aftermarket shafts.
- Thread starter jcs003
- Start date
Shafts
Hi John,
I am a just barely a "B" Level player, so I am sure some shortstops and pros can add more info. This topic has a lot of prior information throughout the AZ Board history also.
I know that I experimented a lot with shafts over the years as I advanced from a middle-aged beginning player to my current level. Early on, I thought the radial shafts were the thing, and they seemed to improve my game dramatically. I used the Meucci Black Dot Shaft for a while, and it was a good one. I then used an OB Shaft for a while, and it performed well also. Since then I have played with the Tiger X Shaft, the Mezz WD Shaft, and the Universal Shaft. All of these products are good shafts, but each will play a little different. Most will offer a very firm hit that feels almost rigid when compared to a normal shaft feedback. You will probably be able to draw better and spin the ball easier with these shafts, but the diameter of the shaft will be a large part of this effect. Of all of the shafts that I have mentioned, I personally prefer the Universal and the Mezz Shafts. The Universal is nice, because you can change the joint fitting to fit any cue butt that you may purchase in the future. This is a nice feature when you are still playing around with cues and looking for the right feel. I liked the Mezz Shaft just because the hit felt right to me, but that is subjective.
After many years of this switching back and forth, I started practicing using three or four different cues in one practice session. After a while, I learned to shoot at my best with any cue or shaft (within reason) that I pickup. The skill doesn't come from the shaft, it comes from learning to control the tool that you are using. By keeping your mechanics simple, you can play near your best with a standard cue shaft (like a McDermott) or with a radial cue shaft. Just learn the result of your stroke with what ever tool you work with. Most variance will be due to the shaft diameter, tip shape and composition, and your own stroke problems.
Again, I realize that I am an amateur compared to the World Class talent on this board, but my friends and I have played around with shafts and cue combinations a lot, and thought I would contribute with my experience as a start-up for any further comments.
Good luck.
R.C.
Hi John,
I am a just barely a "B" Level player, so I am sure some shortstops and pros can add more info. This topic has a lot of prior information throughout the AZ Board history also.
I know that I experimented a lot with shafts over the years as I advanced from a middle-aged beginning player to my current level. Early on, I thought the radial shafts were the thing, and they seemed to improve my game dramatically. I used the Meucci Black Dot Shaft for a while, and it was a good one. I then used an OB Shaft for a while, and it performed well also. Since then I have played with the Tiger X Shaft, the Mezz WD Shaft, and the Universal Shaft. All of these products are good shafts, but each will play a little different. Most will offer a very firm hit that feels almost rigid when compared to a normal shaft feedback. You will probably be able to draw better and spin the ball easier with these shafts, but the diameter of the shaft will be a large part of this effect. Of all of the shafts that I have mentioned, I personally prefer the Universal and the Mezz Shafts. The Universal is nice, because you can change the joint fitting to fit any cue butt that you may purchase in the future. This is a nice feature when you are still playing around with cues and looking for the right feel. I liked the Mezz Shaft just because the hit felt right to me, but that is subjective.
After many years of this switching back and forth, I started practicing using three or four different cues in one practice session. After a while, I learned to shoot at my best with any cue or shaft (within reason) that I pickup. The skill doesn't come from the shaft, it comes from learning to control the tool that you are using. By keeping your mechanics simple, you can play near your best with a standard cue shaft (like a McDermott) or with a radial cue shaft. Just learn the result of your stroke with what ever tool you work with. Most variance will be due to the shaft diameter, tip shape and composition, and your own stroke problems.
Again, I realize that I am an amateur compared to the World Class talent on this board, but my friends and I have played around with shafts and cue combinations a lot, and thought I would contribute with my experience as a start-up for any further comments.
Good luck.
R.C.
Maybe your opinion is better than a pro's--as has been said here lots--pros can shoot with anything. Regular players are more sensitive to changes, and adjustments.
