Did someone say league player.....

M

Mowem down

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I was going to tell this tale when it happened but I skipped it just because they way things go on here but seeing that its a topic at hand heres my last " pool league story "......

Talking with one of my sons baseball coaches at the start of the season (new coach this year, know nothing about the guy ). We start off talking baseball of course, I find out he was one of the greatest players to come out of his part of town ( back in his day of course ). Pool comes up when Im telling him my son eats and writes right handed but plays pool left handed thus hits from both sides of the plate... ( yea hes a stud...at 10 :grin::grin::p )... Anyway, the guy starts to tell me how most of his trophys are from playing pool (apa and tap ), he always crushes people at league and now that hes really paying attention to his cue ball control hes REALLY going to crush people... Oh yea and he was a 6 but they just moved him down to a 5... I just stand and smile he walks off, I get out my phone go to the APA web site walk over to him and ask "whos that" pointing to my name showing him where I took 3rd in the national singles in the 6,7,8, and 9 div. smile and walk off.... Other than inviting him over once to play on my 5x10 ( wich he didnt even know were made ) I didnt talk pool with him untill the last game of the year, when I walked up ( just to make sure I had the right read on this allstar apa 5), and ask " what is Efren Reyes's nick name " and right on cue he says " whos that ".....

Did someone say pool league.......... I miss my future exwife more........
 
PocketPoint said:
Typical league player..... slowly killing pool
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Not in my area. I certainly won't say that all of them know who Efren is, but most certainly do. Then again we have quite a few halfway decent players coming through regularly. Maybe it's the luck of exposure.

The more threads I read like this the more I think the town I live in has something special going on concerning pool.
 
PocketPoint said:
Typical league player..... slowly killing pool
Click to expand...

You can look at it that way...or you could say steadily providing new interest in the sport.

Look, we all start somewhere, and although we laugh at guys like this now that we know so much more, we all start somewhere. Did you guys come out of the womb not only knowing Efren's name, nickname and favorite meal on the road, but how to hit his Z bank? Nope.

Unless you're in that top elite half a percent that seems to be good the instant they first pick up a cue, you were a banger at some point too, and had to learn the what's what and who's who.

Give these guys a break (pun). Instead of bashing them for what they don't know, why don't you teach them a thing or two that might help their game. Why don't you take that opportunity to remember what it was like when the game was simpler and you could take much pride in that elusive run-out instead of expecting it every time you come to the table and beating yourself up over what you did wrong if you don't get there.

I remember being very proud of what I'd learned at that point in my game, and sometimes wish it was still like that. Back then, I remember feeling like I was GOOD at this game! Now, I even though I play much better, I feel like I play ok, but I know my potential, so I'm not as excited about how I play all the time. I still love the game and love to play, but that newness has some what gone away for me.

Along the way, I've been very grateful to the few guys who will actually take the time to help me out, or show me a shot, or help analyze a pattern...all for their love of the game and the knowledge they have. Be that guy, don't be the "I know something you don't know" guy.

This guy who you claim is "killing" pool is just sharing his excitement for the game and for what he's accomplished. Hardly reason for bashing.
 
Club Billiards said:
You can look at it that way...or you could say steadily providing new interest in the sport.

Look, we all start somewhere, and although we laugh at guys like this now that we know so much more, we all start somewhere. Did you guys come out of the womb not only knowing Efren's name, nickname and favorite meal on the road, but how to hit his Z bank? Nope.

Unless you're in that top elite half a percent that seems to be good the instant they first pick up a cue, you were a banger at some point too, and had to learn the what's what and who's who.

Give these guys a break (pun). Instead of bashing them for what they don't know, why don't you teach them a thing or two that might help their game. Why don't you take that opportunity to remember what it was like when the game was simpler and you could take much pride in that elusive run-out instead of expecting it every time you come to the table and beating yourself up over what you did wrong if you don't get there.

I remember being very proud of what I'd learned at that point in my game, and sometimes wish it was still like that. Back then, I remember feeling like I was GOOD at this game! Now, I even though I play much better, I feel like I play ok, but I know my potential, so I'm not as excited about how I play all the time. I still love the game and love to play, but that newness has some what gone away for me.

