesn't this make the numbers on the dial basically useless if my cutter doesn't start moving as soon as I turn the dial. Anyone else had this problem? I have used many machine lathes in the past and never had this problem. Thanks for any help.
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The reason for the play is because it has a nut and thread arrangement.
Some lathes have preloaded backlash eliminating ball screw assemblies.There is a rating as to how much load they take before having play.
They work very well but cost alot of money.
1 assembly alone is worth more than your lathe.
You can get a setup made to fit into the minilathes.They are not off the shelf items.
I worked at a place and made such items.
In short , there will usually be backlash. Sometimes it is because the handle to the collar has too much play. Other times it is because the nut and screw have wear. Some have a split in the nut and a screw that either opens apart or closes together the nut threads to make it have less lineal play. I am not sure what they have exactly on the mini lathes.
Another option is to have the cross slide spring loaded like in the situation of setting up a taper bar etc.Then the play is reduced. Load it in such a way that the direction you use most, has the load against the nut.
Neil
 
cross-feed

tableman said:
Let me start by saying I have 2 deluxes and use them every day. I really like my machines. My question is, why is there so much "play" in the crossfeed? When I turn the dial it turns about 1/2 of a turn before the cutter actually moves. Both have done this since I got them. Doesn't this make the numbers on the dial basically useless if my cutter doesn't start moving as soon as I turn the dial. Anyone else had this problem? I have used many machine lathes in the past and never had this problem. Thanks for any help.
Click to expand...

What I do is a quick fix, I pre-load the cross feed, meaning I use the spring to load the cross feed in one dircetion only, this way it's more postive, and not so much sloop.You can attach a spring to the cross feed table, pulling it towards the work to be machined. Works for me on all of my lathes, large or small. If you need to visit with me for more detailed info, please give me a call. Hope this helps you.
830-275-0302
blud
 
cross slide play

I installed a dial indicator on the cross slide. So the knob play doesnt come in to play at all on mine. Try it, you might like it..
 
All manual lathes and mills (non cnc) have backlash in their handwheels. This is one of the first fundamental things you are taught when using them.

What you are supposed to do is to always take out the slop in the backlash by going in the opposite direction you intend first by an amount greater than the backlash of your system. Then you move in the direction you intend. This way your numbers are always correct. This method will work if you have an 1/8 turn of backlash or a full turn of backlash.

As others stated, there are tricks to minimize this backlash, both as a machine modification, and as a machine adjustment.

But regardless, the main thing to take from this is this is not a problem. All lathes and mills have this, and you must understand how it works and how to compensate for it, so that you can always trust your number.
 
zx24 said:
I installed a dial indicator on the cross slide. So the knob play doesnt come in to play at all on mine. Try it, you might like it..
Click to expand...

Even if you have a DRO or manual dial indicator on your axis, you must still understand the principle of backlash. The reason is you can be dead nuts on your position, as read by the dial indicator, but be on the wrong side of the screw. This means as you start the cut the force transferred to the tool will move your crosslide until the backlash is taken up, making your dial indicator also move.

We have mills with DRO's at work, and people always make the mistake of blindly going by what the DRO says. I walk up to them and tell them that number is not to be blindly trusted, and then push on the table (not the handscrews) and make the number move until the backlash is taken up. You must understand which direction the cutting forces are going to act on the system, and make sure the nut and screw are line to line in that direction.
 
iusedtoberich said:
All manual lathes and mills (non cnc) have backlash in their handwheels. This is one of the first fundamental things you are taught when using them.

What you are supposed to do is to always take out the slop in the backlash by going in the opposite direction you intend first by an amount greater than the backlash of your system. Then you move in the direction you intend. This way your numbers are always correct. This method will work if you have an 1/8 turn of backlash or a full turn of backlash.

As others stated, there are tricks to minimize this backlash, both as a machine modification, and as a machine adjustment.

But regardless, the main thing to take from this is this is not a problem. All lathes and mills have this, and you must understand how it works and how to compensate for it, so that you can always trust your number.
Click to expand...
You said it much better than I could have. Great post.
 
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