Everything you said was interesting.
thanks R.C. the universal is sounding like a good option. i have a bad eye so i am in the market for any equipment that will keep my game more consistent. i just got back in the game 6 weeks ago, so i am anxious to get close to my old skill level and need all the help i can get. but, i know they best tool if focus and practice, practice, practice...
I appreciate the insight Bob, I never thought about it that way.
JCS, maybe you can find a good deal on a used shaft here in the forums. Everybody likes to try them out, and they will often re-sell them after the novelty wears off. You should be able to save at least $50 off the new price, or perhaps one of the dealers can give you an AZ discount on a new shaft.
For me, the best thing to happen to my game was meeting an old pool hustler from the nineties and becoming friends with him. I taught him about tournaments and the non-gambling side of modern-day pool, and he taught me how to play much better. I never realized how much knowledge I was lacking until my friend started working with me. Books and videos are nice, and I certainly bought a lot of both, but a friend or coach cannot be beaten if you want to move your game up as fast as possible.
Good luck with the shaft. As for the eye, look at Davenport and what he did after his injury. It was really remarkable, as many thought he would never play again. I love that guy's game, as he is one of the smartest players ever with his game strategy, and he is an inspiration to watch.
JCS, maybe you can find a good deal on a used shaft here in the forums. Everybody likes to try them out, and they will often re-sell them after the novelty wears off. You should be able to save at least $50 off the new price, or perhaps one of the dealers can give you an AZ discount on a new shaft.
For me, the best thing to happen to my game was meeting an old pool hustler from the nineties and becoming friends with him. I taught him about tournaments and the non-gambling side of modern-day pool, and he taught me how to play much better. I never realized how much knowledge I was lacking until my friend started working with me. Books and videos are nice, and I certainly bought a lot of both, but a friend or coach cannot be beaten if you want to move your game up as fast as possible.
Good luck with the shaft. As for the eye, look at Davenport and what he did after his injury. It was really remarkable, as many thought he would never play again. I love that guy's game, as he is one of the smartest players ever with his game strategy, and he is an inspiration to watch.
High tech/high performance cue shafts are my specialty, but what's a Viper?
PM me for my tel# and I will get you sorted out.
crypto: good info. i was prospected, to porentially go pro as i was an accomplished player by the time i was 14. but, my father used me more on the gambling side of things and i never was able to get anywhere as the novelty of a kid playing against people for stakes. when the vision in my right eye deteriorated when i was 17 or 18 i put down the cue til recently. this time i want to try and do it right and the best equipment will be helpful.
CCC: i found this"viper" shaft on a google search and i just wanted to learn more about these hi-tech shafts. i will get the info as soon as i relocate it.
thanks crypto and CCC.
CCC: i found this"viper" shaft on a google search and i just wanted to learn more about these hi-tech shafts. i will get the info as soon as i relocate it.
thanks crypto and CCC.
Could be....
I know when I first started playng I thought paying $80 for a Players, was an expensive cue! In my experience the Customs/Top End production cues do come wth a highier quality shaft, but the initial cost is more then some wanna get into. Then if you have a cue you like and wear out a shaft on, but still are married to the cue, you can "renew" its life with a new shaft, and why not try out the tech stuff!?:grin:
I know when I first started playng I thought paying $80 for a Players, was an expensive cue! In my experience the Customs/Top End production cues do come wth a highier quality shaft, but the initial cost is more then some wanna get into. Then if you have a cue you like and wear out a shaft on, but still are married to the cue, you can "renew" its life with a new shaft, and why not try out the tech stuff!?:grin:
I dont think it is, in fact I agree with him.
It cracks me up to see Southwest cues or others with an aftermarket shafts. What you should really be looking at who makes a great cue.
I, too, tried them and found I played no better or no worse with an aftermarket shaft.
IMO;
Its the Indian not the arrow.
I suggest that you have bought into the marketing, like many have.
