sportsmanship: a tale of two experiences

jalapus logan

jalapus logan

be all. and supports it to
Silver Member
Hey there guys. I've been too busy to actively post or play much pool for that matter for the last three or so months (helping start a new business with a friend). However, I did get the pool bug last week and decided to try to get back in stroke by practicing for three nights this week. I finally got back to feeling like my old pool self, so I thought I'd play one of my regular pool buds since I finally got a free afternoon off on Friday (only because I had to work all day on Saturday :frown:). Anyway, he decided he wanted to play some bar box 8 ball (note that I play 90% of my games on a 9' Diamond and much prefer the big tables). We played two races to 10 and I won each 10 to 2. I played pretty solid for me, achieving 7 of my cumulative 20 wins with break and runs, yielding a b & r score of 35%.

Now, here's why I found this notable. Rather than merely shake my hand after the second set was over, he made a point of it to mention that I had "gotten many lucky rolls" during the set. I know that we've all heard this before, but come on! I don't think that a fella can luck out a couple of lopsided victories with that many break and runs. Now, mind you that I have been practicing for several years and he and I used to play even - which is no longer the case. In fact, he now comes with several excuses about why I regularly beat him. The most amusing to me is when he tells me that my new ball set (the new Aramith Duramith Tournament set) "just plays funny". Yeah, right. Of course, I beat him just as handily with any ball set he prefers.

Ok. So that's that experience from Friday. Now compare that situation with the competitive spirit that I witnessed yesterday. I was a judge in a tree climbing competition where each competitor is playing for cash, prizes, etc. Not once did I witness any poor sportsmanship what so ever. In fact, even those competitors who posed a threat to win it were actually rooting and cheering each other on at each leg of the event. Yes, this is going to sound a bit cheesy and all, but this community would rather build each other up and win honorably and foster an honest to god positive experience for everyone. In fact, I witnessed almost the entire gathering root for this one female contestant put her heart and soul into a event even when she had timed out and had been disqualified. The crowd roared and urged her to continue a truly arduous trek to complete the task soley for her own edification.

Now, I think that the latter tale much better exemplifies sportsmanship and yields a much better and clearly more positive experience than the former, wouldn't you think? I think that it is of uber-importance to remind people that winning is not the only thing that matters. Yes, the thing that matters at the end of the day is whether or not you play the game honestly and to the best of your ability at that time. Even if you find yourself struggling to play at 70% or so of your top speed, if that's all you can honestly muster, then I would argue that you did just fine, even if your efforts yielded a loss on paper (or even for some green paper :grin:).

Perhaps these 34 years on planet earth have warped my views a bit. But all I know is that I play better and enjoy the game so much more when I encourage my opponent an pay them compliments rather than cheat or shark them.

Well, that's all I got for ya'. Carry on, happy shooting, and cheers as always,

JL

edit: note that this post is lucky # 666 - BWAAAA HAAA HAAA HAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!
 
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most forms of competition are or were fun

jalapus logan said:
Hey there guys. I've been too busy to actively post or play much pool for that matter for the last three or so months (helping start a new business with a friend). However, I did get the pool bug last week and decided to try to get back in stroke by practicing for three nights this week. I finally got back to feeling like my old pool self, so I thought I'd play one of my regular pool buds since I finally got a free afternoon off on Friday (only because I had to work all day on Saturday :frown:). Anyway, he decided he wanted to play some bar box 8 ball (note that I play 90% of my games on a 9' Diamond and much prefer the big tables). We played two races to 10 and I won each 10 to 2. I played pretty solid for me, achieving 7 of my cumulative 20 wins with break and runs, yielding a b & r score of 35%.

Now, here's why I found this notable. Rather than merely shake my hand after the second set was over, he made a point of it to mention that I had "gotten many lucky rolls" during the set. I know that we've all heard this before, but come on! I don't think that a fella can luck out a couple of lopsided victories with that many break and runs. Now, mind you that I have been practicing for several years and he and I used to play even - which is no longer the case. In fact, he now comes with several excuses about why I regularly beat him. The most amusing to me is when he tells me that my new ball set (the new Aramith Duramith Tournament set) "just plays funny". Yeah, right. Of course, I beat him just as handily with any ball set he prefers.

