My dilema for this weekend!

L

liakos

Banned
So a few days ago I was at the local bowling alley where they got a few 9ft gold crowns! This is where I started playing pool 8yrs ago! Anyway, I'm shooting with some friends and after a bit, a new guy comes in hitting a few! One of my friends says hi to him and they shake hands and introduces me. Me being the better player than my friends, they,say to me play him for a bit, he plays your speed! I said sure!

So we start playing, no gambling, just shooting around! I think we were both trying to gauge each others ability. So we played for a couple hrs and it was enjoyable! It feels good to know if you miss a ball the other guy is gonna run out and run the next game on you! And that's how it went, I would miss a ball, he would run out and break and run a rack. He would miss, I would do the same back. Again, very enjoyable:)

So the dilemma!!! After we done shooting around, we started talking and obviously he plays well, I could tell he wasn't playing his full speed. So, we start talking about players we know and it turns out we know a lot of the same players and through all this play and then talking, I really have to say he seems like a cool person!

And then he drops the bomb! He tells me about he's heading out to Connecticut this weekend for this "league thing". I says really?!?! I asked him is the APA states? He said yeah, I said oh cool, I'm heading up there too! So who do you play for? He tells me and I said to him well, maybe we will have to play each other?!?! Yeah ya never he says!

So I ask him a real dumb question, or at least I thought it was a dumb question, what's your skill level? (Now, mind you, I am a 7, and I hate hate hate sandbaggers) he says with a smile "I'm not that good, I'm only a 4!" At that point inside I lost it! This guy can play some awesome pool, and he's a 4! So I told him listen, whatever happens this Sunday, I'm letting you know right now, if our teams play, the moment you get put up, I'm gonna start a major $hit storm with the LO! I told him he's the reason why I truly hate the APA! I can't stand sandbaggers!

For those of you are gonna ask, if I hate APA, why am I in it? My food friend begged me to get on his team! So its only a favor.

Anyway, I told my friend the story, and I told him I think the best way to about it is probably wait to see if we have to play, and if they put him up, we should immediately forfeit! Tell the LO and see what he will do about it! But most likely he won't do anything because he seems to promote sandbagging! He manages to knock down some players handicapps, and then raise others! It's weird!

Any advice on this matter would be appreciated! And don't worry, no more APA for me! It's a joke league with a lot of joke players with a joke LO!

Thanks in advance!
 
All Handicap Leagues when money is involved....

I don't know why you are worried about someone else's handicap.
You should already know how it all works.

This is how it is in all handicap leagues.

Some people play for fun, and some people are in it for the money.


APA, TAP, and other leagues are money leagues. For some people it's all about the money and fun getting over. I'd say 90% of all the teams that end up with the money are teams with players that are under handicapped.

This is the way it is and it will always be like that.

League Operators are well aware how it all works.:wink:
 
I totally agree with you! But its one thing to be a level lower(even 2) than your true handicap,but this guy could run circles around me! And I'm a B+ A- player! But like I said, this is the reason why I hate APA! It truly does suck! The players sandbag, the LO's know about it! It's no fun!
 
Anyone who plays a handicapped league should know how they work. Either accept it or don't play. Sounds to me like you should do the latter.

Good luck either way.....
 
liakos said:
I totally agree with you! But its one thing to be a level lower(even 2) than your true handicap,but this guy could run circles around me! And I'm a B+ A- player! But like I said, this is the reason why I hate APA! It truly does suck! The players sandbag, the LO's know about it! It's no fun!
Click to expand...

To be perfectly honest...I've seen some people who really play good when practicing with no pressure. But when it comes time to make the balls and win they just fold up like an old wet rag.

There are people out there that will play like God for a dollar a game but get scared to death for $10 per game.


I like handicap leagues. I've never been on a team to win a trip or win the big money, but it's been great competition. I've been on some good teams where we had a chance and the difference was only one game or one shot.

It's just tough to get all your numbers right to play and win.

When everyone is playing good the handicaps don't mean a lot. You just need to win every game.
 
Awww, such a sad story. And here I thought you guys were going to end up sharing a tent together on a mountain.
 
All handicap leagues?

poolguy4u said:
I don't know why you are worried about someone else's handicap.
You should already know how it all works.

This is how it is in all handicap leagues.

Some people play for fun, and some people are in it for the money.


APA, TAP, and other leagues are money leagues. For some people it's all about the money and fun getting over. I'd say 90% of all the teams that end up with the money are teams with players that are under handicapped.

This is the way it is and it will always be like that.

League Operators are well aware how it all works.:wink:
Click to expand...

By your statement, can I assume that you've played in all or at least many of the national league organizations?

If you haven't how can you say, "That's how it is in all handicap leagues."

Having played more than 70 seasons in almost a dozen different league systems since 1966, I cannot lump them all together as you do. Some systems work better than others.
 
