A bigger backstroke helps?

[nrhoades]

Firstly, by now I know that all strokes are fingerprints. Self discovery is probably way more important than the collection of pieces of advice found here.

I've always had a jerky forward stroke and I couldn't figure out how to fix it. The solution was in learning that my backstroke wasn't large enough. I now focus on bringing the ferrule all the way back until it touches my bridge hand. THEN, I can pause properly, and execute a smooth forward stroke with proper power.

The key was learning to take a larger backstroke, but no one was able to communicate that to me. Is this a common thing you see?

 

[garczar]

Backstroke

I've been fortunate to have watched Buddy Hall play a ton of monster pool. He does exactly what you're saying. Very deliberate, ferrule all the way into his bridge, a slight pause and then a LASER straight delivery. When he was living in Tulsa just about everybody who watched him play or practice for any length of time improved their game. I asked him about the pause and he said he's done it from day one. Said it just felt natural. Genius stuff

 

[Scott Lee]

nrhoades...Regardless of suggestions, you never decided to see a qualified instructor, who might have (imo) pointed that out very quickly...or might have pointed out other inconsistencies in what you do. BTW, a longer backswing is not always the solution.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Firstly, by now I know that all strokes are fingerprints. Self discovery is probably way more important than the collection of pieces of advice found here.

I've always had a jerky forward stroke and I couldn't figure out how to fix it. The solution was in learning that my backstroke wasn't large enough. I now focus on bringing the ferrule all the way back until it touches my bridge hand. THEN, I can pause properly, and execute a smooth forward stroke with proper power.

The key was learning to take a larger backstroke, but no one was able to communicate that to me. Is this a common thing you see?

 

[randyg]

Firstly, by now I know that all strokes are fingerprints. Self discovery is probably way more important than the collection of pieces of advice found here.

I've always had a jerky forward stroke and I couldn't figure out how to fix it. The solution was in learning that my backstroke wasn't large enough. I now focus on bringing the ferrule all the way back until it touches my bridge hand. THEN, I can pause properly, and execute a smooth forward stroke with proper power.

The key was learning to take a larger backstroke, but no one was able to communicate that to me. Is this a common thing you see?

How long was your original backstroke?

I agree with you. We teach it every day.

Good post
randyg

 

[rrick33]

Back swing

I agree with Scott Lee, the back swing may not have been your problem. Quite often, we introduce new concepts that require us to pay closer attention to our technique. It is the focus on the details that actually brings about the improved results, not necessarily the new concept.

Traditionally, a longer back swing is paired with more power in the stroke delivery. Oddly enough, for many players with poor stroke techniques, striking the ball a little more firmly, reduces the effects of (CIT) Cue-induced-throw and allows for a more confident delivery which brings about better results.

If your bigger back swing is introducing greater momentum to the stroke, it may limit your ability to confidently utilize a gentile stroke when finesse is needed. I would not assume that the longer back swing is going to produce a long term benefit to your game. I'm willing to bet that if you perfected your stroke technique, you would soon find out that the longer back swing was just a temporary fix based on your current skill level.

 

[FranCrimi]

Firstly, by now I know that all strokes are fingerprints. Self discovery is probably way more important than the collection of pieces of advice found here.
I've always had a jerky forward stroke and I couldn't figure out how to fix it. The solution was in learning that my backstroke wasn't large enough. I now focus on bringing the ferrule all the way back until it touches my bridge hand. THEN, I can pause properly, and execute a smooth forward stroke with proper power.

The key was learning to take a larger backstroke, but no one was able to communicate that to me. Is this a common thing you see?

Well, I must admit...this is indeed one of the strangest ways I've seen anyone ask for help.

"Hey, you guys suck, but what do you think about this...."

 

[DogsPlayingPool]

I agree with Scott Lee, the back swing may not have been your problem. Quite often, we introduce new techniqes that require us to pay closer attention to our technique. It is the focus on the details that actually brings about the improved results, not necessarily the new technique.

Traditionally, a longer back swing is paired with more power in the stroke delivery. Oddly enough, for many players with poor stroke techniques, striking the ball a little more firmly, reduces the effects of (CIT) Cue-induced-throw and allows for a more confident delivery which brings about better results.

If your bigger back swing is introducing greater momentum to the stroke, it may limit your ability to confidently utilize a gentile stroke when finesse is needed. I would not assume that the longer back swing is going to produce a long term benefit to your game. I'm willing to bet that if you perfected your stroke technique, you would soon find out that the longer back swing was just a temporary fix based on your current skill level.

I thought CIT stood for collision induced throw. What is cue induced throw?

Thanks.

 

[rrick33]

CIT.....Collision and Cue ball....same thing. Though your interpretaion is probably more common.

 

[nrhoades]

Well, I must admit...this is indeed one of the strangest ways I've seen anyone ask for help.

"Hey, you guys suck, but what do you think about this...."

Sorry. The iPad sometimes impedes by thought process. I think what I meant was that I learn which pieces of advice are the most beneficial to me by trying them all. I also try to remember which concepts are absorbed into my game to most.

 

[nrhoades]

nrhoades...Regardless of suggestions, you never decided to see a qualified instructor, who might have (imo) pointed that out very quickly...or might have pointed out other inconsistencies in what you do. BTW, a longer backswing is not always the solution.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

I have been seeing one of the best instructors in the country. His philosophy is that cue ball control is most important, and that stroke is learned along the way. The position drills have been exposing flaws in my stroke, and I suppose I like to bounce my thoughts off of a public forum to find similarities in other peoples learning processes. I'm an introvert and I probably find satisfaction through text channels or perhaps I enjoy being an articulate student of the sport.