Ok. So that's that experience from Friday. Now compare that situation with the competitive spirit that I witnessed yesterday. I was a judge in a tree climbing competition where each competitor is playing for cash, prizes, etc. Not once did I witness any poor sportsmanship what so ever. In fact, even those competitors who posed a threat to win it were actually rooting and cheering each other on at each leg of the event. Yes, this is going to sound a bit cheesy and all, but this community would rather build each other up and win honorably and foster an honest to god positive experience for everyone. In fact, I witnessed almost the entire gathering root for this one female contestant put her heart and soul into a event even when she had timed out and had been disqualified. The crowd roared and urged her to continue a truly arduous trek to complete the task soley for her own edification.

Now, I think that the latter tale much better exemplifies sportsmanship and yields a much better and clearly more positive experience than the former, wouldn't you think? I think that it is of uber-importance to remind people that winning is not the only thing that matters. Yes, the thing that matters at the end of the day is whether or not you play the game honestly and to the best of your ability at that time. Even if you find yourself struggling to play at 70% or so of your top speed, if that's all you can honestly muster, then I would argue that you did just fine, even if your efforts yielded a loss on paper (or even for some green paper :grin:).

Perhaps these 34 years on planet earth have warped my views a bit. But all I know is that I play better and enjoy the game so much more when I encourage my opponent an pay them compliments rather than cheat or shark them.

Well, that's all I got for ya'. Carry on, happy shooting, and cheers as always,

JL

edit: note that this post is lucky # 666 - BWAAAA HAAA HAAA HAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!
Click to expand...


I have competed with cars, straight line and circles; guns, rifle and pistol; in pool; and a handful of other things. I enjoy all forms of competition particularly one on one or one against the field. However some forms of competition like pool aren't really fun. There is a difference between enjoying competing and having fun at the time.

Racing dirt was pure fun. We loaned and gave away equipment to help each other, sometimes worked all week on somebody else's car, and then went at it hammer and tongs and no quarter given when the green flag dropped. I often had a tablespoon of dirt in each cheek at the end of a race from laughing so much while I was racing. Unfortunately that was almost forty years ago. I went to a dirt track race a few years ago and the fun and comradrie was missing. I don't think it would be the same now or maybe I just went to the wrong track.

Shooting benchrest alongside world champions there was talk and banter almost nonstop even in major events, fun even while struggling to win.

Shooting pistols we freely shared information and if somebody needed to borrow a gun or ammo after a problem it was freely provided. We help each other and root each other on, we just try to do a little better!

Maybe this is more to do with what is wrong with pool as a sport than we realize. Seems that we are much more a bunch of individuals and there is no group unity or feeling that we are all in this together. I enjoy competing against others. It is fun to compete with others. There is only a few degrees of difference there but it is still a huge difference.

Hu
 
ShootingArts said:
I have competed with cars, straight line and circles; guns, rifle and pistol; in pool; and a handful of other things. I enjoy all forms of competition particularly one on one or one against the field. However some forms of competition like pool aren't really fun. There is a difference between enjoying competing and having fun at the time.

Racing dirt was pure fun. We loaned and gave away equipment to help each other, sometimes worked all week on somebody else's car, and then went at it hammer and tongs and no quarter given when the green flag dropped. I often had a tablespoon of dirt in each cheek at the end of a race from laughing so much while I was racing. Unfortunately that was almost forty years ago. I went to a dirt track race a few years ago and the fun and comradrie was missing. I don't think it would be the same now or maybe I just went to the wrong track.

Shooting benchrest alongside world champions there was talk and banter almost nonstop even in major events, fun even while struggling to win.

Shooting pistols we freely shared information and if somebody needed to borrow a gun or ammo after a problem it was freely provided. We help each other and root each other on, we just try to do a little better!

