PRO ONE DVD: Answering Questions

SpiderWebComm said:
OK - so that makes no sense. Why would he say "per Stan's request... this info is partial" ...

YET--- "AGAINST" Stan's request---- he posts the entire content of his DVD just above that?

That makes NO sense.

I'll apologize for calling Dr. Dave a liar. However, he should explain why he respects Stan in one area and then posts his content against his wishes in another area (both on the same page).

whatevern.jpg

What are there two sections for Pro1? Why so far apart?
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Oh good grief! Why do you have things the way you do on your web site?

BECAUSE IT'S YOUR WEB SITE AND YOU WANT THEM THAT WAY.

Lou Figueroa
hates to have to
splain stuff like that
 
shankster8 said:
Get real, Spider. If the DVD is unintelligible except to a few who already knew CTE/ProOne, it is worth $0. IMO the DVD was purposely crafted to omit critical information necessary for its reasonable comprehension. You're screaming STFU at Dr. Dave because his small table and brief notes supposedly exposes Stan's entire system. That's what the DVD was supposed to do - GET IT????????. Stans customers are not now supposed to be filling in the spaces purposely left blank, IMO.

What's wrong with you, are you implying it's OK for Stan to air barrel his customers? You really should be kissing Dr. Dave's ass for providing the only meaningful information to date on CTE/ProOne. Because of Dave's information, hopefully Stan will be spared the further embarrasment of hoards of his customers asking for a refund.
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Unfortunately, Stan would appear to have a "No Refundo" policy.

Of course I'm sure he'd be happy to sign you up for a lesson to further explain :-)

Lou Figueroa
 
While there is a lull in the action I'd like to insert a non-volatile post concerning my opinions of Stan's dvd and its acceptance.

Stan developed this dvd with the idea of trying to approach each and every player with a common ground that would allow all viewers, no matter what their playing experience, a grasp of the Cte/Pro One system. We all learn at different rates and capacities. I am a visual learner. Some are auditory. We can absorb some concepts faster than others and yet not understand what the next person sees as simple. This benchmark for all players to use and integrate into their Cte education can be elusive. Personal instruction may be the path for some despite an accurate dvd presentation.

As the voices grow from confused practitioners, readers take the impression that the dvd is not what it should be. I don't agree with that. The vast majority are being productive with their research and are learning the system. They don't need to post to tell about their experiences because they are working on their basics with due diligence and practice. If you are having trouble and are willing to work on the system without needing the microwave approach, many including myself will do whatever it takes to answer any and all questions. Stan has offered his guidance as the reason for this thread with a phone call.

Best,
Mike
 
SpiderWebComm said:
I think he won't call Stan because he's afraid of the call. Stan (like many instructors - he's not the only one) tries to avoid the forums due to fights/innuendos/misconceptions/etc---- he said he'd help people with a simple phone call. Therefore, Dr. Dave should take him up on the offer.

To throw your nose up and say--- "Nope, nope...only on az---- only wanna talk on azb" ---- that's ridiculous.
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What's ridiculous is that there *always* needs to be a phone call...

Lou Figueroa
 
PoolSharkAllen said:
You guys are spending uncounted hours debating the black hole that CTE/Pro1 is when there are so much more productive things you could be doing.

I hope all of you will try to move on with your lives.
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Why, 400 posts into a thread, does someone always chime in to make an observation like this?

Don't open the thread, put us all on ignore, or join in, but puleeeeeeseeee: don't sit on the side lines eating your bag of popcorn enjoying the show and say something like this. Or if you just can't help yourself -- go bug the guys in the never dying Des Moines or Funny gif threads.

Lou Figueroa
 
pablocruz said:
Figueroa..Why don't you go play in the sandbox because that's how old you come across!!
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I tell you what Pablo: I'm tired of your no value added posts, so *you* can go play in my bit bin with the other CTE Monkeys I have on Ignore :-)

Have a nice day.

Lou Figueroa
 
trob:
...if I had no interest in cte. I didn't like it or thought it didn't work I wouldn't bother to read it. ... its not complicated.
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Well, it's a little more complicated than that. I don't know about PocketPoint, but some of us are trying to understand how CTE works - not how it's advertised to work or how most CTE users here believe it works (neither of which seem to hold up on close inspection), but how it really works. BTW, this difference of opinion about how CTE works is the real core of disagreement here - not whether it works for its users. And that's the reason I can see immediately that the system isn't for me - it doesn't work in a way that's useful to my game (although it's obviously very useful to some peoples' games).

So why do I care if I don't want to learn it completely?

1. Because it might employ some principles that might be generally useful, and I want to know how they operate within the system so they can be re-applied to my game and others'.