 

[nrhoades]

How long was your original backstroke?

I agree with you. We teach it every day.

Good post
randyg

My original backstroke was probably the length of my thumb. It would cause me to mentally couple power to initial acceleration, which forces my muscles to contract their way out of line on high English shots. I'm now acquiring the feel of using the potential energy stored in the nice long backstroke, which gives me the illusion of striking the ball softer. It lets me feel like I'm using the weight of the cue itself to move the cue ball, and power from my muscles in the forward motion isn't needed. Similar to pulling back a pendulum and just letting it swing into the cue ball. This must be closer to the answer.

But I think that the arrival to this mindset is also due to contributions of practice, and perhaps I wouldn't have been able to make this connection a year ago.

 

[Scott Lee]

I just read that you spent some quality time with Joe Tucker, who is indeed a great instructor! Good for you for taking the plunge.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

I have been seeing one of the best instructors in the country. His philosophy is that cue ball control is most important, and that stroke is learned along the way. The position drills have been exposing flaws in my stroke, and I suppose I like to bounce my thoughts off of a public forum to find similarities in other peoples learning processes. I'm an introvert and I probably find satisfaction through text channels or perhaps I enjoy being an articulate student of the sport.

 

[randyg]

My original backstroke was probably the length of my thumb. It would cause me to mentally couple power to initial acceleration, which forces my muscles to contract their way out of line on high English shots. I'm now acquiring the feel of using the potential energy stored in the nice long backstroke, which gives me the illusion of striking the ball softer. It lets me feel like I'm using the weight of the cue itself to move the cue ball, and power from my muscles in the forward motion isn't needed. Similar to pulling back a pendulum and just letting it swing into the cue ball. This must be closer to the answer.

But I think that the arrival to this mindset is also due to contributions of practice, and perhaps I wouldn't have been able to make this connection a year ago.

Perfect, good for you.
randyg

 

[randyg]

I have been seeing one of the best instructors in the country.

His philosophy is that cue ball control is most important, and that stroke is learned along the way.

The position drills have been exposing flaws in my stroke, and I suppose I like to bounce my thoughts off of a public forum to find similarities in other peoples learning processes. I'm an introvert and I probably find satisfaction through text channels or perhaps I enjoy being an articulate student of the sport.

That is the typical, "cart before the horse".
Sorry to hear this.
randyg

 

[phil]

I have been seeing one of the best instructors in the country. His philosophy is that cue ball control is most important, and that stroke is learned along the way. The position drills have been exposing flaws in my stroke, and I suppose I like to bounce my thoughts off of a public forum to find similarities in other peoples learning processes. I'm an introvert and I probably find satisfaction through text channels or perhaps I enjoy being an articulate student of the sport.

hey articulate student, this is exactly my learning process. on every shot i paid more attention and had that desire to stroke by stroke figure out what worked best for me,my style. but u also gotta take in absolutely everything you can. anyway chicken or the egg really

 

[FranCrimi]

I have been seeing one of the best instructors in the country. His philosophy is that cue ball control is most important, and that stroke is learned along the way. The position drills have been exposing flaws in my stroke, and I suppose I like to bounce my thoughts off of a public forum to find similarities in other peoples learning processes. I'm an introvert and I probably find satisfaction through text channels or perhaps I enjoy being an articulate student of the sport.

Sometimes the Internet is not a good thing.

If your instructor is one of the best in the country, then why are you second guessing him?

Suggestion: Commit to your instructor. Give him a chance. If you feel it's not working, then walk away, but don't do this second guessing thing. It does no good to you or to your teacher who is trying to help you.

 

[nrhoades]

hey articulate student, this is exactly my learning process. on every shot i paid more attention and had that desire to stroke by stroke figure out what worked best for me,my style. but u also gotta take in absolutely everything you can. anyway chicken or the egg really

I am steadily improving at a comfortable pace. Considering that I'm not single and have many other hobbies, I can't ask for more. Pool definitely isn't my life, and there is no rush. Good to hear that I'm working in the right direction

 

[nrhoades]

Sometimes the Internet is not a good thing.

If your instructor is one of the best in the country, then why are you second guessing him?

Suggestion: Commit to your instructor. Give him a chance. If you feel it's not working, then walk away, but don't do this second guessing thing. It does no good to you or to your teacher who is trying to help you.

Naaa. Stroke mechanics are unique to everybody. There are some guidelines that help but there's no formula. It's a discovery process. Talking about it with as many people as I can is part of my discovery process. Besides, second guessing is part of any learning process, especially as an engineer. There is no gospel; just varying degrees of good advice. But general, :in Joe I trust:.

 

[FranCrimi]

Naaa. Stroke mechanics are unique to everybody. There are some guidelines that help but there's no formula. It's a discovery process. Talking about it with as many people as I can is part of my discovery process. Besides, second guessing is part of any learning process, especially as an engineer. There is no gospel; just varying degrees of good advice. But general, :in Joe I trust:.

Yaaaaa... well I think you're making a mistake. You've got to give something enough time to see if it works. You're liable to wind up all over the place if you keep throwing in all those variables.

Anyway, to each his own, I guess. Good luck with your learning process.

 

[nrhoades]

Yaaaaa... well I think you're making a mistake. You've got to give something enough time to see if it works. You're liable to wind up all over the place if you keep throwing in all those variables.

Anyway, to each his own, I guess. Good luck with your learning process.

Good point. You're very right too. Too many variables aren't good either, and being all over the place is a problem I still have at times. A few hours of practice a week isn't enough to know if it works.

A lot of investment this game takes.