good 3C handicap systems

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olgoat

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Anyone have any good handicap systems they know up for 3C given both players have a known lifetime average points per inning? Or do most of them work off a player "rating" instead of the APPI?

Also, do folks track their lifetime APPI or do you cut it off and start fresh every now and then. Ie early in your learning process you really suck and as you get better it takes a lot of points to offset these early matches.

Thanks
 
Figure out how long you want the matches to be, guess how many points your best player should make in around that time, and then have lesser players go to a lower number.

So a guy like Pedro P. might have to go to 20 points, while a "b" player might only need to make 10 to win,etc....
 
olgoat said:
Anyone have any good handicap systems they know up for 3C given both players have a known lifetime average points per inning? Or do most of them work off a player "rating" instead of the APPI?

Also, do folks track their lifetime APPI or do you cut it off and start fresh every now and then. Ie early in your learning process you really suck and as you get better it takes a lot of points to offset these early matches.

Thanks
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Trying to base handicaps on averages is a really, really bad thing to do. It encourages defense -- a player who never goes for anything except big naturals and easy tickies will have a low average and bar-b-que players who try to play a more normal game. I've played under an average-based system, and if it was the only game in town, I'd quit.

Here's an easy system: give players ratings of 1000 for an average player to 2500 for a top player. Divide by 100 to get the points they go to. (Divide by a smaller number if you want longer matches.) Every match a player wins, his rating goes up by 20. If he loses a match his rating goes down by 20. After 40 matches for a player, back off the adjustment to 10 per match.
 
here in s. korea the room owner controls your handicap. i think beginning players start at 100, which means you have to score 10 points in a game. your handicap increases in increments of 10 points as your skill improves. my understanding is if you are winning in excess of 75% of your matches your ranking will go up, but it's not like there is a log book or anything. it's not a perfect system, especially when you have to score two 마무리 [cushion first/bank shots] in addition to your point total to win the game, but it makes for an enjoyable game. no one seriously complains about another's handicap.

maybe a native s. korean could expand on this handicapping system, but this is my understanding of it, albeit from behind a pretty substantial language barrier.

best
 
I run a handicapped 3c tournament every month or so in my room and we have about 12 players. Trying to give each player a "number" to go to does not work. What we do is play 7 point games or 14 innings which ever come first, now a beginner may go to 5 and a advanced player may go to 9 but the innings are still 14. When most of the players are between .4-.6 short games are very hard to bet on one player over another. This is a great tournament format for a weekday evening tournament, with a dozen players and two tables its over in 3- 3.5 hours. I have zero complaints about the handicapping.
 
I like this system too. It worked great for me. It's easy to adjust for time, as well. If you have more players you go down to like 5 points or 10 innnings, etc.
 
All. Thanks for the suggestions. I was subscribed to the thread but didn't get notified that there were updates.

The system in use now rounds the players appi into a rating (ie .13 is a 10, .43 is a 40) and then uses a table to determine how many points the weaker player gets on the wire.

The table appears to always favor the better player and sure enough the better players end up being at the top after each session.

I'm sure Bob is right, although I don't understand it. I will look at trying to put it into a spreadsheet to see how manageable it is.

I also will look at the short race suggestions. We don't all play on the same night. We schedule with each other during the week. Short races made the better players feel like it was not worth the trip as it would be over too quickly.
 
olgoat said:
... I'm sure Bob is right, although I don't understand it. I will look at trying to put it into a spreadsheet to see how manageable it is.
...
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The main problem with the system I proposed and all systems that are adjusted in a similar manner is that in the long run everyone is expected to win half their games. (This is clear because you go up or down as you win or lose matches and if you win more than 50% you continue to rise while your opponents on average will drop.) The only exception to this is if someone continues to improve -- that can support a constantly rising average.

If you want to give some incentive to the better players and give the weaker players a reason to improve, have a "Masters" tournament each year for the top 25% of players. For that single tournament, you could either reduce the handicaps or have all the players go to the same score.
 
Bob Jewett said:
The main problem with the system I proposed and all systems that are adjusted in a similar manner is that in the long run everyone is expected to win half their games. (This is clear because you go up or down as you win or lose matches and if you win more than 50% you continue to rise while your opponents on average will drop.) The only exception to this is if someone continues to improve -- that can support a constantly rising average.

If you want to give some incentive to the better players and give the weaker players a reason to improve, have a "Masters" tournament each year for the top 25% of players. For that single tournament, you could either reduce the handicaps or have all the players go to the same score.
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Good points Bob. We lost a couple of low ranked players from the last session partly because of the frustration of losing most of their matches. The better players are happy as clams. And there are no where near enough folks to split the league. So I think we need to do something.

Appreciate the input.
 
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