2. Because I think it's perfectly legitimate for anybody to want to know more than we've learned about this system before committing significant dollars and time to it, and I want to make more info available to everybody for that purpose. If it's really such good info, it can only increase interest in the system.

3. Because if I can learn something about how it really works I might become more interested in learning it more completely myself.

pj
chgo
 
Oh man! This thread has gone south quickly. The same old arguments that get us nowhere. This thread started off with some useful info, but has turned into another playground shouting match with no real content on the subject.

How about this: Detractors ask a question; Spidey can answer it. Detractors go to the table and try out the answer, then come back and talk about it. So much of this thread is hearsay that is not based on any real substance, and is just getting in the way of people actually getting somewhere with the topic. I think you guys should start a CTE politics thread in the NPR section, because the current state of this thread has about as much value to pool as any of those do.
 
mantis99 said:
Oh man! This thread has gone south quickly. The same old arguments that get us nowhere. This thread started off with some useful info, but has turned into another playground shouting match with no real content on the subject.

How about this: Detractors ask a question; Spidey can answer it. Detractors go to the table and try out the answer, then come back and talk about it. So much of this thread is hearsay that is not based on any real substance, and is just getting in the way of people actually getting somewhere with the topic. I think you guys should start a CTE politics thread in the NPR section, because the current state of this thread has about as much value to pool as any of those do.
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The DVD was supposed to be the "real substance" and that didn't go so good.

Lou Figueroa
 
Patrick Johnson said:
How about not calling anybody with a question a "detractor"? That just emphasizes "sides".

pj
chgo
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As long as we're putting in requests... how about adding to the list: liar, troll, naysayer, and hater?

Lou Figueroa
asking for an exemption
for "Monkey"
 
How about not calling anybody with a question a "detractor"? That just emphasizes "sides".

pj
chgo
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As long as we're putting in requests... how about adding to the list: liar, troll, naysayer, and hater?

Lou Figueroa
I have a dream
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Not trying to get a chorus of Kumbaya going here or anything, but we'll also have to include choir, apostle, believer, etc. :)

pj
chgo
 
lfigueroa said:
What's ridiculous is that there *always* needs to be a phone call...

Lou Figueroa
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Not always. I am doing find with CTE and haven't made a single phone call...yet. :grin:

I suggest you take Stan's advice straight from the dvd and give it a few weeks/months and then see. Every day I use the system I am getting better and better.

I just played a guy last night that I have NEVER beaten even after several attemps. I always needed weight to win. Last night, I drilled him. I had everyone in the place watching the beat down.
 
Patrick Johnson said:
Not trying to get a chorus of Kumbaya going here or anything, but we'll also have to include choir, apostle, believer, etc. :)

pj
chgo
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On Dr. Dave's behalf I think we also need to toss in "shit pool of ignorance" just on general principles :-)

Lou Figueroa
 
Mt. Cheverest said:
Not always. I am doing find with CTE and haven't made a single phone call...yet. :grin:

I suggest you take Stan's advice straight from the dvd and give it a few weeks/months and then see. Every day I use the system I am getting better and better.

I just played a guy last night that I have NEVER beaten even after several attemps. I always needed weight to win. Last night, I drilled him. I had everyone in the place watching the beat down.
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I said all that in my review -- it would take time to make work. But I don't believe the pivot is a good thing, so I'll pass.

Lou Figueroa
 
Patrick Johnson said:
How about not calling anybody with a question a "detractor"? That just emphasizes "sides".

pj
chgo

P.S. I know I'm guilty of this sometimes too.
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If PJ can bring this to the table, in this thread, there is hope after all...

There is too much brainpower being wasted picking at each other, as fun as it is to read upon occasion.

Oh well, back into the shadows. Best of luck, everyone.
 
Patrick Johnson said:
Well, it's a little more complicated than that. I don't know about PocketPoint, but some of us are trying to understand how CTE works - not how it's advertised to work or how most CTE users here believe it works (neither of which seem to hold up on close inspection), but how it really works. BTW, this difference of opinion about how CTE works is the real core of disagreement here - not whether it works for its users. And that's the reason I can see immediately that the system isn't for me - it doesn't work in a way that's useful to my game (although it's obviously very useful to some peoples' games).

So why do I care if I don't want to learn it completely?

1. Because it might employ some principles that might be generally useful, and I want to know how they operate within the system so they can be re-applied to my game and others'.

2. Because I think it's perfectly legitimate for anybody to want to know more than we've learned about this system before committing significant dollars and time to it, and I want to make more info available to everybody for that purpose. If it's really such good info, it can only increase interest in the system.

