How Do You Aim By Feel
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Glad to know someone else understands! :thumbup: haha
It's gotten to the point where I trust how I see the shot more than anything else. I'm starting to get a system down where I can go through a checklist to correct my flaws.
If I can't see the shot, my head is probably tilted (happens once in a while as I'm right handed, but left eye dominant). If I CAN see it, there's something else wrong with my mechanics...
Joey,
I don't know if you include me in the "detractors of CTE" camp or not, but I certainly look forward to hearing what you think about CTE in terms of some of the claims that have been made. Here are some examples:
- You don't need to see where the pocket is, and you don't need to judge the amount of cut needed except to determine if a shot is a "thin cut" or a thick cut."
- The system is exact. In other words, if you follow the procedure exactly, it will lead to the correct line of aim for any shot, without "feel" or "subconscious adjustments."
- The system can be learned quickly and benefits can be realized immediately without extensive practice.
So far, do you think the value of CTE is based mostly on all of the benefits summarized here? Or do you think the CTE procedure does somehow geometrically result in a precise line of aim for a wide range of shots, without requiring "feel" or "fine adjustment" by the shooter?
I also look forward to seeing the DVD Stan puts out. It is difficult to discuss the merits, or determine if claims are realistic or not, until the system is actually described, illustrated, and demonstrated clearly and completely. Honestly, I have never seen or heard a complete description of CTE that makes total sense based on the claims, and it is has never been clear to me how any align-and-pivot-based system can work for a wide range of shots without incorporating "feel" or "fine adjustments" (conscious or subconscious). I honestly hope Stan's DVD can shed new light on all of this; if it can, I think he will have provided a tremendous contribution to the pool world.
It doesn't sound like Stan has actually started the work on the DVD yet. Do you or others know when he plans to do the work and release the product (i.e., what is the expected release date)? I think something like this is long overdue and highly anticipated. I hope Stan can provide a quality product that will live up to all of the expectations. There seems to be a lot of interest in CTE, so his DVD should do quite well even if the "detractors" don't think it addresses all of the "unanswered questions."
Regards,
Dave
Dave,
I will be starting a new thread on the new CTE/Pro One aiming system soon and some of your questions will be answered for sure.
So far, Stan Shuffett's new CTE/Pro One aiming system has surpassed my expectations.
JoeyA
JoeyA
I'll look for your thread, and I will ask the questions again there. Otherwise, I guess I'll really have to wait until the video comes out, if it ever does (which I hope is the case). After all of these years, CTE has still not been described completely (or at all) in any book, magazine, or video (as far as I know). Until this changes, CTE/Pro-One will remain to the "detractors," "skeptics," and "doubters" as a mysterious religion with miraculous promises. But you seem to be a firm "believer," "proponent," and/or "promoter" now, so I look forward to your analysis.
Regards,
Dave
Joey supports what works for him
Dave,
Joey is a supporter of what works best for him, such as the OB shafts. Knowing how Joey plays without using CTE most of the time I'll sit up and take notice if he says that CTE is better. Even if he says it is only equal it is worth considering. Different methods work for different people. I'm not a fractional overlap kind of guy for example. When I am viewing a perspective that makes the cue ball four times or more bigger than the object ball all of the overlap ideas go out the window for me. That is one reason I don't get far with diagrams. They are wonderful in two dimensional drawings but usually the drawings have scant resemblance to what I see on a table.
Hu
Dave,
Joey is a supporter of what works best for him, such as the OB shafts. Knowing how Joey plays without using CTE most of the time I'll sit up and take notice if he says that CTE is better. Even if he says it is only equal it is worth considering. Different methods work for different people. I'm not a fractional overlap kind of guy for example. When I am viewing a perspective that makes the cue ball four times or more bigger than the object ball all of the overlap ideas go out the window for me. That is one reason I don't get far with diagrams. They are wonderful in two dimensional drawings but usually the drawings have scant resemblance to what I see on a table.
Hu
Agreed. I think all aiming methods are worth considering, because everybody has different preferences and different ways of seeing things.
I'm not a fractional-ball aiming system kind of guy either. However, diagrams can sometimes be useful to at least show how a system is supposed to work in principle.
Regardless of the type of "system" one might use, one still needs good visualization, perception, and alignment skills at the table (not to mention an accurate and consistent stroke also). For many people, the "systems" help create focus on these things with a consistent pre-shot routine. That's all good to me.
Regards,
Dave
The Psycho-Neurological Precise Aiming System Version I (PNPAS) is now available for $00.00, add $79.95 for shipping and handling.
Hit the contact point with the center of the cue ball on a straight in shot. The next shot is to have a slight angle to the pocket and hit that contact point again with the center of the cue ball. Keep changing the angle to the pocket until the cue ball can’t hit the contact point. Then allow the brain to compensate for the spherical nature of the balls.
The amazing thing with this highly accurate, physically and mathematically correct system is that the brain and eye learn how much compensation is needed. Precise mathematical formulas will be available in the 900 page manual available soon.
