The Break
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Mr Creedo... you are correcto-mundo about a tight rack. I think Johnny Archer once said, "I know they're touching, but they're not frozen".
The Break Shot is just a complex shot, there's no getting around that situation. The Big Boys have to know what they are doing, in order to eat, but only a small portion of them practice the Break Shot.... We all know that SVB practices the Break Shot, but very few, if any, follow his lead.
The Break Shot is just a complex shot, there's no getting around that situation. The Big Boys have to know what they are doing, in order to eat, but only a small portion of them practice the Break Shot.... We all know that SVB practices the Break Shot, but very few, if any, follow his lead.
I think this break issue should be categorized. For the pro player likely playing on a 9' table with new or relatively new cloth and clean balls, it's one thing. Then you have the rest of us mere mortals that are likely playing on a bar box or in a pool room where the conditions are different with too many variables to possibly take into account. I clearly fall into that latter category.
First, I think you need to spend a fair amount of time practicing your break. I purchased a BreakRak and it has helped a ton. If you're not going to invest significant time in practicing your break, all the advice on these threads is mostly useless. Regardless of where you break from, what speed you attempt to use and whether you apply English or not, you must be able to hit OB with the CB fairly precisely. Giving up any amount of precision in an effort to increase CB speed is a negative.
With all that said, after much practice and experimenting with different methods, I've found spotting the CB 2 diamonds up and 1 diamond out from the long rail yields the most consistent results for me in 9 ball. I try to hit the 1 ball dead square, no English with my cue tip right at middle CB. I use my normal stroke and if I'm successful in hitting square, this will squat the CB for me near right center of the table. I make a wing ball with reasonable consistency and most often get 3 or 4 balls near the other end of the table with a shot on the 1 ball available the majority of the time. Using the Break App on my iPhone, my break speed is consistently in the range of 17 to 18 mph.
Given my lack of CB speed, my 8 ball break sucks when trying to hit the head ball. I've resorted to the 2nd ball break pretty much exclusively. The bad and good news with this is that it generally leaves a tough table to run out. Since I'm usually playing the other team's best player in league, I'm fine with that. If for some reason I get matched up with a weaker player, I may fire at the head ball to try and get a better spread.
I'm doing some weight work and actually experimenting with practicing the break with a heavier cue to try and increase my break speed. I've wondered if the heavier cue will help. I also wondered if anyone makes a heavy "donut" similar to what baseball players put on their bat to warm up. I'm not a student of anatomy or a qualified sports trainer but it seems like hitting 30 to 50 practice shots with a very heavy break cue each day could improve speed. Unfortunately, I can't help but wonder if it might screw things up as well. LOL
First, I think you need to spend a fair amount of time practicing your break. I purchased a BreakRak and it has helped a ton. If you're not going to invest significant time in practicing your break, all the advice on these threads is mostly useless. Regardless of where you break from, what speed you attempt to use and whether you apply English or not, you must be able to hit OB with the CB fairly precisely. Giving up any amount of precision in an effort to increase CB speed is a negative.
With all that said, after much practice and experimenting with different methods, I've found spotting the CB 2 diamonds up and 1 diamond out from the long rail yields the most consistent results for me in 9 ball. I try to hit the 1 ball dead square, no English with my cue tip right at middle CB. I use my normal stroke and if I'm successful in hitting square, this will squat the CB for me near right center of the table. I make a wing ball with reasonable consistency and most often get 3 or 4 balls near the other end of the table with a shot on the 1 ball available the majority of the time. Using the Break App on my iPhone, my break speed is consistently in the range of 17 to 18 mph.
Given my lack of CB speed, my 8 ball break sucks when trying to hit the head ball. I've resorted to the 2nd ball break pretty much exclusively. The bad and good news with this is that it generally leaves a tough table to run out. Since I'm usually playing the other team's best player in league, I'm fine with that. If for some reason I get matched up with a weaker player, I may fire at the head ball to try and get a better spread.
