A tip for grip?

M

mohrt

Student of the Game
Silver Member
I use a triangle tip. Usually I can draw the ball pretty well keeping the wrist loose and aiming low on the ball. There are times however, when I'll skip the CB off the table, because the tip didn't grip. This could be from the tip not shaped perfect, not enough chalk, stroke error, or limits of the tip. That said, would some other tip help grip a little better for those times when I'm shooting on the very edge of the tip, without adversely affecting the rest of my play? I've heard good things about Kamui tips, but have not tried them.
 
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Mohrt...it's not the tip, as it will shape itself just from playing. Most likely a stroke error from either gripping too tightly or a poor transition from the back swing to the forward stroke. Use a light grip and a smooth backswing.

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
 
Hi mohrt,

as Scott has already shown up: in almost every case it s not the *tip s fault*-

but what s definitley a fact is, that a softer or very soft tip is a bit more *forgiving*.
There are many good tips on the market-
From Kamui i recommend the original (brown ones) Kamui SS and MS. Same here for the black ones-but the black are a tiny bit harder than the brown ones.
G2 Medium and Soft are fantastic- for me personally best tip on market right now.
A good friend is selling them here in germany/europe and i can assure you, that almost everyone who played with other *brands* changed to G2 after testing this tip. Price is about the same like Kamui.

But again: If your stroke and mechanicals are ok, you can do everything with a LePro or Triangle like you can do with any other layered tip. The advantage (for me) is more about the lesser necessity to work nonstop on your tip. Once properly installed and shaped you will have not to work on your tip bc of mushrooming. thats imo the biggest advantage of a good layered tip. Furthermore the good layered tips stay more elastic (construction is the cause imo).

lg
Ingo
 
mohrt said:
I use a triangle tip. Usually I can draw the ball pretty well keeping the wrist loose and aiming low on the ball. There are times however, when I'll skip the CB off the table, because the tip didn't grip. This could be from the tip not shaped perfect, not enough chalk, stroke error, or limits of the tip. That said, would some other tip help grip a little better for those times when I'm shooting on the very edge of the tip, without adversely affecting the rest of my play? I've heard good things about Kamui tips, but have not tried them.
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I have had my share of miscues with Triangle tips as well. I have found that there is less forgiveness with hard tips, and triangle tips tend to be hard. I have also found that they also need to be scuffed more often, as they will smooth out faster and won't hold chalk as well as softer tips. However, some players really do well with that type of tip, so it's an individual thing.

You might want to consider trying one of the long-lasting chalks, like Kamaui chalk. But, as you know, it's expensive.

The other option is to go with a softer tip which is more forgiving. I now use Kamaui black soft. It doesn't feel 'soft' to me --- and I find that it reacts better for me --- and no more miscues.
 
Scott Lee said:
Mohrt...it's not the tip, as it will shape itself just from playing.
Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
Click to expand...

If only someone would measure the tips of the monster spin artists it could end the threads "What Radius Nickel or Dime" It might also prove to some they aren't getting to the edges if their tip isn't close to those measurements.

Maybe it should be a #22 Button.:D

1button_chart.jpg
 
3kushn said:
If only someone would measure the tips of the monster spin artists it could end the threads "What Radius Nickel or Dime" It might also prove to some they aren't getting to the edges if their tip isn't close to those measurements.

Maybe it should be a #22 Button.:D

View attachment 317035
Click to expand...

I don't understand. What's your point?
 
Ratta said:
Hi mohrt,

as Scott has already shown up: in almost every case it s not the *tip s fault*-

but what s definitley a fact is, that a softer or very soft tip is a bit more *forgiving*.
There are many good tips on the market-
From Kamui i recommend the original (brown ones) Kamui SS and MS. Same here for the black ones-but the black are a tiny bit harder than the brown ones.
G2 Medium and Soft are fantastic- for me personally best tip on market right now.
A good friend is selling them here in germany/europe and i can assure you, that almost everyone who played with other *brands* changed to G2 after testing this tip. Price is about the same like Kamui.