In the upcoming series we will provide additional details on the use of English and especially Irish for use in precision play.
Hit the contact point with the center of the cue ball on a straight in shot. The next shot is to have a slight angle to the pocket and hit that contact point again with the center of the cue ball. Keep changing the angle to the pocket until the cue ball can’t hit the contact point. Then allow the brain to compensate for the spherical nature of the balls.
The amazing thing with this highly accurate, physically and mathematically correct system is that the brain and eye learn how much compensation is needed. Precise mathematical formulas will be available in the 900 page manual available soon.
In the upcoming series we will provide additional details on the use of English and especially Irish for use in precision play.
I can add one teaser for the upcoming series on the use of Irish. At the end of a shot grip the cue tightly with the back hand. This will raise the tip upwards and to the outside of the body. It not only impresses the crowd with your ability to use a wand, it adds a flourish that makes you feel that the spin imparted will indeed place the ball in or near the pocket.
Unlike other similar systems with PNPAS there is only one shot in pool -- hit the contact point.
Unlike other similar systems with PNPAS there is only one shot in pool -- hit the contact point.
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You start to aim by feel when you make alot of balls without thinking about what you are doing.
Its that simple.
Its like when you put your car key in the ignition without thinking about doing it. You just put it in and turn the car on, no thought about how to hold the keys, how to move your arm to the switch, how to put the end of the key in the slot, how to turn the switch.
You have done it so many times, it becomes natural, you just do it.
No matter what system you start out to use, there is one thing that can not be factored out. You have to hit alot of balls period. To the point that making balls become natural, no thought about how to do the shot, but just doing the shot.
So, in reality, all systems lead to aiming by feel only if the player is truly striving for top level of play, which by the way has nothing to do if one is a pro or not.
Its that simple.
Its like when you put your car key in the ignition without thinking about doing it. You just put it in and turn the car on, no thought about how to hold the keys, how to move your arm to the switch, how to put the end of the key in the slot, how to turn the switch.
You have done it so many times, it becomes natural, you just do it.
No matter what system you start out to use, there is one thing that can not be factored out. You have to hit alot of balls period. To the point that making balls become natural, no thought about how to do the shot, but just doing the shot.
So, in reality, all systems lead to aiming by feel only if the player is truly striving for top level of play, which by the way has nothing to do if one is a pro or not.
"Whoa -- I see some Shillelagh moves there!"
Actually, that truly is Irish, Joe! In this case, you are showing your expertise with another implement, the Shillelagh, which is also used for poking and swatting. That "flick to the outside" is an expert Shillelagh move, as you knock heads with it. Of Irish heritage myself, when I see someone use this move, I know I show respect!
-Sean
Actually, that truly is Irish, Joe! In this case, you are showing your expertise with another implement, the Shillelagh, which is also used for poking and swatting. That "flick to the outside" is an expert Shillelagh move, as you knock heads with it. Of Irish heritage myself, when I see someone use this move, I know I show respect!
-Sean
If I take my tongue out of my cheek I would suggest that this is precisely what we do when playing pool. The pockets are large enough to accommodate for all sorts of things such as throw and what have you in most situations.
However, for the Shillelagh flourish it is not recommended that one place lead in the tip. I am given to understand that this increases deflection significantly.
Other sorts of Irish such as lunging like a drunken sailor at the end of a shot, and spectualar language intended to make the balls behave are only learned with years of experience.
However, for the Shillelagh flourish it is not recommended that one place lead in the tip. I am given to understand that this increases deflection significantly.
Other sorts of Irish such as lunging like a drunken sailor at the end of a shot, and spectualar language intended to make the balls behave are only learned with years of experience.
Joe,
Funny you should mention the Irish. I have been watching Gary Lutman play Nick Vita some nine ball on the BigTruck show. It is archived as the top video right now I believe. Lutman uses a lot of Irish much of the time even including the body lunge sometimes. Gary's stance and stroke should be the horror of almost any instructor on this forum. However like so many folks that don't know any better he makes a lot of balls go in the hole and he plays pretty good shape too. The main reason I am reviewing the video is his stroke. There are some elements of it that I really like on the bar table and on the big tables with fast cloth that are so common now.
Hu
Don't be dissin' the use of "Irish." It can be quite effective with the right equipment. See:
Just be careful to not put too much "American" on the ball.
Regards,
Dave
Just be careful to not put too much "American" on the ball.
Regards,
Dave
Slowly but surely, this thread will turn into another CTE block party.
What the hell is CTE????
Now I gotta tell you that when I first saw that video you had me. I was amazed and wondered how anyone could possibly do such a thing. Sure glad you gave the solution as I was at first dumbfounded. That happens more often than I like to admit.
Is that "American?" if so we could use a few more.
Several desciption, along with links to additional resources, can be found here:
Regards,
Dave
The "American" I was referring to is "hitting the ball with more speed than you need," as described and illustrated on VEPS-I. How could you forget?
Regards,
Dave
It seems to me that the only system ALL pros use, bar none, is the one where the cue ball replaces the ghost ball at the point of contact. 