I'm doing some weight work and actually experimenting with practicing the break with a heavier cue to try and increase my break speed. I've wondered if the heavier cue will help. I also wondered if anyone makes a heavy "donut" similar to what baseball players put on their bat to warm up. I'm not a student of anatomy or a qualified sports trainer but it seems like hitting 30 to 50 practice shots with a very heavy break cue each day could improve speed. Unfortunately, I can't help but wonder if it might screw things up as well. LOL
This really depends on the rack... -This is the major variable. Where the gaps are determines whether the wing ball will go in naturally or not. If you have the right rack and hit the head ball at the right place the wing ball will go in--> the speed doesn't matter that much. If you hit it harder the balls will have more energy and have a better chance of finding a hole. (obviously)
The contact point on the head ball is more important than how hard you hit it if you are trying to make the wing ball. On a perfect rack the wing ball should be pretty much dead imo.
Dudley
On a good rack is the contact point off center a little or are you trying to hit the one square as you can?
In order to transfer the most power possible from the cueball to the one-ball, the one-ball must be struck SQUARELY in the face.
Now, if power is not your main objective.................
Maniac
If you're starting from outside the break box, you simply need to hit the one as square as you can. Right in the face. In this pic, I show three angles. All three make the wing ball easily on a perfect rack, if you hit the rack right in the face. You're not trying to hit the 1 at a single point... a wide range of points will get it done. There's tons of room for error.
Within the box, you usually do need to cut. you'd cut to hit any of these points shown. Watch the recent turning stone footage to see the cut break in action. Again this is ONLY necessary when you're forced to break from the box. If you're allowed to put the CB near the rail, then you should do so and just hit the rack square in the face.
Don't get caught up thinking it's some special speed or angle or english, it's not. I promise you, it's the rack. Before I got MBR I was sitting there saying "why can't I do this? I see it go on video like clockwork. But the wing ball keeps hitting high for me". Then I got the magic rack and the first time I tested, hit it ten times in a row. You just need a perfectly tight rack and you're gonna have a hard time getting one with a plastic or wood triangle.
The break
On a 9' table with the Magic Rack I usually put 1 or 2 balls in when breaking in 9 Ball. It is usually the wing ball and/or 1 in the side. My 8 Ball break with the Magic Rack is mediocre at best. I am having trouble figuring it out and have broke from all over the head string. My break speed was timed at around 18 mph. I have a very good break cue from pat Diveney, so it is me.
On a 9' table with the Magic Rack I usually put 1 or 2 balls in when breaking in 9 Ball. It is usually the wing ball and/or 1 in the side. My 8 Ball break with the Magic Rack is mediocre at best. I am having trouble figuring it out and have broke from all over the head string. My break speed was timed at around 18 mph. I have a very good break cue from pat Diveney, so it is me.
This thread has got me wondering what the average break speed for most people is.
I used to break at about 20mph until I started lifting weights every day. Now I break at about 25mph but it still seems slow to me.
Can you guys post about what speed you break at?
I used to break at about 20mph until I started lifting weights every day. Now I break at about 25mph but it still seems slow to me.
Can you guys post about what speed you break at?
Regardless of where I break from I try to hit the head ball as full as possible.
On a tight rack it's best from the side. On a looser rack it's best more towards the middle. (this only applies to 9 ball)
The fuller you hit the head ball the more action you get from the balls. You want the cue ball to jump as little as possible. It makes it seem like you hit it with less speed but the balls roll around the table more.
This is my opinion/experience... Others may disagree
Dudley
If you're starting from outside the break box, you simply need to hit the one as square as you can. Right in the face. In this pic, I show three angles. All three make the wing ball easily on a perfect rack, if you hit the rack right in the face. You're not trying to hit the 1 at a single point... a wide range of points will get it done. There's tons of room for error.
Within the box, you usually do need to cut. you'd cut to hit any of these points shown. Watch the recent turning stone footage to see the cut break in action. Again this is ONLY necessary when you're forced to break from the box. If you're allowed to put the CB near the rail, then you should do so and just hit the rack square in the face.