I played leagues for 10-15 years then quit. Now I play in a local non-handicapped league. Lots of fun.

I learned that when you play in the usual national leagues (APA, TAP etc) you have to learn to accept sandbagging. It is part of the league system and there are many (50% ??) of the players who like the whole idea of sandbagging for themselves, for the team, or both. Because it is so pervasive you either join the club or get out. I chose to get out but I have several friends who still play in the leagues and who love the complications of sandbagging.

Team play in the leagues is not the same as playing pool. Figure out the differences and then decide what you are looking for. Your expectations change over time.
 
Accept the fact that if you want to be successful in handicapped leagues, you must master two disciplines: pool and sandbagging (aka "managing the handicap" in more polite terms).

Players who complain about sandbagging are simply too lazy to put out the effort and thought that it takes to master sandbagging.
 
Wow...just wow! Sandbagging is PART of the league "system"? It is truly amazing how ignorant people are. Sandbagging only works when both teams allow it to happen. There are failsafes in all handicapped league play that account for "perceived" or "real" sandbagging. Usually it is within the scorekeeping. To say that sandbagging is built into the league system is such nonsense as to not even be addressed. This is why I, and others who REALLY know the score (like APA League Operator and a few others), stay away from these BS threads. :rolleyes:

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
 
I would never use the word sandbagging in a handicap league. I would call it a strategy.

It is no different than-----when I used to gamble a long time ago. I might shoot my top speed for awhile, but after we raise the bet I would go into overdrive and shoot better.

Just an old habit. I'd win by one ball or make it look like I got lucky. Sometimes I lost and didn't get lucky. It was just part of the game.

Leagues are the same way. You shoot during the week to have fun and try and win...but you're not out for blood. When it's time to win a trip or money, you go into overdrive and take the fun out of it. It suddenly gets serious.

It's not easy to keep your handicap down without being called a cheater or sandbagger.
There is a slim line between being a 4 and 5. Some people call it---being on the bubble.

I just like to have fun...but it's more fun to win while you are doing it.:smile:
 
poolguy4u said:
To be perfectly honest...I've seen some people who really play good when practicing with no pressure. But when it comes time to make the balls and win they just fold up like an old wet rag.

There are people out there that will play like God for a dollar a game but get scared to death for $10 per game.


I like handicap leagues. I've never been on a team to win a trip or win the big money, but it's been great competition. I've been on some good teams where we had a chance and the difference was only one game or one shot.

It's just tough to get all your numbers right to play and win.

When everyone is playing good the handicaps don't mean a lot. You just need to win every game.
Click to expand...

Yeah, there's this guy I know who plays really solid 9ball in league. When he's in gear, he's easily B-speed and you can just tell, he's only looking up. But when he joined my APA team, had to play barbox 8ball, it was a total shock. He couldn't beat 3s even-up. He had no strategy. He couldn't deal with the bar atmosphere. It was as though a small, uncoordinated child had possessed his arm every time we put him in to play. He wasn't sandbagging and quit APA halfway through the season. Although he currently is struggling on 9footers now, it's still worlds better than those matches he played in 8ball. People are just funny sometimes. You shouldn't rush to judgement. Sometimes, you're just looking at a strange mental block. Not everyone waltzes into the APA with an attitude that says, "I play serious pool and I'm going to make mince-meat of this league." Some have to relearn everything.
 
If you do forfeit, do it after you break the first rack otherwise he'll still eligible to play in another match, and if you're really gung-ho about this, if he plays and you all lose the team match don't sign the score sheet and write up a protest statement and pay your protest fee.
On the other hand it's one match and one player and I'll bet every team in the event has at least one player that other team suspect is rated below their real speed. So ask yourself if he's really sandbagging or has just fallen through the cracks. If you really think he's cheating call it to the officials attention before the match starts. At any rate I think it's really unlikely that your complaint or protest will change anything but all they can is say 'no'. If he scares you guys that much, maybe think twice about playing. Hate to ruin a perfectly good weekend with one bad match, you know...
 
Exact same thing happens to everyone, in handicapped tournaments also, players of known ability allowed to play lower than they are.

I just don't play in any handicapped tournaments where I know that is going on once I see it.

Someone made a point about playing in different rooms and equipment. I recently started playing in a regular league that plays in different rooms instead of my Masters league that is all on 9 footers. I have a very low winning % in the regular league for some reason even though I'm in the top few people there. I think I have the highest ranking or close to it, yet I only won maybe 1 or 2 matches out of a dozen or more I played.

I guess this is actually the opposite of the OP, I have a high ranking but a low win rate LOL, I must be a really bad sandbagger.
 
I guess this is actually the opposite of the OP, I have a high ranking but a low win rate LOL, I must be a really bad sandbagger.[/QUOTE]

Yes you are sir, yes you are;) hope all is well with you sir!
 
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