TAP pool leagues add 35 new licensees

Antfarm...Just curious...How can there be 'dishonesty' or sandbagging in BCAPL? There are no handicaps used at the national level tournaments...unlike APA and TAP. It's 'heads up' play, and there are some great players!

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Antfarm said:
I really miss playing in TAP leagues. I've played in TAP, APA, and a BCA format league for years and TAP was by far the most enjoyable and "honest". Of course there were incidents where you'd run up against or hear about sandbaggers. But, it's been my experience that they usually get caught or it evens out in the end. The league directors usually know who the potential trouble makers are for the most part.

But unfortunately, TAP just isn't available here in Korea. In fact, the only option we have is a steaming pile of cow dung compared to any league in the states!

But, soon enough I'll be back in Maryland kicking Rugerfan's tail all over the table!

Have fun in Vegas guys.... but not too much fun! ;)

r

Greg
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Bcapl added 30 leagues

Bcapl league year ends on may 31.

We had a gain of 30 leagues in the year ending may 31, 2011.

That is a net gain of 30 leagues.

Just sayin'

Mark Griffin, CEO
CSI - BCAPL
 
New league locations in TAP

I post all new licensee info on TAP's Face Book page. Please, you have to give these people time to go thru their Pool-Net training and start up but all of their contact info and what county they are in can be found on this page. Feel free to contact them. Go to tapleague.com and go to the Face Book link or to the league locator.
 
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Sam at TAP said:
TAP has a different handicapping system then the APA/CPA. Many players at the 5-6 and 7 skill levels in the APA are one lower in TAP. This is not uncommon at all and sandbagging has nothing to do with it. Also,TAP has a 25 point team limit compared to 23 points in that league which means teams do not have to look for lower skill level players as much in TAP. Lower skilled players will result in players handicaps going up since the average 5 will win more often and go to a 6 faster in that league then in TAP.
As for TAP going after someone else's business, I believe they call that free enterprise...Exp...Pepsi vs Coke, BK vs Micky D's, Home Depot vs Lowes. I personally had the APA ops here contact my players and even use my name in the past to try and get TAP teams. I guess that is OK?

P.S....Of the 35+ new licensees I mentioned, I believe everyone but one was a former or at the time current APA member. We didn't call them. They called us.

I wish you the best in whatever league you play and compete in....Sam
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If you call that free enterprise then your just as bad as the rest of them. To go after someones business is fine that's the nature of the beast but to try and set your sites on just one league is wrong(they dont go after bca/vnea or any other league). They have cpa/apa SL5s playing as 3s to me that is a joke. And for you to say that everyone but one was a APA member at one time came to your league what do you expect we have to play somewhere. And it wont stop there some other guy will start a league and we will all try it out and then ***** and complain and move on......
 
labatt ice rod said:
If you call that free enterprise then your just as bad as the rest of them. To go after someones business is fine that's the nature of the beast but to try and set your sites on just one league is wrong(they dont go after bca/vnea or any other league). They have cpa/apa SL5s playing as 3s to me that is a joke. And for you to say that everyone but one was a APA member at one time came to your league what do you expect we have to play somewhere. And it wont stop there some other guy will start a league and we will all try it out and then ***** and complain and move on......
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Of course it's OK that their people tear down TAP posters in host locations that they do not own and we were given permission to post there. Damaging and destroying other people's property is OK in your eyes I guess. This happens all the time and just recently in New York and Ohio. I am not getting into this with you. Trying to stop a league from starting by tearing down it's advertising will not work. We market TAP and let the players decide for themselves.....PS.....Take a look...close to 600 views on this thread and your the only negative one. What's that tell you?
 
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Sam at TAP said:
Congrats on your leagues growth Mark. From all of us here at TAP.
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Great and classy response to Mark Griffin's post Sam.

I am a Mark Griffin fan and a BCAPL fan, but I'm not sure it was in good taste to jump into this TAP thread to plug BCAPL. No biggie though, I love both league systems and hope they both become more and more popular.

To the post that said the TAP bashing will soon begin, maybe, but never to the degree that people bash APA. Why? Well one obvious reason is that they are so much smaller and so APA gets more attention. But the better reason is that TAP is just a better league in every respect than APA from what I've seen in Northern VA.

