The Break - Ball in Hand after the Break and the Five Ball

I think winning with this spot becomes exponentially tougher as the amount of the bet increases paired with the champion you're playing.

Dippy aside, I'd prob bet against most of the guys on this board against a top elite pro getting this spot as long as they were betting their own money against their wives' wishes... and betting big.

BIH or not, getting from the 2 to the 3 and then to the 4 with the weight of the world on your shoulders and someone like Bustamante, SVB or Mika breathing down your neck would make most people fold.

The ghost doesn't count because the "ghost" doesn't exist and the "ghost" isn't stacking $20k or so large on top of the light.

Running 5 balls with BIH with 7-9 balls on the table --- with TONS of pressure....anything can happen.

Dippy's different--- he's used to betting like this. Most of the people posting here have never bet that amount or close to it. Funny shit happens when you step off the puppy porch and onto the pit bull yard. Shit starts to break.
 
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pt109 said:
With this game, good rack-bad rack isn't much of a factor.....
...remember, the Viffer gets 'ball-in-hand' after the 'break'...

...or in this case 'vreak'...:smile:
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Yeah, but with a bad rack there will be more congestion. That means possibly more break outs and tighter position play, two things that are more difficult for a B level player. The BIH will help remedy this, but there are plenty of racks when BIH doesn't help me get out.
 
Wow, I thought there would be one seasoned gambler that would know the name of that amount of weight...

That is called : Orange Crush !
And if you are even close to a decent player you will beat just about any pro with that. Like I have mentioned on here a few times, Earl now plays with me a few times a week, living in Florida now. Earl has a tough time beating me giving me the last 3 and the 7. I am a semi-pro though. Nonetheless, giving up the break in many cases is like getting a couple balls depending on the opponent giving up the weight. But to get Orange Crush, its ridiculous, no one gives that weight up!!

But if they do, I have a few backers that could touch pretty close to the million mark between the 7-9 of them, lets do it !!
 
SpiderWebComm said:
I think winning with this spot becomes exponentially tougher as the amount of the bet increases paired with the champion you're playing.

Dippy aside, I'd prob bet against most of the guys on this board against a top elite pro getting this spot as long as they were betting their own money against their wives' wishes... and betting big.

BIH or not, getting from the 2 to the 3 and then to the 4 with the weight of the world on your shoulders and someone like Bustamante, SVB or Mika breathing down your neck would make most people fold.

The ghost doesn't count because the "ghost" doesn't exist and the "ghost" isn't stacking $20k or so large on top of the light.

Running 5 balls with BIH with 7-9 balls on the table --- with TONS of pressure....anything can happen.

Dippy's different--- he's used to betting like this. Most of the people posting here have never bet that amount or close to it. Funny shit happens when you step off the puppy porch and onto the pit bull yard. Shit starts to break.
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I would seriously let you back Earl Strickland against me with that bet. I would love to have that game. I dont care how much we are betting on that, i'll take it ...
 
If CB racks so the 1-4 balls are 1 up table, 2 down table, 3 up table, and 4 down table, then I think Dave will have a problem winning. There are plenty of non-pros around that can read a 9-ball rack very well and know where and how to break each pattren and take advantage of any gaps in the rack. If I were Dave I;d get me one of those guys to break for him. Johnnyt
 
Chris_Horton said:
I would seriously let you back Earl Strickland against me with that bet. I would love to have that game. I dont care how much we are betting on that, i'll take it ...
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You might be a lock. I'm saying most non-gambling B players would crack.

Just like most non-gambling golfers who shoot or hover around par. Simply bet them $1000 they can't and it seldom goes beyond the turn.
 
Oh sorry lol .... I didn't know you were talking "B" players. I would certainly be a lock against any player out there ! I would sit anyone in the world down getting the breaks, ball in hand after and the 5 out ... its simply the NUTS lol
 
Aaron_S said:
A B+ player should play about even with the 9-ball ghost, so a solid B should be a lock getting the 5 from the ghost.


Aaron
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Right, but how many ppl *really* play B+ speed or better and how many are keyboard players? ;)


Eric >would take that spot against Efren
 
Chris_Horton said:
Oh sorry lol .... I didn't know you were talking "B" players. I would certainly be a lock against any player out there ! I would sit anyone in the world down getting the breaks, ball in hand after and the 5 out ... its simply the NUTS lol
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Never underestimate the power of a bet WELL outside someone's comfort zone and its affect on the straightness of someone's stroke. Not meant to you, but just "players in general."

I've seen the most unbelievable crap happen from great players when they got too big for their britches.