Maybe this is more to do with what is wrong with pool as a sport than we realize. Seems that we are much more a bunch of individuals and there is no group unity or feeling that we are all in this together. I enjoy competing against others. It is fun to compete with others. There is only a few degrees of difference there but it is still a huge difference.

Hu
Click to expand...

I agree completely. Personally, I would rather help to elevate other player's ability and encourage other competitors simply because it's much more rewarding to play well against players with greater ability and because it helps to grow the sport by sharing knowledge.

Sadly, in pool it seems like so many would rather be the king of pauper's island rather than a citizen of an organization that is worth its' salt. I suppose that you are probably right that the few degrees of difference might just be making or breaking this sport...
 
You guys have been around for a while I guess.
You KNOW that pool has always been a bunch of BS at most levels. Never expect much from a pack of pool hustlers...it just won't happen.
I think one of the reasons is that pool has been pawned off as a "sport" when in reality, it is nothing but a game. Very little athletic ability is required, except for maybe 5%, most players are fat, loudmouthed, drunks, and looking for trouble if things don't go their way.
All you have to do is read some of the posts..."I will kill you".."I will bet a zillion"..."you no gamble nit", etc etc etc. Can you imagine garbage like that being spewed back and forth on a golf course...where REAL athletics takes place?
Unfortunately for those of us who really love and enjoy the game, the losers in life make it hard for everyone. Personally I dont think it will ever change...just my 2 cents.
Regards,
Flash
 
First, let me say to the OP, great post! I enjoy reading positive stories about "sportsmanship" (obviously the second story...). Thanks for posting this!

GoldenFlash said:
...I think one of the reasons is that pool has been pawned off as a "sport" when in reality, it is nothing but a game. Very little athletic ability is required, except for maybe 5%, most players are fat, loudmouthed, drunks, and looking for trouble if things don't go their way.
All you have to do is read some of the posts..."I will kill you".."I will bet a zillion"..."you no gamble nit", etc etc etc. Can you imagine garbage like that being spewed back and forth on a golf course...where REAL athletics takes place?...
Click to expand...

"Sport" is defined as: "An activity involving physical exertion and skill in which an individual or team competes against another or others." So, even in your post, by definition, you agree that it is in fact a sport (I agree that "very little athletic ability is required"...but even to the smallest degree, it is thusly classified). Again, by definition, two 400 pound couch potatos racing to the refridgerator for the last beer would be classified as "sport"...

As far as your argument regarding GOLFERS...ummmm....maybe you're referring to what you see on TV with regards to golfers on the PGA tour (mind you, not EVERYTHING is televised!).

However, owning an indoor golf facility where I get groups of 12-16 golfers all playing at the same time (the "regulars" on a Saturday morning from the closest outdoor golf course) I can tell you that you are WAY OFF with regards to your impression of golfers!!! These guys are big-time drinkers, gamblers, and trash talkers...in fact, they make Earl Strickland look like Mother Theresa!!! I've seen these guys almost go toe-to-toe because someone "grounded" their club in the "fake sand" I have in the simulator because "that's against the rules!"...and I think there was MAYBE $3 on the line for that 18-holes~and these guys are supposed to be "friends"!!! I would NOT classify 90% of the golfers I know as "athletic"...they may be involved in an athletic activity, but for me to classify them as "athletic"...nope, never gonna happen from me!

Jason

p.s. This wasn't an "attack" on you GoldenFlash...just putting in my $0.02 because I've seen the "flip-side"...
 
2 experiences

I think it's important to note that there are some competitive events that rely heavily on skill with little impact from aspects of chance or luck. For example...strong man competitions, competitive diving, gymnastics etc. etc. Then there are events where chance plays a big factor like poker, crapps or roulette.

When chance or luck plays a factor in the outcome, it's easy to cast blame if you are on the losing end and as such, people are not so likely to be supportive of all the competitors especially if you feel that you are more talented but luck was against you.