The players are more skilled and more serious. I think this is also the main reason the skill ratings tend to run one lower than APA. I think there is less sandbagging than APA, but it's always going to be a problem in any league system with handicapping and playoffs to a big tournament at the end of the season/year.

The only drawback is that TAP and BCAPL can be hard to find close by, depending on where you live, while APA is almost everywhere. The other unfortunate thing is that I have to get up at 6:00 AM every weekday and BCA runs a little late for me.

The TAP league I was in had a good average skill level and was a great motivator for me to get better. The 25 point limit was tough though and the restriction against playing two 7s on any given night was very difficult in our league, since we had more 7s than we had teams.

Best wishes for the future success of TAP and BCAPL.
 
TAP league the best.....as leagues go....

Just want to say from my experience the TAP league is run very well and I believe on average it is more difficult to be a 6 or 7 in TAP than it is in APA.

In our leagues in Beaver County, PA our League Operator Skip Freed does a very fine job of running things and I do not envy his task.....it is a very difficult job. Every league has sandbaggers and TAP is no different. I've seen people get dq'd in a match where the winning team goes to Las Vegas.....this does not sit well with me......but really when you are dealing with a "handicapped" pool league one has to almost expect this.

Handicap leagues have their flaws but what other choice is there for the 2's, 3's & 4's??? Bottom line is it just wouldn't be fun for them to play in a non-handicap league because they would get it handed to them every match.......good players need to realize that the only way pool can survive in the USA is through handicapped leagues. It's the only way to get numbers.

Sorry to say my TAP days are over as I am moving from Pittsburgh to Houston next week (I don't think TAP has made it to Houston yet). And while there may be no TAP league.....I consider this a major, major, major upgrade of cities as far as "pool" goes. In Pittsburgh we are lucky to get 3 weekends per year where you can find an amateur tournament where they add $500-$1,000. It seems like there is one every single weekend in and around Houston. I am really looking forward to competing against the likes of Ernesto Bayua, Sylver Ochoa, James Davis, Jr., Mike Alonzo etc. We'll see if I can hang........oops I better go ask my wife and my 13 yr old and 9 yr old daughters if I'm allowed to play ;)

Really I just want to thank the TAP organization for a great experience over the last 3 or 4 years! Please don't be discouraged by the naysayers spewing negativity.....just keep trying to "GROW" this game we love so much.
 
Scott Lee said:
Antfarm...Just curious...How can there be 'dishonesty' or sandbagging in BCAPL? There are no handicaps used at the national level tournaments...unlike APA and TAP. It's 'heads up' play, and there are some great players!

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
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Well, the league I play in is a "BCA-type league". What I mean by that is we use BCA rules but we still have handicaps. Now these so called handicaps only exist for the mid-season and end-of-season cash tournaments and the mid-season scotch doubles tournament. You can win some nice cash in those tournaments. But what happens is they use the arbitrary handicaps to determine the bracket you are placed in (high and low). So other than that, we essentially have no handicaps either. So no, I haven't seen a lot of sandbagging in BCA. But that doesn't mean that I like their format at all! I still greatly prefer TAP.

Have a good one!

Greg
 
Antfarm...Thank you for your response. So your league is NOT BCAPL, and neither is the membership. You merely mimic the rules, except whoever runs the league can basically do whatever they please. That's what it sounds like...and that is not a BCAPL sanctioned league. I just wanted to point out that there are bad leagues operators in all leagues, but probably fewer in Mark Griffin's BCAPL than all the others combined. Don't throw out the baby with the bathwater. :grin:

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Antfarm said:
Well, the league I play in is a "BCA-type league". What I mean by that is we use BCA rules but we still have handicaps. Now these so called handicaps only exist for the mid-season and end-of-season cash tournaments and the mid-season scotch doubles tournament. You can win some nice cash in those tournaments. But what happens is they use the arbitrary handicaps to determine the bracket you are placed in (high and low). So other than that, we essentially have no handicaps either. So no, I haven't seen a lot of sandbagging in BCA. But that doesn't mean that I like their format at all! I still greatly prefer TAP.

Have a good one!

