A Subconscious Rattling Problem. Help?

ENGLISH!

ENGLISH!

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I know that there is probably no quick fix for this issue but I just thought I'd ask, just in case someone has an idea.

As some of you may know I have been playing for 46 years spinning the ball with english & cheating pockets for position.

Lately I have been playing on 9' Diamonds with 4" pockets, When I say 4 inches, I am being generous. They are more like 3 & 7/8 & I'm talking at the points.

Anyway when not cheating a pocket for a reason, I have always shaded shots to the side of the pocket that would accept a ball hitting the rail first with accepting spin. The other side is an automatic miss so I would shade to the slight mis acceptance side.

Well these pockets obviously will not accept that shot if it touches the rail.

So... my question is does anyone have an idea how to get rid of that subconscious shading the shot to that side?

I know these are just tough pockets. I've rolled balls down the rail 1/4" off the rail & the ball has hit well inside the point on the pocket facing & the ball will not go. Hell, I've even hit shots rolling on the rail & if they are hit too hard they don't always go.

I've tightened up my focus & fine tuned shots but every once in awhile I'll shoot what should be an easy shot & I will subconsciously shade it & ta da dump.

I really don't like having to shoot with so much conscious thought trying to over ride my subconscious but if I don't do it I'll hit that shade side too often.

Any ideas? Or do I just need to grind it out til my subconscious learns his lesson.

Best to All,
Rick
 
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Honestly, it really sounds like you're playing on a table with pockets that are just too darn tight.

Most pro's would have problems with 3 7/8" - 4" pockets. The cream of the crop would rise to the top after lots and lots of play on it, but any player less than that is just going to have problems.

If we lived in a perfect world, I'd standardize things by having amateurs play on 4 1/2" pockets, with pro's playing on 4 1/2".

My humble opinion.
 
ENGLISH! said:
I know that there is probably no quick fix for this issue but I just thought I'd ask, just in case someone has an idea.

As some of you may know I have been playing for 46 years spinning the ball with english & cheating pockets for position.

Lately I have been playing on 9' Diamonds with 4" pockets, When I say 4 inches, I am being generous. They are more like 3 & 7/8 & I'm talking at the points.

Anyway when not cheating a pocket for a reason, I have always shaded shots to the side of the pocket that would accept a ball hitting the rail first with accepting spin. The other side is an automatic miss so I would shade to the slight mis acceptance side.

Well these pockets obviously will not accept that shot if it touches the rail.

So... my question is does anyone have an idea how to get rid of that subconscious shading the shot to that side?

I know these are just tough pockets. I've rolled balls down the rail 1/4" off the rail & the ball has hit well inside the point on the pocket facing & the ball will not go. Hell, I've even hit shots rolling on the rail & if they are hit too hard they don't always go.

I've tightened up my focus & fine tuned shots but every once in awhile I'll shoot what should be an easy shot & I will subconsciously shade it & ta da dump.

I really don't like having to shoot with so much conscious thought trying to over ride my subconscious but if I don't do it I'll hit that shade side too often.

Any ideas? Or do I just need to grind it out til my subconscious learns his lesson.

Best to All,
Rick
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If you aim a little left or right is that subconscious or actually conscious effort ?
 
Why not play more angle where you don't have to cheat the pocket? I have heard you claim you cheat the pockets hundreds of times and have always wondered why you are always straight in? I have also heard you claim to cheat 4" pockets on a straight in, where the cue ball is in one pocket and the ob is in the middle of the table? I would love to see this on tape and called before the shot. You seem like a nice guy, but I have to call bs on this one.
 
backplaying said:
Why not play more angle where you don't have to cheat the pocket? I'm not sure I understand what you mean here. By 'cheating' a pocket for postition, I am not talking about hitting a rail first & still pocketing the ball. Although on some shots & with some pockets I do do that too. But generally what I mean is shooting a ball into one side or the other to get the cue ball to come off the OB at a different angle. This can be done from any angles. I have heard you claim you cheat the pockets hundreds of times and have always wondered why you are always straight in? I did not realize that I have said it that much & I am certainly not always straight in nor do I always want to be straight in. As I said targeting one side of a pocket can be done from many if not all angle. I have also heard you claim to cheat 4" pockets on a straight in, where the cue ball is in one pocket and the ob is in the middle of the table? Yes, I've done that when that was what was called for. I don't believe that I said that I was 100% successful at that but if that is what the shot calls for I will certainly attempt it. What good is it to simply pocket the ball in the middle & then have very poor position or worse, no shot at all. Doing it has gotten considerably easier since CJ introduced TOI, as that is another option.I would love to see this on tape and called before the shot. You seem like a nice guy, but I have to call bs on this one.
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I think there may be some misunderstandings here somewhere. I'm going to go back through your post and either ask a question or try to clarify.

Okay after doing that (& I apologize for doing it that way but I have a bit of a trying day) it seems that you have an ax to grind with me for some reason.

What is it?
 
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Play on a different table. Pockets like that change how the game is played and take away from it in my opinion. I use pocket reducers that take my pockets down to 3.25", but I only use them for drills or occasional practice games to increase focus and emphasize correct stroke. I think actual game play should be done on pockets that allow the aspect of cheating the pocket, and shooting elsewhere besides the dead center of the pocket for various reasons.
 
mantis99 said:
Play on a different table. Pockets like that change how the game is played and take away from it in my opinion. I use pocket reducers that take my pockets down to 3.25", but I only use them for drills or occasional practice games to increase focus and emphasize correct stroke. I think actual game play should be done on pockets that allow the aspect of cheating the pocket, and shooting elsewhere besides the dead center of the pocket for various reasons.
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I agree with you & I have always shot with english into one side of the pocket or the other. Now I'm giving TOI a good go.

