If you are a pool player for any length of time, you have discovered that there is one or more cue brands that you prefer. They just feel right, FOR YOUR GAME. There in lies the rub. What you feel, in the HIT of your favorite is entirely different than your neighbors. That is the same as it is with the people making pool cues. If I like a neutual balanced cue, with a soft hit, than that's the way, I THINK CUES SHOULD BE MADE. We all expieriment & try to improve what we make, but we have preferences, that we put into what we make. Believe me I know a lot of Cuemakers & they are more players than scientists. We make what WE think is the right way & that is good for some, but not all...JER
Ferrule Hardness: The results are in! (and interesting!)
- Thread starter hdgis1
- Start date
I think what is required is a compressive strength test over a period of time.
Something that cycles a load to the hit of a break or play shot over X number of cycles.
Then measure the amount of deformation. On softer materials or shorter ferrules, there should be something to measure.
Something with the weight of a cueball hitting the test piece at 30 mph should be a good start.
The next step, is this done with or without a tip?
I have access to a pneumatic test machine that can be modified for this testing, just need the data to make it work.
Neil
hdgis1
New member
Allright man! I'm handing this over to you! It was easy to figure out how to do the hardness testing! Beyond that I'm at a loss! Lol
Chris
I think we need a compressive test but not necessarily over a period of time. Just a straight up compress-until-it-breaks test. No need to over complicate it.
These values of weight, strength, hardness, etc, are not meant to find the best ferrule but can give give us, or players, a guide in picking a ferrule. By no means, does this quantify playability or feel to individual players but it can help everyone understand how a ferrule may perform relative to to other ferrules. I see it the same way as testing hardness of tips. You have a known, which is the tip you currently play with, and you may want something harder or softer. It is a guide, not gospel. There is nothing wrong with learning and sharing the information. What you do with it is up to you.
sloppy chalkers
Hi,
I'm playing a long time and although it might help solve the problem of a sloppy chalker, I believe it's real intention is to keep the shaft from splitting and possibly a tip consideration along the same line of thought. Anyone disagree?
Bill
Hi,
I'm playing a long time and although it might help solve the problem of a sloppy chalker, I believe it's real intention is to keep the shaft from splitting and possibly a tip consideration along the same line of thought. Anyone disagree?
Bill
The ferrule keeps the shaft from splitting. Before ferrules, leather tips could and would mushroom. The act of mushrooming spreads, not only the leather, but the wood fibres as well. That causes splitting. Its the same reason fibre pads are used with ivory. Its not the impact, necessarily, but the spreading caused by impact.
Can't disagree with this but what's the deal with some of the high tech LD shafts w/o ferrules?
I've seen photos of some broken but not lately. Is it accepted that these will eventually crack?
I was really surprised with the hardness results of the saber-t from Tiger.
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3kushn
That's an interesting question you put. We mostly work with cues for pyramid, and here is our experience. Since the impact of heavier balls is stronger than in pool it is absolutely essential to have a fiber pad glued between wood and the tip. But we try to avoid installing ferrules because any foreign material other than wood does change the hit and the feel of a cue, which is important for a pyramid player. A cue with a ferrule gives harder hit/feel, even with Juma which proved to be closest to wood in terms of feel. And we are working with Aegis, Titan, Ivorine, etc. We usually install LBM. And usually do it following the customer's request - there are some players who hit so strong that they damage the shaft even with a fiber pad! But ferrules for pyramid cues we make are never longer than half an inch. A common for pool ferrule would hurt the hit of a pyramid cue and probably make it not suitable for quality play. So in pyramid, ferrules are only to protect the wood.
I've heard though that's how ferrules appeared on pool cues first - the cuemakers decided to protect the shafts from chalk. Hence their length of an inch, enough for extensive chalkers
That's an interesting question you put. We mostly work with cues for pyramid, and here is our experience. Since the impact of heavier balls is stronger than in pool it is absolutely essential to have a fiber pad glued between wood and the tip. But we try to avoid installing ferrules because any foreign material other than wood does change the hit and the feel of a cue, which is important for a pyramid player. A cue with a ferrule gives harder hit/feel, even with Juma which proved to be closest to wood in terms of feel. And we are working with Aegis, Titan, Ivorine, etc. We usually install LBM. And usually do it following the customer's request - there are some players who hit so strong that they damage the shaft even with a fiber pad! But ferrules for pyramid cues we make are never longer than half an inch. A common for pool ferrule would hurt the hit of a pyramid cue and probably make it not suitable for quality play. So in pyramid, ferrules are only to protect the wood.
I've heard though that's how ferrules appeared on pool cues first - the cuemakers decided to protect the shafts from chalk. Hence their length of an inch, enough for extensive chalkers
Vahmurka3kushn
That's an interesting question you put. We mostly work with cues for pyramid, and here is our experience. Since the impact of heavier balls is stronger than in pool it is absolutely essential to have a fiber pad glued between wood and the tip. But we try to avoid installing ferrules because any foreign material other than wood does change the hit and the feel of a cue, which is important for a pyramid player. A cue with a ferrule gives harder hit/feel, even with Juma which proved to be closest to wood in terms of feel. And we are working with Aegis, Titan, Ivorine, etc. We usually install LBM. And usually do it following the customer's request - there are some players who hit so strong that they damage the shaft even with a fiber pad! But ferrules for pyramid cues we make are never longer than half an inch. A common for pool ferrule would hurt the hit of a pyramid cue and probably make it not suitable for quality play. So in pyramid, ferrules are only to protect the wood.
I've heard though that's how ferrules appeared on pool cues first - the cuemakers decided to protect the shafts from chalk. Hence their length of an inch, enough for extensive chalkers
Your comments are what I'm thinking about the with the other thread on breaking with a playing cue. I don't have the strongest stroke in the world but 3C is the only game I play and 8 rail shots are reasonably common and I have no qualms of sending a ball 9 or attempt 11 with my cue. Haven't made 11 yet (close)but never worry about my cue for crying out loud.
I remember one of the old sales gimmicks where the saleman throws the cue tip into the floor to demonstrate its strength. Never saw one break and boy did I see some bounce. Probably proves nothing but it was impressive.
I may be getting some ferruless shafts in a few months I may have one of them with a Juma pad to feel the difference.
I am surprised to see XTC softer than MPI.
Is there any info or reviews on XTC? kinda hard to search for it with only 3 letters. thx
Super XTC. Inexpensive ferrule material sold by one of the larger suppliers (according to rules can only be mentioned in pm's). You can find it by googling it.
Thanks, but hoping for a forum thread review though.
In another thread, Murray Tucker came up with 87...
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=250306
not quite sure if its apples to apples though, different equipment. I do believe it's the same scale though at least.