And $20k bets require HUGE britches. $20k "could" make a robot turn into a flinch-machine. The card's in the deck - that's all I'm saying. :)
 
I totally agree. I know a lock-artist around the orlando area that is good at doing this. He played a guy that was 4-5 balls better than him race to 7 getting the 6 ball for $1000and I saw this player fall apart because of the money. Dogged straight in balls, stop shot outs... made me wanna throw up !!

Best advice to anyone for getting used to the betting is this, dont let your backer tell you how much your playing for, or start with what your comfortable with and learn how to play well moving up... sets for $100 then $200, $500 et cetera, until your able to learn to play your game no matter what !
 
I can speak from experience. I have bet a lot getting break, ball-in-hand, and the last 6 (meaning if I make the 4 or above I win). I am about even betting this way.

I have also bet against a lot of guys getting the 5 playing the ghost or getting to play the ghost with ball-in-hand after one miss.

It is all about the betting. I would bet against just about any APA 5/6 playing this way. I honestly think 75% of the posters here would lose with this spot. It is very likely that many would adjust and be able to overcome it, but I believe most lose the first two sets.


SpiderWebComm said:
You might be a lock. I'm saying most non-gambling B players would crack.

Just like most non-gambling golfers who shoot or hover around par. Simply bet them $1000 they can't and it seldom goes beyond the turn.
Click to expand...
 
SpiderWebComm said:
Never underestimate the power of a bet WELL outside someone's comfort zone and its affect on the straightness of someone's stroke. Not meant to you, but just "players in general."
Click to expand...

You are too smart for this conversation. Please dumb it down and stop killing the dream.


Eric
 
well if 75% of the people on AZ are players of that caliber to lose with that spot, then my skill level is certainly in the minority on this forum, and I wouldn't have thought that.
 
Eric. said:
Right, but how many ppl *really* play B+ speed or better and how many are keyboard players? ;)


Eric >would take that spot against Efren
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Yes, I'm sure there are a lot of players who claim to be B+ players who are not. Half of them are probably C players and the other half are > A.

Aaron
 
SpiderWebComm said:
You might be a lock. I'm saying most non-gambling B players would crack.

Just like most non-gambling golfers who shoot or hover around par. Simply bet them $1000 they can't and it seldom goes beyond the turn.
Click to expand...

Been in a lot of action most of my life, at many games, including golf.

Using your money to get an edge often resembles a poker situation where
if the man calls, he wins, and if he doesn't call, you win nothing.

When you back a non-gambler into a corner and he actually bets, you
better have the better game.If he doesn't play, you win nothing.

I've tried to use this rule-of-thumb....If I don't like the game for $1, I don't
like it for a $1,000.

just my opinion, of course
 
pt109 said:
Been in a lot of action most of my life, at many games, including golf.

Using your money to get an edge often resembles a poker situation where
if the man calls, he wins, and if he doesn't call, you win nothing.

When you back a non-gambler into a corner and he actually bets, you
better have the better game.If he doesn't play, you win nothing.

I've tried to use this rule-of-thumb....If I don't like the game for $1, I don't
like it for a $1,000.

just my opinion, of course
Click to expand...

I agree. However with bets and pool, I think it's like the cube in backgammon. When someone is comfy and running out at "1" -- they may not at "64."
 
pt109 said:
Been in a lot of action most of my life, at many games, including golf.

Using your money to get an edge often resembles a poker situation where
if the man calls, he wins, and if he doesn't call, you win nothing.

When you back a non-gambler into a corner and he actually bets, you
better have the better game.If he doesn't play, you win nothing.

I've tried to use this rule-of-thumb....If I don't like the game for $1, I don't
like it for a $1,000.

just my opinion, of course
Click to expand...

Well, it is known though that you can take a great pool player that has only played sets for $100 or $200 and bet him $1000 or $5000 and when the game starts getting tough they crumble horribly...
 
Neil said:
1. Without the magic rack, the balls might not be able to all get frozen together, so less chance of a ball going on the break. You can easily end up with tiny gaps that are not consistent, thereby making each rack a little different to break. That means there is one or two more balls to create traffic making position a little harder to do. Viffer is not a great position player to start with.
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You are right, and I agree with Bart when he said that the Magic Rack is no good in 9-ball. The wing ball flies in 99% of the time when I've use the MR on Diamonds and GC's. Plus he said he was forced to used a random rack in that game, which means the 5 would have been on the wing at times. This time he gets to use a triangle and rack how he wants if I heard correctly. With no magic rack, the 5 always in the #2 or #3 spot, and the 7 & 8 on the wings, it will be a much harder game for Dippy, IMO.

Aaron
 
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