Yesterday, I was playing a guy some friendly 9 ball & I got too straight in on the 6 near the foot rail. I tried to cheat it with follow to go two rails. the cue ball when very well but the ball rattled & stayed out. The shot was only about 3 feet long.

Thanks for the input & Best Wishes,
Rick
 
That table would be for drills only as far as I am concerned... Playing pool is not playing snooker and you have to be able to cheat the pockets to move the ball effectively....

You will adjust if u play on it long enough but what you gain in precision you may end up losing in proper shot selection and position play....

I played for year every night on a snooker table using regulation balls after I closed the pool room.. It really didn't help my overall game but it would keep me focused on preshot and stroke delivery... If I was in stroke I wouldn't even think about getting on the blasted thing because in those instances it did more harm than good...

Chris
 
ENGLISH! said:
Okay after doing that (& I apologize for doing it that way but I have a bit of a trying day) it seems that you have an ax to grind with me for some reason.

What is it?
Click to expand...

Maybe he's an instructor ;)???

Maniac (hope it's okay to poke a little fun at ya!!!)
 
A lot of people play the ball too thick trying to make it down the rail because they are subconsciously aiming at the back of the pocket, which is wrong.

Try aiming at the mouth of the pocket instead.
 
I'm a big fan of very tight pockets when I'm playing, always played on tight pockets. Then when I got a table with 4.5" pockets, which I've since reduced but it threw me off when going back to pockets that were tight, kinda like you're going through Rick.

Mostly affected me due to me getting used to being able to cheat the pocket by some margin, then going back I couldn't cheat it as much.

I came around the problem by just accepting what the pocket would allow. Didn't try to do too much and give the balls chance to rattle. My aim didn't change; if I wanted to hit the OB into the extreme right of the pocket and missed, I wouldve missed on 6" pockets too. That happens, I simply didn't get the OB to go where I wanted and that's going to cause a miss regardless when trying to cheat a pocket.

My advice would be really concentrate on position. Leave enough angle so you don't have to force anything. Sometimes you have to force an angle and on a tight table you have to understand what you can actually force out of the table. If it means leaving a tougher shot on the next ball then so be it, its 1 more shot you get than if you were sitting in your seat.
 
The Renfro said:
That table would be for drills only as far as I am concerned... Playing pool is not playing snooker and you have to be able to cheat the pockets to move the ball effectively....

You will adjust if u play on it long enough but what you gain in precision you may end up losing in proper shot selection and position play....

I played for year every night on a snooker table using regulation balls after I closed the pool room.. It really didn't help my overall game but it would keep me focused on preshot and stroke delivery... If I was in stroke I wouldn't even think about getting on the blasted thing because in those instances it did more harm than good...

Chris
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Thanks Chris. You may be right. It's almost like a different game.

Best to Y'a,
Rick
 
When you're done on a shot, it sounds like you're thinking. You gotta disconnect your mind and go brain dead until after the shot.

Also, it seems pool is 50-50 with what to look at last. I find when I look at the cueball last, I don't steer the cue because I'm just aiming at the cueball.
 
Pidge said:
I'm a big fan of very tight pockets when I'm playing, always played on tight pockets. Then when I got a table with 4.5" pockets, which I've since reduced but it threw me off when going back to pockets that were tight, kinda like you're going through Rick.

Mostly affected me due to me getting used to being able to cheat the pocket by some margin, then going back I couldn't cheat it as much.

I came around the problem by just accepting what the pocket would allow. Didn't try to do too much and give the balls chance to rattle. My aim didn't change; if I wanted to hit the OB into the extreme right of the pocket and missed, I wouldve missed on 6" pockets too. That happens, I simply didn't get the OB to go where I wanted and that's going to cause a miss regardless when trying to cheat a pocket.

My advice would be really concentrate on position. Leave enough angle so you don't have to force anything. Sometimes you have to force an angle and on a tight table you have to understand what you can actually force out of the table. If it means leaving a tougher shot on the next ball then so be it, its 1 more shot you get than if you were sitting in your seat.
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Thanks Pidge.

I understand about only going for what I can force from the table I have been doing that & taking what I can get.

But the problem that I'm having is on some relatively easy shots with easy simple built in position that subconscious shade it to that side comes out & I rattle it. I'm counting it down & then see it rattle & it's like 'you fool, why did you do that'.

I might have just figured it out, I don't know if I can fix it but I think I figured it out.

It's the natural position that I see based on the shaded shot that would normally go. I'm shooting the shape for the shaded shot. I need to see the shape from the center pocket shot.

Thanks for bullying me into figuring it out.:wink:

Best to Y'a
 
ENGLISH! said:
I really don't like having to shoot with so much conscious thought trying to over ride my subconscious but if I don't do it I'll hit that shade side too often.

Any ideas? Or do I just need to grind it out til my subconscious learns his lesson.

Best to All,
Rick
Click to expand...
Have you tried unconscious?
Hey, works for me.
willy_nilly.gif
 
naji said:
If you aim a little left or right is that subconscious or actually conscious effort ?
Click to expand...

Hi Mr. Naji.

I'm talking about rather easy shots that I don't mis.

I'm not consciously aiming for that side of the pocket but it's going to the higher percentage side that would drop on many tables but not on this one.

I think I figured it out. I think I figured out what my subconscious is doing. I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing, but I'd bet it's dangerous.:wink:

Best Wishes,
Rick
 
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