What is the best way to control speed?

[madmiller]

I heard many opinions on the subject and since I am a beginner in pool, I would like some advice. I started playing 4 years ago and learned on my own banging balls in different bars. Two years ago I started practicing seriously , read a lot of books, watch videos, etc...
During my "banging" years I learned that if I want the ball to go farther, I would hit it harder and vice versa if I want it to go close distance.
But recently I found out that you can achieve more consistent results if you hit the ball with the same speed, just changing the length of your stroke.
What is the best way to control it?

 

[Bob Jewett]

... But recently I found out that you can achieve more consistent results if you hit the ball with the same speed, just changing the length of your stroke.
What is the best way to control it?

As stated, that is false. A cue ball struck in the same place with the same speed of stick at impact will go the same distance regardless of the length of stroke. If that's really what someone told you, they are wrong and you should take everything else they have to say with a large grain of salt.

On the other hand, if you use the same force and acceleration in the forward motion -- and I'm using the definitions from physics -- a shorter stroke will necessarily result in a softer hit because you will not get as much energy into the cue stick over a short distance with constant force.

The problem with using only this technique is that if you try to cover the entire range of pool shots you will end up with either impossibly short strokes or strokes three feet long.

If you really want to learn speed control the best pool game for it is one pocket and the best carom game is straight rail.

 

[The Renfro]

Speed control is all about matching your mental imagery to reality... So while Bob is right as usual that the technique as described is false.. If you meant with the same force pay attention to the second part of his statement....

What really matters is that the speed you get on the table matches up to the speed you attempted to get... Easier said than done because this falls well into the realm of feel......

One thing that I suggest is to take your time while addressing the shot to see the entire shot including the cueball travel and final position... Take practice strokes while standing up trying to feel the right speed for the shot...

Once you are down on the shot speed should be locked in.. If it doesn't feel right get up and start over... Finding the speed while being down on the shot is much harder than from above because we go from the forest (seeing the whole shot from above) to the tree (sitting down on the aiming line)......

Normally I'd say just my opinion and I am not an instructor but I spent a few hours doing instruction on the break and stroke technique tonight on request so tonight I'll wear the cap =)

Good shooting,
Chris

 

[ChrisBanks]

If I wanted to learn the speed of a shot, I would set it up and shoot it 7,000 times until I had a very good idea how to hit it.

 

[madmiller]

As stated, that is false. A cue ball struck in the same place with the same speed of stick at impact will go the same distance regardless of the length of stroke. If that's really what someone told you, they are wrong and you should take everything else they have to say with a large grain of salt.

On the other hand, if you use the same force and acceleration in the forward motion -- and I'm using the definitions from physics -- a shorter stroke will necessarily result in a softer hit because you will not get as much energy into the cue stick over a short distance with constant force.

The problem with using only this technique is that if you try to cover the entire range of pool shots you will end up with either impossibly short strokes or strokes three feet long.

If you really want to learn speed control the best pool game for it is one pocket and the best carom game is straight rail.

What I meant is what I highlighted in your reply.
I just got back from practice and I tried this new method. Wow! what a difference! I noticed that my position play got a lot better( using the same force and acceleration makes it easier to control the whitey) and I stopped missing long powerful shots or draw shots where I have to move the cueball two lengths of the table for example.
I used to think too much about the power that I had to use in order to execute this shot and usualy my stroke or grip or something else went out of wack at the last moment and I missed. Now I do the same thing like on a regular shot , but with a longer stroke and - wow! I don't miss and I can easily draw the ball to the length that yesterday I could only dream of!!!

 

[madmiller]

If I wanted to learn the speed of a shot, I would set it up and shoot it 7,000 times until I had a very good idea how to hit it.

that's how I learned to make a stop shot. I don't have an access to the pool table too often, so when I go to the pool hall, usually two- three times a month, I practice long straight-in shot for 4 to 5 hours until I can't miss it.
I used to make a couple, then miss, then make another few, then miss again.
With practice my misses become obsolete :grin-square: and the percentage of making those in a row without missing grows. A month ago I believe my best was 15 in a row, two weeks ago 87. Last week I was one short of a hundred in a row.
That's a very tough shot, even though it seems easy.
The cueball is in the jaws of the corner pocket, the object ball is in the middle of the table and I shoot it into the opposite corner.
I never counted how many of those I shoot, but it has to be close to 7000 that you're talking about.

 

[madmiller]

Speed control is all about matching your mental imagery to reality... So while Bob is right as usual that the technique as described is false.. If you meant with the same force pay attention to the second part of his statement....

What really matters is that the speed you get on the table matches up to the speed you attempted to get... Easier said than done because this falls well into the realm of feel......

One thing that I suggest is to take your time while addressing the shot to see the entire shot including the cueball travel and final position... Take practice strokes while standing up trying to feel the right speed for the shot...