But again: If your stroke and mechanicals are ok, you can do everything with a LePro or Triangle like you can do with any other layered tip. The advantage (for me) is more about the lesser necessity to work nonstop on your tip. Once properly installed and shaped you will have not to work on your tip bc of mushrooming. thats imo the biggest advantage of a good layered tip. Furthermore the good layered tips stay more elastic (construction is the cause imo).

lg
Ingo
Click to expand...

I have a very hard LePro tip on mine. I never do anything to it. Doesn't mushroom, or get flat. Shapes itself as I use it. Wears down evenly. But, being a hard tip, I have to chalk after everyshot. If I don't, I risk a miscue because it doesn't hold chalk very well.
 
FranCrimi said:
I don't understand. What's your point?
Click to expand...

First of all I rudely high jacked this thread. My comment had very little to do with the OP question.

The correct answer for the OP was given by you, Scott and Ratta. Probably others to follow.

I was commenting on Scott's that point is the tip will shape itself according to your style of play. The radius question/answer is always a choice of 2, nickel or dime.

Why couldn't it be something else? Has someone determined there are only two shapes that are correct and only one of those is correct for a given style or desired result? Bob Jewett says there's advantages and disadvantages to both. Could there be a compromise radius that minimizes the disadvantages in the two? Who knows.

If its true that the tip changes shape to comply with the player's style then it seems to reason that the tip radius of a cue played by a pro would be a more correct answer, assuming the tip isn't constantly groomed. It also seems that the radius of a lesser player (who struggles with spinning the ball) could be measured and it would be proof positive that heck I'm just not contacting the CB in areas that can produce massive spin. I can go farther out from center than I thought. In my own experience I was shocked when Mark Wilson showed me how high I could go. Or should I say, how it looks when trying to apply max follow. It definitely LOOKS to be in the miscue zone.

Certainly this is all somewhat hogwash with all the variables and no proof of anything, but its my birthday, so just stirring up the wash.
 
3kushn said:
First of all I rudely high jacked this thread. My comment had very little to do with the OP question.

The correct answer for the OP was given by you, Scott and Ratta. Probably others to follow.

I was commenting on Scott's that point is the tip will shape itself according to your style of play. The radius question/answer is always a choice of 2, nickel or dime.

Why couldn't it be something else? Has someone determined there are only two shapes that are correct and only one of those is correct for a given style or desired result? Bob Jewett says there's advantages and disadvantages to both. Could there be a compromise radius that minimizes the disadvantages in the two? Who knows.

If its true that the tip changes shape to comply with the player's style then it seems to reason that the tip radius of a cue played by a pro would be a more correct answer, assuming the tip isn't constantly groomed. It also seems that the radius of a lesser player (who struggles with spinning the ball) could be measured and it would be proof positive that heck I'm just not contacting the CB in areas that can produce massive spin. I can go farther out from center than I thought. In my own experience I was shocked when Mark Wilson showed me how high I could go. Or should I say, how it looks when trying to apply max follow. It definitely LOOKS to be in the miscue zone.

Certainly this is all somewhat hogwash with all the variables and no proof of anything, but its my birthday, so just stirring up the wash.
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Well first of all, and most importantly..HAPPY BIRTHDAY!!

OK I see what you mean now. Well, my tip never shaped itself. I've always had to shape it. I can tell right away without looking at it when it needs shaping --- my backspin shots start to fade, and sure enough, when I check the tip, it's flat.

I could never relate to anyone who says they never have to shape their tip. That's never been the case for me.
 
The limp wrist isn't for everyone

mohrt said:
I use a triangle tip. Usually I can draw the ball pretty well keeping the wrist loose and aiming low on the ball. There are times however, when I'll skip the CB off the table, because the tip didn't grip. This could be from the tip not shaped perfect, not enough chalk, stroke error, or limits of the tip. That said, would some other tip help grip a little better for those times when I'm shooting on the very edge of the tip, without adversely affecting the rest of my play? I've heard good things about Kamui tips, but have not tried them.
Click to expand...

The tip must be controlled or you'll continue to experience problems.

The limp wrist isn't for everyone, that's for sure. If someone every develops a "pool playing android" I seriously doubt if their grip will be loose....it will be "part of the cue" (firmly controlled, but not tight).