Don't get caught up thinking it's some special speed or angle or english, it's not. I promise you, it's the rack. Before I got MBR I was sitting there saying "why can't I do this? I see it go on video like clockwork. But the wing ball keeps hitting high for me". Then I got the magic rack and the first time I tested, hit it ten times in a row. You just need a perfectly tight rack and you're gonna have a hard time getting one with a plastic or wood triangle.
Thanks CreeDo.
I think I broke better Knowing less about the rack.:smile:
Ha. Knowing about the rack definitely helped me break 9b better, because I learned that how I hit 'em didn't really matter much when it came to making that wing ball.
But it has made my life harder playing 8b and 10b because I know what balls are 'supposed to' go in, but don't often make them.
For 9b, soft break is the nuts. I do maybe 11? 13? mph. You can go even lower.
For the other games, my hard break was 17.5 with a little control.
I got some lessons from Tony Marcino (Tony_in_MD on the forum) and now I can hit 20+, maybe 22-23 if everything's right.
We measured another forum member's break and it was also around 17.5, using a similar arm-only movement.
I'm impressed that working out can actually add a whole 5 mph to the break. That's something I need to look into. 25 mph is a very strong break, you should not feel like that's slow. A lot of guys will tell you shane's 10b break is the best in the world and that's around 24.
Of course the difference is... 24 is his controlled, safe speed for getting the cue ball to just squat there. Whereas 24 may be your "let-er-rip" speed.
But it has made my life harder playing 8b and 10b because I know what balls are 'supposed to' go in, but don't often make them.
zpele said:
For 9b, soft break is the nuts. I do maybe 11? 13? mph. You can go even lower.
For the other games, my hard break was 17.5 with a little control.
I got some lessons from Tony Marcino (Tony_in_MD on the forum) and now I can hit 20+, maybe 22-23 if everything's right.
We measured another forum member's break and it was also around 17.5, using a similar arm-only movement.
I'm impressed that working out can actually add a whole 5 mph to the break. That's something I need to look into. 25 mph is a very strong break, you should not feel like that's slow. A lot of guys will tell you shane's 10b break is the best in the world and that's around 24.
Of course the difference is... 24 is his controlled, safe speed for getting the cue ball to just squat there. Whereas 24 may be your "let-er-rip" speed.
If i break, then i also just break *arm-only* like Creedo described 
I m anyway not able to get such a super-highspeed break (healthy issues).
But my controlled breakspeed is maxium 18,5 to 19.5 mph.
For 8ball and 10ball i usually start from headspot
In 9ball from side-rail.
To hit the rack (the one ball) totally square right in the face it the optimum. Accouracy wins over Acceleration. To work with different speed on the break really need also lots of practice. You need a very consistant stroke for handling the speed on the break.
I m anyway not able to get such a super-highspeed break (healthy issues).
But my controlled breakspeed is maxium 18,5 to 19.5 mph.
For 8ball and 10ball i usually start from headspot
In 9ball from side-rail.
To hit the rack (the one ball) totally square right in the face it the optimum. Accouracy wins over Acceleration. To work with different speed on the break really need also lots of practice. You need a very consistant stroke for handling the speed on the break.
Yes I lift 25lbs weights several times a day to work out my forearms, shoulders, and biceps.
Sometimes I do some core exercises as well...
However... I do not break with my arm only... I tend to use my core to power through the ball and most of the time I'm airborne when the cueball hits the rack because I have trained my body to not worry about stopping its forward momentum so I just go into the air instead.
I'm also basing my 25mph regular break against APA singles nationals last year. They had a breakspeed where the winner had about a 31mph break.
I remember talking to the winner and his wasn't that strong looking but his forearms were rock hard.
It's because of this I have since concentrated on my forearms and I believe that since it is last in the chain of muscles you use before hitting the cueball it has the biggest impact.
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