3. Because if I can learn something about how it really works I might become more interested in learning it more completely myself.

pj
chgo
Click to expand...

You raise some extremely on point questions, PJ. I can only give my opinion on WHY I think Cte works, without any written backup. Others may dispute my claims, but from experience I've seen an extended view and now am coming to understand Stan's comment on "higher levels" of aiming.

He gives us a hint of what I'm seeing in my game in his dvd. He talks about what a pro player sees when he asks what he sees when he is shooting a shot (I'm not a pro). He also mentions the fact that now that this information is available, a lot of upper level players are going to dial in their games with it. This not a hype for sales (it didn't hurt though :wink:). It was a seminal observation that made me contort and become uncomfortable because it was true.

I, for one, am happy for Stan and wish him well with his sales. He is the mentor of Pro One and deserves success after his hard work. On the other hand I wish I could keep all the candy for myself and not feed the fish. :) I'll be getting knocked out of tourneys now and with my own system!

Cte is not a system that shows you WHERE to find the contact point, but instead shows you HOW to find the contact point. No other system does this. Some have surmised to an obvious conclusion that it develops your pre-shot routine. Why? Because you are letting your eyes arrive at a position that lets them aim correctly. How valuable is this fact?

Early users think they are lining up their bodies to point at the shot line. If you stand this way, you can make all shots. You are now pointed in the right direction. Yes and no. When your eyes are lined up correctly you will line up physically better. Cte is teaching you where to line up with your eyes, then your body.

This diligent practice with Cte and then Pro One reinforces correct eye alignment and over time will morph into an automatic shooting alignment. I typically use no pivot, no selective bridge length, no reference points. My mind has assimilated the process and they are not necessary anymore. If I slump, I double check things with Pro One. If the shot is low percentage or pressure has me tight, I can use Pro One to double check myself. I warm up with Pro One and get in stroke quickly as my visuals dial in.

Cte works by dialing in your visuals. A progression to Pro One connects your body to the natural equation. Joey A mentioned in another thread how he just got down and shot at his last tournament without any system. He is moving into the next stage of aiming because he has finally learned after years of playing where his eyes need to be. I know this feeling and am trying to pin it down on paper. Right now I can't. All I really am sure about is that I have finally learned where to put my eyes and am improving my game at a steady pace in the last few months. This is the reward for learning Cte when it was so easy to quit.

Best,
Mike
 
Mikjary said:
You raise some extremely on point questions, PJ. I can only give my opinion on WHY I think Cte works, without any written backup. Others may dispute my claims, but from experience I've seen an extended view and now am coming to understand Stan's comment on "higher levels" of aiming.

He gives us a hint of what I'm seeing in my game in his dvd. He talks about what a pro player sees when he asks what he sees when he is shooting a shot (I'm not a pro). He also mentions the fact that now that this information is available, a lot of upper level players are going to dial in their games with it. This not a hype for sales (it didn't hurt though :wink:). It was a seminal observation that made me contort and become uncomfortable because it was true.

I, for one, am happy for Stan and wish him well with his sales. He is the mentor of Pro One and deserves success after his hard work. On the other hand I wish I could keep all the candy for myself and not feed the fish. :) I'll be getting knocked out of tourneys now and with my own system!

Cte is not a system that shows you WHERE to find the contact point, but instead shows you HOW to find the contact point. No other system does this. Some have surmised to an obvious conclusion that it develops your pre-shot routine. Why? Because you are letting your eyes arrive at a position that lets them aim correctly. How valuable is this fact?

Early users think they are lining up their bodies to point at the shot line. If you stand this way, you can make all shots. You are now pointed in the right direction. Yes and no. When your eyes are lined up correctly you will line up physically better. Cte is teaching you where to line up with your eyes, then your body.

This diligent practice with Cte and then Pro One reinforces correct eye alignment and over time will morph into an automatic shooting alignment. I typically use no pivot, no selective bridge length, no reference points. My mind has assimilated the process and they are not necessary anymore. If I slump, I double check things with Pro One. If the shot is low percentage or pressure has me tight, I can use Pro One to double check myself. I warm up with Pro One and get in stroke quickly as my visuals dial in.

Cte works by dialing in your visuals. A progression to Pro One connects your body to the natural equation. Joey A mentioned in another thread how he just got down and shot at his last tournament without any system. He is moving into the next stage of aiming because he has finally learned after years of playing where his eyes need to be. I know this feeling and am trying to pin it down on paper. Right now I can't. All I really am sure about is that I have finally learned where to put my eyes and am improving my game at a steady pace in the last few months. This is the reward for learning Cte when it was so easy to quit.

Best,
Mike
Click to expand...

This is good.
 
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