Once you are down on the shot speed should be locked in.. If it doesn't feel right get up and start over... Finding the speed while being down on the shot is much harder than from above because we go from the forest (seeing the whole shot from above) to the tree (sitting down on the aiming line)......

Normally I'd say just my opinion and I am not an instructor but I spent a few hours doing instruction on the break and stroke technique tonight on request so tonight I'll wear the cap =)

Good shooting,
Chris

Thanks for the advice! The only thing that I don't do is what I highlighted.
I don't do practice strokes!
I agree with everything else. When I committed to the shot and down already, I don't change anything. If anything doesn't feel right, I get up and do it again!

 

[One Pocket John]

I heard many opinions on the subject and since I am a beginner in pool, I would like some advice. I started playing 4 years ago and learned on my own banging balls in different bars. Two years ago I started practicing seriously , read a lot of books, watch videos, etc...
During my "banging" years I learned that if I want the ball to go farther, I would hit it harder and vice versa if I want it to go close distance.
But recently I found out that you can achieve more consistent results if you hit the ball with the same speed, just changing the length of your stroke.
What is the best way to control it?

I am not an Instructor.

There is a method that you may want to toy with. It was taught to my instructor many years ago by Vernon Elliott and then finally passed down to me. So now I passing it down.

It will get you in the ball park but is no substitute for feel.

The method requires that the same cue stick speed is used and that you always go to your end of stroke (finish). The bridge should stay at 12" from the QB

Using a practice cue that has a linen wrap, from where the wrap starts measure down 2" and mark it with a magic marker, keep making these marks all the way down toward the butt. You should end up with marks at
2, 4, 6, 8, 10, and 12".
At these points is where you will hold the cue for different shots to position the cue ball.

I would suggest for practice that you purchase Bert Kinisters (spelling) 9 ball workout. There are a ton of shots on that DVD. His #1 shot is the cue stick speed to use.

One other thing I forgot to mention is the hit on the OB. You want to hit the OB with what I call a pure hit, in other words dont under hit the OB or over hit the OB. You will know when your hitting the balls pure, they will sound different when going into the pocket.

As always have fun. :smile:

John

 

[Donny Lutz]

Speed control factors

I heard many opinions on the subject and since I am a beginner in pool, I would like some advice. I started playing 4 years ago and learned on my own banging balls in different bars. Two years ago I started practicing seriously , read a lot of books, watch videos, etc...
During my "banging" years I learned that if I want the ball to go farther, I would hit it harder and vice versa if I want it to go close distance.
But recently I found out that you can achieve more consistent results if you hit the ball with the same speed, just changing the length of your stroke.
What is the best way to control it?

The speed that a cue ball moves (and thus the distance it travels) is affected by:

The speed of the cue tip as it strikes the CB.

Contact with any object ball.

The spin on the CB when it strikes an object ball.

The spin on the CB when it strikes a rail.

So you need to learn how to control these factors and when to use them.

You can find details on this in books, mags, etc., but it's probably best taught in person by an instructor.

 

[Scott Lee]

We teach using the same range of motion (read: stroke length) for most shots, and then train our students to learn how to adjust the forward rate of acceleration (since you're always starting at zero, at the end of your backswing). When you have a natural start and finish position for your cuestick, it is much easier to learn how to "feel" subtle differences in cue speed. Most players hit the ball three ways...a bunt or dink, a 'normal' playing speed stroke, and a break swing. These are usually radically different physiologically and psychologically. IMO, it's becomes MUCH easier when you have the same stroke length (meaning your cuetip finishes in the same place on most shots...from a lag to a break). We teach 10 different speeds, using the exact same set up and delivery process. Seems to work very well for most students who adopt it. :grin:

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

 

[madmiller]

We teach using the same range of motion (read: stroke length) for most shots, and then train our students to learn how to adjust the forward rate of acceleration (since you're always starting at zero, at the end of your backswing). When you have a natural start and finish position for your cuestick, it is much easier to learn how to "feel" subtle differences in cue speed. Most players hit the ball three ways...a bunt or dink, a 'normal' playing speed stroke, and a break swing. These are usually radically different physiologically and psychologically. IMO, it's becomes MUCH easier when you have the same stroke length (meaning your cuetip finishes in the same place on most shots...from a lag to a break). We teach 10 different speeds, using the exact same set up and delivery process. Seems to work very well for most students who adopt it. :grin:

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

when I play regular shots, nothing extreme, then my tip finishes in the same place all the time, what I change is the length of my stroke and that's what changes the speed of the shot drastically.
Or maybe I should say my backswing's length changes.
Sorry, English is not my first language, so maybe I sometimes cannot express what I want to say on the first try.

So basically, yesterday when I started practicing this, I changed the speed of the ball hitting the cueball with the same force, just changing the length of my backswing, instead of trying to hit the ball harder or softer, how I used to do it. And this new approach so far works very well for me.