Along the way, I've been very grateful to the few guys who will actually take the time to help me out, or show me a shot, or help analyze a pattern...all for their love of the game and the knowledge they have. Be that guy, don't be the "I know something you don't know" guy.

This guy who you claim is "killing" pool is just sharing his excitement for the game and for what he's accomplished. Hardly reason for bashing.
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Excellent post. Green rep to you, sir.
 
Looks like pocket pool has an ally

yea, that is sooooooo impressive.

"i know a little more about pool than you do, & i play better than you, too."
that makes it okay for me to try to make you feel inferior.

"All you do is take time out of your life to coach a youth baseball team, you are such a loser."


Christ, who is it that is killing pool?????????????

SLIM
 
SLIM said:
yea, that is sooooooo impressive.

"i know a little more about pool than you do, & i play better than you, too."
that makes it okay for me to try to make you feel inferior.

"All you do is take time out of your life to coach a youth baseball team, you are such a loser."


Christ, who is it that is killing pool?????????????

SLIM
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Exactly.

How many players of other games never heard of or know about the top players in their sport? There are many NBA, NFL, and MLB, players that get drafted by a team and don't know anything about who the Hall of Fame players were from that team.

I play with many league players that never heard of a SW cue, or who the top players are. They are more involved with playing the game than being on AZ or following it. They just don't really care and it is not that important or required to be a league player. They would rather be at the table or doing something else that is more constructive like coaching baseball.

I guess players should be required to pass a test to be able to play in a league and have to also pass a test at the playoffs to qualify.
 
thebook said:
exactly.
I guess players should be required to pass a test to be able to play in a league and have to also pass a test at the playoffs to qualify.
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i wish that people had to pass a test to post on this forum.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion & should not feel shy about expressing it.
I enjoy discussing topics with people that have different opinions than i do.
Usually everyone takes something away from it.

But posting to show disrespect for someone is just bull$hit.
There are people out there who have more knowledge and/or could shame the original poster with their pool skills.
Maybe they should post about how much more they know or how mush more skill they have than him.

Sorry for the rant, but this kind of crap gets me going.

Slim
 
Most people don’t know about top players, best cue makers, history of pool.
The lack of education on these subject is not a crime.

I know many decent players (can run a rack) that know something about the game but not that much.
They still pay their dues, buy beer, support the pool hall, have fun and go home to their real lives.
They don’t care about the professional and advanced pool. Why should they?
This is not a crime and it doesn’t do disservice to the game. Why would it?

League players have their place in the pool world.
Those that just play and have fun with the game have the right to exist.
For them pool is something you do once in a while, something you do with your woman, etc.

Personally, I don’t play leagues and don’t care about BCA, APA or whatever and that includes Vegas. Is that a crime?

Some of the posters here are hardcore pool guys.
However, to be one you have to have a pool addiction and most people just don’t. So, what.
 
In Mowem Down's defense, it is rather amusing at times to have pool discussions with those that have never ventured outside of the APA. It's an amazing little bubble many of them live in.

Typical assumptions made by APA folk:

If you've made 4 stripes and your opponent hasn't made a solid, you're winning
Playing safe in 8-ball is always smart
Follow and double-hit is the same thing
The next step beyond 7 is going pro (obviously)

and sadly, the greatest assumption ever - the only way to play in Las Vegas is by winning your local championships.

I enjoy the APA, especially on the local level. It's a fun organization that gives people a complete experience. However, I firmly believe the BCA Championships is truly the greatest amateur tournament on Earth and part of my reason for that has to do with the exposure to excellent pool. It would be nice if every APA player got to see the BCA Masters play. Guys you've never even heard of just playing perfect rack after rack.

I don't think the APA is bad for pool, not by any stretch. Like I said, they offer a complete experience. A person can feel proud about getting raised from an s/l 3 (absolutely horrible) to an s/l 4 (pretty damn horrible). Without the APA, the realization that they're on the lower end of the "horrible totem pole" is only more evident to them and they, instead, decide to go bowling.

For the record, most s/l 7s are still kinda horrible. Sadly, most of them will never even know. Here's a name for ya, Jason Kirkwood. Heard of him?
 