I recommend you find a great cuemaker, (Rick Howard cues are bargins) with a great taper and youll find they are better than any aftermarket cue.
Best of rolls,
Ken
maybe you should add in my opinion to that some of us are quite happy with our aftermarket shafts on our custom cues and may feel you dont know what you are talking about and just buying into a name and as far as southwest goes nice cue but i dont care for the hit myself.
well im a mechanical engineer and the mechanics are sound. composite materials are a beneficial approach to correcting shortcomings in a single material. i have a joss and id like the benefits of both a mild taper and aggressive taper. a cpmposite shaft provides this.
Here are some basics that you must know before buying an aftermarket shaft:
- pro taper or euro taper
- tip size
- type of hit: soft or hard, lively or dead
- type of ferrule
- feel
- weight
- LD or not and how much of it
Number one reason to go aftermarket is the low deflection aspect, which makes spinning the whitey easier.
In that category only 2 companies matter, Predator and OB.
The standard is Predator z^2 (euro taper, 11.75mm tip) and 314^2 (pro taper 12.75mm tip).
The z^2 offers less deflection than 314^2 but 314^2 is the one most people use.
In the equivalent category we have OB shafts:
OB1 – (314^2) : OB has wooden ferrule, glue lines visible, softer hit, more flexible shaft. LD is the same. OB1 is extremely lively.
OB2- (z^2): OB has wooden ferrule, glue lines visible, softer hit, more flexible shaft. LD is the same. OB1 is extremely lively.
OB classic has worse LD than 314^2 and OB classic pro has worse LD than z^2. More solid and not too lively hit on the OB’s.
Predator also makes Predator Fat shaft and so does OB but.
I have LD shafts from numerous other cue makers to compare with and most of them are not as good as Predator or OB.
My personal choice is the original shaft on my Stout and a Predator 314^2 depending on which cue I’m using.
If I was to give someone advice who cannot tryout the shafts then I would recommend Predator 314^2 with no modifications and 4oz or more in weight. It seems this configuration appeals to most people.
Good Luck.
- pro taper or euro taper
- tip size
- type of hit: soft or hard, lively or dead
- type of ferrule
- feel
- weight
- LD or not and how much of it
Number one reason to go aftermarket is the low deflection aspect, which makes spinning the whitey easier.
In that category only 2 companies matter, Predator and OB.
The standard is Predator z^2 (euro taper, 11.75mm tip) and 314^2 (pro taper 12.75mm tip).
The z^2 offers less deflection than 314^2 but 314^2 is the one most people use.
In the equivalent category we have OB shafts:
OB1 – (314^2) : OB has wooden ferrule, glue lines visible, softer hit, more flexible shaft. LD is the same. OB1 is extremely lively.
OB2- (z^2): OB has wooden ferrule, glue lines visible, softer hit, more flexible shaft. LD is the same. OB1 is extremely lively.
OB classic has worse LD than 314^2 and OB classic pro has worse LD than z^2. More solid and not too lively hit on the OB’s.
Predator also makes Predator Fat shaft and so does OB but.
I have LD shafts from numerous other cue makers to compare with and most of them are not as good as Predator or OB.
My personal choice is the original shaft on my Stout and a Predator 314^2 depending on which cue I’m using.
If I was to give someone advice who cannot tryout the shafts then I would recommend Predator 314^2 with no modifications and 4oz or more in weight. It seems this configuration appeals to most people.
Good Luck.
Last edited:
Hell, I agree with you. I dont know what I am talking about.
Does anyone have an aftermarket shaft that fits my Szam?
Gus, is now spinning.
LOL
Ken
You welcome.
LD - Low Deflection. Basically the front part of the shaft is drilled out in order to reduce the end mass.
So, when you put left or right spin on the ball the cueball will tend to move straight instead of squirting sideways away from the tip.
:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:
you are correct on that but i dont see how that relates to the discussion, and there are other advantages to laminated shafts not just the low deflection properties that are the main feature most of them promote.