On the other hand, if chance or luck is not a factor, then the outcome is without a doubt the result of talent and it's very easy for people to get on board and support all the competetors. Afterall, if you lose, it is clear and apparent that someone else had more talent and that is easy to admire.

In addition, if it's a charity event, people automatically take on a universal sense of well being and support because the cause is the purpose of the event, not winning or losing.
 
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Sportsmanship

I know for a fact the OP is a gentleman as he plays. I had the pleasure of some one pocket games with him a few weeks ago and he was nothing but compliments and encouragement as we played. Looking back I wish I had returned the compliments as much in return.

I think we all can learn and progress in this game we play. Next time I will throw out more compliments and encouragement to my next opponent. Thanks for reminding me of important things.
 
Sportsmanship

This is a great topic- and something we should all take notice of.

Great post!!!

In the same 'vein' - too many posters think that a different viewpoint is the same as arguing.

We should just treat our fellow pool players (and all others) with a little more mutual respect - even if we disagree!

Mark griffin
 
jalapus logan said:
Now, here's why I found this notable. Rather than merely shake my hand after the second set was over, he made a point of it to mention that I had "gotten many lucky rolls" during the set. I know that we've all heard this before, but come on! I don't think that a fella can luck out a couple of lopsided victories with that many break and runs. Now, mind you that I have been practicing for several years and he and I used to play even - which is no longer the case. In fact, he now comes with several excuses about why I regularly beat him. The most amusing to me is when he tells me that my new ball set (the new Aramith Duramith Tournament set) "just plays funny". Yeah, right. Of course, I beat him just as handily with any ball set he prefers.

JL

edit: note that this post is lucky # 666 - BWAAAA HAAA HAAA HAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!
Click to expand...

You know how he is going to be before you even play him. You should just play me more, I only blame myself for playing bad :). You have the right attitude when it comes to pool. It's sad that some people just don't get it. The game is fun, but we are not doing anything to change the world. Just enjoy your free time, try to get better, and give it 100%. That's all you can do sir.

Give me a call, maybe we can play some soon.
 
]Sport" is defined as: "An activity involving physical exertion and skill in which an individual or team competes against another or others." So, even in your post, by definition, you agree that it is in fact a sport (I agree that "very little athletic ability is required"...but even to the smallest degree, it is thusly classified). Again, by definition, two 400 pound couch potatos racing to the refridgerator for the last beer would be classified as "sport"...

I guess I am wrong, oh well, what do I know...I've only seen this stuff in pool rooms for 62 years. I must be crazy myself.
"Sport" huh? Well I guess we all create our own sense of reality over the long run.:rolleyes:
I've often thought about if these blowholes get all crazy at a poker table in Vegas if they lose? Or...do they just slink away and keep quiet.
I think it's the latter because they know in that casino that nobody is going to put up with any of their antics and will toss them out on the street where they belong.
I can just imagine hearing one of them whining about "he was dealing seconds..I nailed his glimpse" "I know he did a hole card switch on 3rd street" "they were all in on it..didnt you see them pounding their chests scratching their ears and making all those funny signs, etc etc etc"
Old Strickland is right about one thing though (I guess this is his quote, the ubiquitous "they" says it is)...."Pool is a beautiful game played by ugly people". :smile:
 
I think you see lots less bad behavior the higher up the food chain you go. Case in point: I shot a little cheap 1P with Tony Mougey today. He's a great guy to play. He just played his game. No excuses--heck, he even called a foul on himself that I didn't see...no sharking, or anything of that sort. He was the same with everyone else I saw him play.

That's been my experience with every good player I've ever played. The only crap like you describe, that I've ever gotten, was from people who were shortstops, or less.

Players who do that stuff, have seen too many clips of Fats, far too many movies, and not played enough with players who really love the game.

Now, with some people I've played, we've made a big show of it--for the folks who are watching. Because pool in public is also entertainment, and if you are cool with it, it's fun to involve the railbirds and sweaters.

Even though I don't know him, I suspect that's what Earl is really doing sometimes.
 
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