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I think you guys are missing the OP's point

He didn't post it to say "i'm better than my kid's coach", he was telling a story about a guy who claimed to be insanely good at pool, yet just moved down a skill level in the APA. He was making fun of him for trash talking.
 
Club Billiards said:
You can look at it that way...or you could say steadily providing new interest in the sport.

Look, we all start somewhere, and although we laugh at guys like this now that we know so much more, we all start somewhere. Did you guys come out of the womb not only knowing Efren's name, nickname and favorite meal on the road, but how to hit his Z bank? Nope.

Unless you're in that top elite half a percent that seems to be good the instant they first pick up a cue, you were a banger at some point too, and had to learn the what's what and who's who.

Give these guys a break (pun). Instead of bashing them for what they don't know, why don't you teach them a thing or two that might help their game. Why don't you take that opportunity to remember what it was like when the game was simpler and you could take much pride in that elusive run-out instead of expecting it every time you come to the table and beating yourself up over what you did wrong if you don't get there.

I remember being very proud of what I'd learned at that point in my game, and sometimes wish it was still like that. Back then, I remember feeling like I was GOOD at this game! Now, I even though I play much better, I feel like I play ok, but I know my potential, so I'm not as excited about how I play all the time. I still love the game and love to play, but that newness has some what gone away for me.

Along the way, I've been very grateful to the few guys who will actually take the time to help me out, or show me a shot, or help analyze a pattern...all for their love of the game and the knowledge they have. Be that guy, don't be the "I know something you don't know" guy.

This guy who you claim is "killing" pool is just sharing his excitement for the game and for what he's accomplished. Hardly reason for bashing.
Click to expand...

Spot on! :thumbup:
 
club billiards said:
this guy who you claim is "killing" pool is just sharing his excitement for the game and for what he's accomplished. Hardly reason for bashing.
Click to expand...

i was shooting with some friends one evening & a young (mid 20's) guy came up to me & stated that he heard i had several old pool tables & started talking to me about a table he had just purchased.
Wondering if he had paid too much for it, what it was really worth, would i be interested in it if he decided to get rid of it.

I asked him what model it was & if he knew how old it was.
He wasn’t sure of the model but he knew it was from the early 1970’s.

Instead of trying to make him feel bad & telling him that i collected tables from the early 1900’s i just told him he had made a good purchase & offered to help him set the table up if he needed it.

There is no reason to belittle someone because they feel good about themselves or criticize them for not knowing as much as you, or not being as good at something as you are.
Because there is someone right around the corner who could do the same to you.

SLIM
 
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Agreed Slim. Working on tables, I see/hear it all the time. Any time I get a call, I ask what kind of table it is so I know what I'm getting into before I show up. Most people don't really even know what they have. "But it's a really nice table!"

People are proud of it. I realize that, to me...it's another pool table in a string of a few thousand I've worked on, but to that person, that could have been grandpa's table, or something they just saved up for two years to buy. That table is something to be proud of for that person, so when I see a table that in my opinion is a nothing-special POS, if that guy thinks is a real nice one, I let him enjoy that.

It's the same way with cues. If I'm on a job and see a cue case, I usually ask what's in it. I like cues enough to actually be curious, but some of the time it's just to get people talking. You know how many times I've heard about the really nice cue someone just got that ends up being a Players or Action, or something along those lines? Forget the 4 figure value cues. This guy just spent hard earned money on something he takes pride in, and it's not my place to shoot him down because I know what else is out there.

Now I will most of the times try to educate people on what else is out there, but I try make sure to never do it in a demeaning way. There are far more people out there still learning about the game than there are experts on the topic.
 
SLIM said:
There is no reason to belittle someone because they feel good about themselves or criticize them for not knowing as much as you, or not being as good at something as you are.
Because there is someone right around the corner who could do the same to you.

SLIM
Click to expand...

This is SPOT ON.

I recently found myself inexplicably get into a pissing contest with some rail bird types at a small room next to my office about how much better a good friend of mine was at the game (can beat the 10 ball ghost every time) than the best player (shortstop) who frequents that room. One guy (I'll call him Winky) couldn't let it go that the shortstop (who I realize now was probably the best player Winky had ever seen play in person) wasn't as good as he thought and kept asking me who I'd bet on if my friend and the shortstop played a set of 9 ball. I tried to be diplomatic and kept pointing out that my friend could beat the 10 ball every time while the shortstop would be 50-50 to beat the 9 ball ghost but it wasn't enough for Winky.