Greg
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No worries.... sorry to confuse. Good thing I don't have kids!!!!! :thumbup:

r,

Greg
 
I believe the players are taking notice

From what I been reading on this thread, I believe that the players are seeing now what TAP has been trying to do with league play and with Pool-Net. We are continually adding to Pool-Net and we will continue to do so. From team and host location logos on the teams stats to player module stat reports to new formats such as 10 ball and scotch doubles, TAP keeps doing these upgrades at zero cost to our members and licensees. It's sort of like a factory car off the floor. We will keep customizing it and as long as TAP has ideas we will keep adding more bells and whistles. These upgrades will continue to enhance the league experience for our members. And as I mentioned on the first post, there is a new upgrade coming next month with Pool-Net and smart phones that will further show our members we plan on staying on top of all the new technological advances that are happening. I will post on here this news as soon as TAP decides to announce it. TAP would like to thank our loyal members for sticking by us all of these years. The best is yet to come! See you all in Vegas in November.
 
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Hello my name is Dave Hedrick I am a Tap Licensee here in Texas I have 4 counties Wharton, Fort Bend, Austin, and Matagorda. Due to health issues I have to sell. I just don't have the time or money to keep going out to try to get teams or players to get it started. I was diagnosed with kidney & lung cancer on April 21st of this year. On July 19th they removed my left kidney due to the cancer. So I have to sell all 4 of my counties if anyone want to buy them. Email me at davescuerepair@yahoo.com Thanks Dave

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
 
I like the APA a lot but recently I tried out TAP. In enjoy both equally -- I think the fun is driven by the host location and the people you play more than the format. I will say that TAP has the clear advantage on APA in terms of historical statistics.

These are my overall stats, and I can also look at them based on the opponent's rank. Pretty cool:

Total Statistics
Total Matches: 6
Matches W-L: 5-1
Games W-L: 29-12
Ball Count Ratio: 3.36
Success Rates: Shot: 78%
Ball: 91%
LOT/Game: Self: 2.33
Opponent: 3.55
Match Closeness: 27%
Player Aggressiveness: 61%
Eight on Break: 0
Break and Run: 1

If only I knew what the stuff in the middle means (and I should have 3 B&Rs, not 1, but who's counting?).

Cory
 
Wow, didn't know TAP is now putting stats up! That is very cool, I always wished they would throw the numbers and formula out so everyone could see exactly how handicaps are arrived at...neat stuff :)
 
Explanation of the players stats

I hope this helps you out a bit...As for the break and runs....sometimes teams or the score keeper forget to mark them. I have found out that usually is the case. Also, Pool-Net allows players to filter their stats down to months and weeks. You can check if all that practicing is paying off during a certain period of time. Neat stuff.


REVIEW YOUR PERSONAL STATISTICS:

PoolNet allows you to review your statistics for a specific time period. Please keep in mind that PoolNet was released in March of 2007. Statistics prior to March 2007 are not available via PoolNet.

Total Matches – Total number of matches recorded for the player in the format selected (8 Ball or 9 Ball).

Match Win-Loss – Total Matches Won and Lost.

Game Win-Loss – Total Games Won and Lost.

Ball Count Ratio – Ratio of Completions to Miss Ratio. i.e. Average amount of balls you make, per turn at the table.

Success Rate Shot – Ratio of successfully completed shots to the total number of shots that the player takes. i.e. Your percentage of completions as called.

Success Rate Ball – Ratio of successfully pocketed balls to the total number of balls available to be pocketed. Your percentage of balls made per rack.
LOT/Games Self – Your Average LOT per games you’ve lost.

Opponent LOT/ Games - Your Opponents Average LOT per games lost by your opponent. ...FYI...LOT means balls Left On Table after each game

Match Closeness – Closeness is defined by how much of the match has been completed by you or your opponent. Match Closeness is the difference between how much of the match you complete versus how much of the match your opponent completes. i.e. shows the percent of the match that remains for your opponent when you win a match. If a Negative Number – percentage of the match left when you lose. Value of .333 means that you’re winning your match with your opponent still needing one third of his/her games to win the match.

Player Aggressiveness – Aggressiveness is an indicator of your ability to control the table. This is essentially the Ball Success Rate of your opponent. So the expectation is if you are able to control the table (more aggressive) your opponent’s Ball Success Rate will be low. i.e. the higher number here represents lower aggressiveness on your part.
Break and Run/ On the Break – Total of each.
 
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Sandbagging in TAP

I believe that TAP could do more to stop sandbagging. I have seen a 3 handicap get DQ'ed at titleholders 2 times as a 3 and play in his 3rd titleholder as a 3.

TAP does keep more stats than the APA, but they do not do a game by game format wich promotes bagging, as well as letting people shoot 1.5-2.0 over thier cap at big events.