Milk Dud Tips is what I'm favoring now. Jim Odom in Ft. Worth has really good "Milk Dud Tips" (they are soaked in milk and put in a vise during preparation)....I just changed all my shafts over to the Jim Odom Tips and they couldn't be better for the price.
 
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CJ Wiley said:
The tip must be controlled or you'll continue to experience problems.

The limp wrist isn't for everyone, that's for sure. If someone every develops a "pool playing android" I seriously doubt if their grip will be loose....it will be "part of the cue" (firmly controlled, but not tight).

Milk Dud Tips is what I'm favoring now. Jim Odom in Ft. Worth has really good "Milk Dud Tips" (they are soaked in milk and put in a vise during preparation)....I just changed all my shafts over to the Jim Odom Tips and they couldn't be better for the price.
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Boy, that brings back memories. Years ago, Champion tips were the cream of the crop and we used to soak them first in milk for a couple of days, and then put them in a vice for a couple of days to minimize mushrooming. Took about a week to change a tip, but they played great.
 
FranCrimi said:
Well first of all, and most importantly..HAPPY BIRTHDAY!!

OK I see what you mean now. Well, my tip never shaped itself. I've always had to shape it. I can tell right away without looking at it when it needs shaping --- my backspin shots start to fade, and sure enough, when I check the tip, it's flat.

I could never relate to anyone who says they never have to shape their tip. That's never been the case for me.
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Fran, I imagine it has to do with how hard the tip is to start with, and how one goes about chalking. I tend to start at the top, barely touching it, and then more pressure is applied as I go down to the edge of tip. That alone will wear down the sides faster than the tip. My chalk tends to stay fairly flat on top, not getting a hole in it.

If one uses a cube of chalk with a hole in it, or applies more pressure to the top of the tip, it will wear down faster than the sides. The chalk is mainly what is wearing down the tip.

Nothing wrong with chalking either way, they just tend to produce different results on the tip over time.
 
I know my tip is need of replacement, but will this cause any sort of miscue problems at this thinness?

ZrGdp47l.jpg
 
mohrt said:
I know my tip is need of replacement, but will this cause any sort of miscue problems at this thinness?

ZrGdp47l.jpg
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Yep. Possibly. That tip looks right at the borderline of needing changing. Tips compress and continue to get harder as they wear down. That tip is probably as hard as a rock.You can feel if it is or isn't. Stick your fingernail in it and see if it leaves an imprint and if you feel a little sponginess. I'd say probably not. If it's got nothing left, you should change it.
 
Neil said:
Fran, I imagine it has to do with how hard the tip is to start with, and how one goes about chalking. I tend to start at the top, barely touching it, and then more pressure is applied as I go down to the edge of tip. That alone will wear down the sides faster than the tip. My chalk tends to stay fairly flat on top, not getting a hole in it.

If one uses a cube of chalk with a hole in it, or applies more pressure to the top of the tip, it will wear down faster than the sides. The chalk is mainly what is wearing down the tip.

Nothing wrong with chalking either way, they just tend to produce different results on the tip over time.
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This is the first time I've heard of the act of chalking wearing down and shaping a tip. This is a theory, right?
 
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FranCrimi said:
This is the first time I've heard of the act of chalking wearing down and shaping a tip. This is a theory, right?
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Fran, It's not "my" idea to start with. But, think about it, ....just what do you think wears the tip down? The chalk does. When does the tip recieve the most abuse from the chalk? During the repetitive motion of chalking, not from one swipe against the cb.
 
mohrt said:
I know my tip is need of replacement, but will this cause any sort of miscue problems at this thinness?

ZrGdp47l.jpg
Click to expand...

Not if it's chalked properly. As Fran stated, it will be harder then when it was newer. But, that will only cause you to miscue if it isn't chalked properly. My tips are hard as a rock when they are new. Looking at that tip, for me, there is plenty of tip left on it. When the curvature gets real close to the ferrule, then you should change it.

There's some people out there playing at a very high level that would say your cue has too much tip on it. Some like it almost down to the ferrule.
 
Neil said:
Fran, It's not "my" idea to start with. But, think about it, ....just what do you think wears the tip down? The chalk does. When does the tip recieve the most abuse from the chalk? During the repetitive motion of chalking, not from one swipe against the cb.
Click to expand...

Well who's idea is it?
 
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