I was starting to get a little steamed after the 4th time Winky asked me that same question when I managed to shrug my shoulders, step back and say, "Who knows what would happen? All I know is that I don't know shit." It was like the proverbial light bulb went on above my head. I realized that it was less important that I proved to Winky that I was "right" than it was to just let it go and let everybody be happy with their opinions. Who was I to whip out my dick and show everybody there how little they know? This seemed to satisfy Winky and he finally left me alone.

15 years ago I would have never let this go. I would have argued until was blue in the face. I guess after 42 years I've come to realize that there's no future in showing everyone how smart you are if you've got to yell at them to do it.
 
Club Billiards said:
You know how many times I've heard about the really nice cue someone just got that ends up being a Players or Action, or something along those lines? Forget the 4 figure value cues. This guy just spent hard earned money on something he takes pride in, and it's not my place to shoot him down because I know what else is out there.
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When I started out playing league pool, I picked up a Players cue for something like $75, put a $40 tip on it, and started working on my game. After a year and a half (with an 8 month deployment in the middle), I'd moved up a couple skill levels, and decided to pick up a mid-grade cue. Got a Predator Quiet Roller for $550 with the 314(2) shaft. Still using the tip that came on it, for 8 months now, but probably going to get a Kamui in the near future. That's not important.

One of my friends was constantly giving me a hard time for playing with the Players cue for so long, especially because I was using Kamui tips and almost never chalked. A couple weeks after I picked up the Predator, he came up to me with a story about a weekend tournament he'd played in, and won. He'd had to borrow a cue from somebody else, didn't really look at it, just grabbed it and started shooting. Ended up kicking butt in the tournament, like really trashing people. It wasn't until he was done that he bothered to look at the cue and find out what it was. It was an $85 players cue with a $40 tip on it.

I honestly don't believe it's the equipment, as long as the equipment is built well enough that it doesn't degrade quickly from use. Everything has some intrinsic value, and the dollar value doesn't begin to describe the potential of a particular cue, table, chalk, felt, ball, whatever.

I keep my original Players cue on hand, in case something happens to my QR. The only thing I realized playing with that cue for so long is that I don't like wrapped cues. The Quiet Roller, with the wood forearm, feels exactly like what I want a cue to feel like.

So yeah, absolutely, if you've got a cue that you like, it works for you, and it's not the reason you're missing shots, be ecstatic that you've found your gear.
 
Apa/bca

I have played BCA in Dallas and APA and I can tell you I have had more fun playing APA. The BCA teams are often stacked, we had a tournament this month and my handicap was raised during the tournament, the APA was at least looking to level the playing field.

We lost on the loser side to the team going to Vegas but it was fair and I had no complaints.

So if you don't like the APA find something else to do and leave people alone that are content to go out play some pool and having a good time..

Thanks
Ward
 
WardS said:
So if you don't like the APA find something else to do and leave people alone that are content to go out play some pool and having a good time..
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I'm an APA player myself, and while I generally agree with everything you said in your previous post, it's the "play[ing] some pool and having a good time" that seems to piss off the non-league players. Apparently they think "have a good time" is the same thing as "mess around and bang balls in".

I don't think they understand that there is such thing as an APA player who pays attention to the game, studies, practices, actually improves, and goes out of their way to become a better pool player. I and most of the other league players I know are constantly looking for ways to improve our game. Sure, some people get to a skill level and stay there for a decade because they don't have the time to dedicate to improvement. Others are stagnant because they are already playing at the top of their game, and are either physically or mentally unable to progress. You can do that outside of the leagues, too.

There are nationally ranked amateur players in the APA, BCA, et al. They play in the same leagues and divisions as college students, parents, grandparents, and everybody else whose free time is dedicated to pool as a social event. Please, get over the fact that for 99% of pool players in the US, it's a HOBBY. Maybe some day we'll have a forum that actually talks about pool instead of continually trying to decide what type of pool is "best". It's all pool, and it's all awesome.
 
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