Could you imagine your first national trip with TAP, you go 10-1 leading upto natioanls, and you drive over 1000 miles away and on day 1 in the round robin, you get dq'ed? Now you sit there 1000 miles away from home, and they won't even let you compete in the mini's. Even if your a 3, and you say HEY, then make me a 7 and let me play in the mini's, they say no.

I have asked the question, why not raise people during the big events, let your all pro pool-net system do it's job and raise people, they said, what if everyone on the team gets raised and they can't compete, i said what if everyone on the team gets DQ'ed, they can't get play anyways. A DQ does nothing but make the league smaller. I have seen several honest players get DQ'ed and never come back to the league. Quite sad.

THe level of competition in tap is uncomparable to the APA. It is another night out with friends, and fun to bang balls with the best players around. I will be in TAP as long as it is around, but our town has gone from 20 teams to 6 teams in recent years.

I figured there was alot of good said about TAP , people should be aware of the bad. LORD knows i am not allowed to post any questions on the TAP message boards, they just wanna ban me for 30 days everytime i ask them a question. I got banned from facebook, because i asked why certain area's are allowed to roster 2-7 handicaps and some area's are not, but we all must abide by the same rules in dream team events and nationals. THey sent me a letter saying that they use facebook to promote the league and i am banned for 30 days. THey could have just given me a simple explanation.

I also seen TAP DQ a 17 year old kid as a 6 in the singles event at Valley Forge. He was down 4-1 in a race to 5 and came back to win and got dq'ed. THe kid is a mogul in TAP. Has never bagged in his life. He also played as a 6 on my team the following year at valley forge. SO the kid gets dq'ed as a6 and then they let him come back the next year as a 6. This refers back to the 3 who got dq'ed twice and played in his 3rd titleholder as a 3.

THe level of competition in tap is uncomparable to the APA. It is another night out with friends, and fun to bang balls with the best players around. I will be in TAP as long as it is around, but our town has gone from 20 teams to 6 teams in recent years. SO while other places may be flourishing, our area is diminishing.

If you like to bang balls around with weak players. join APA, if you like stiff competition, then play TAP.
 
hmmm

labatt ice rod said:
If you call that free enterprise then your just as bad as the rest of them. To go after someones business is fine that's the nature of the beast but to try and set your sites on just one league is wrong
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It's not personal, it's just business. And if everyone is happy at APA, they would not need to move to TAP, and if some suspect that maybe TAP is trying to come up with a little better product that just might entice some players to jump ship, good for them.

Do you really think Coke does not have it's sights directly on Pepsi every day and vice versa?? And do you think they go into staduims, theaters, concert halls, bascially, any and every venue possible to try and pursuade them their product is better and will provide them with better service and better price?? I'm only using them as an example, I'm a Dr. Pepper guy myself.

If someone can build a better (I don't know yet if it is better but willing to listen) mousetrap, I say have at it and good luck.....
 
Very Well Put!!!!

I have to say I agree with you totally here Sam. It seems that maybe labatt ice Rod should climb out of that beer bottle as his opinions seem a little one sided. Maybe he has had issues where the only league he can play in at this time is CPA. I am a true supporter of the sport of pool and respect all of the time and effort that all members are must commit to in order to make a league successful. It seems to me unless you try it, dont knock it!!! Scarborough TAP rocks, it has tripled in size within a year, yes, that is good business!!! Competition at its finest!:smile:

Sam at TAP said:
TAP has a different handicapping system then the APA/CPA. Many players at the 5-6 and 7 skill levels in the APA are one lower in TAP. This is not uncommon at all and sandbagging has nothing to do with it. Also,TAP has a 25 point team limit compared to 23 points in that league which means teams do not have to look for lower skill level players as much in TAP. Lower skilled players will result in players handicaps going up since the average 5 will win more often and go to a 6 faster in that league then in TAP.
As for TAP going after someone else's business, I believe they call that free enterprise...Exp...Pepsi vs Coke, BK vs Micky D's, Home Depot vs Lowes. I personally had the APA ops here contact my players and even use my name in the past to try and get TAP teams. I guess that is OK?

P.S....Of the 35+ new licensees I mentioned, I believe everyone but one was a former or at the time current APA member. We didn't call them. They called us.

I wish you the best in whatever league you play and compete in....Sam
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