Contact Point v Contact Patch

D

duckie

GregH
Silver Member
In ghostball, there are two ways to use it, contact point, contact patch. Contact patch is the area of the OB and CB the comes in contact with the table.

Contact point is the spot on the OB ball that the CB needs to contact to make the OB and CB go where you want. Once the placement for the OB or CB is determined, this establishes the contact point on the OB. There is only one contact point no matter what the OB/CB angle is.

The contact point on the CB moves around the equator of the CB as the OB/CB angle changes. As the angle increases, the CB CP moves farther away the center of the CB.

Contact patch is that spot on the table that makes the OB and CB go where you want. It is a extension of the line to the pocket the OB contact point is on. This point never changes is the OB/CB angle increases.

The couple of advantage of contact patch that all shots become straight in shots and you are look straight ahead.

With contact point, the only time the contact points on the OB and CB are on the same line is a straight in shot. You are looking straight to where the CB needs to be/ Meaning you are looking down the CB direction of travel line.

As the angle increases, the CB contact point is now being offset, meaning now the two points are offset from the CB direction of travel. Meaning if you are looking at the OB contact point, you are no longer looking down the CB direction of travel line.

The OB also has a direction of travel line, but does not start at the OB contact patch, but at the point on the table that makes the CB/OB go where you want. The OB contact patch is the pivot point for the OB direction of travel line.

With contact patch, you are always looking down the CB direction of travel line to where the CB needs to be....the OB direction of travel start point.

As the OB/CB angle increases, unlike CB contact point that moves as the OB/CB angle changes. the CB contact patch does not. This is why all shots are straight. You are looking straight to a spot to place the CB in order to make to CB/OB go where you want.

You are not trying to have two contact points that are offset to the CB direction of travel align before you execute a shot.

Notice I mentioned the where the CB needs to be in order to make the B/OB go where you want.

For some reason, there are those that believe those that use ghostball try to "see" a ghostball. When I read this, I wonder if pitchers try to see a ghostball or see where they want to place the ball and then do so. Same with bowlers.

This idea that ghost ball is about seeing ghostball is just showing how little those in the know really know.

My idea is not new. It is a extension of Babe Cranfields idea about the spot on the table. I was working on this concept when I got his Straight Pool Bible and read about the spot on the table and the Arrow. This is how I knew I was on the right path. When I come up with the same concept as one of the Greats, well, I'm sticking to it.

Consistent shot making is about being able to consistently see what you want to do and then do it. This consistency is timed based. Meaning the more time, quality time that is, put in, the sooner the consistency is.

Pros don't really know more, they are just more consistent that's all.
 
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duckie said:
For some reason, there are those that believe those that use ghostball try to "see" a ghostball. When I read this, I wonder if pitchers try to see a ghostball or see where they want to place the ball and then do so. Same with bowlers.


.
Click to expand...

Pitchers throw to the glove and bowlers have aim points on the lanes. There's no ghost's in baseball.
 
Below is a example of a rail first shot going for the 8 in the corner. This is also a example of indirect aiming.

If there was no blocking ball, either contact point or contact patch is usable, but when there is blocking ball, the use of contact point becomes complicated since there will be different CB contact points used for a unblocked shot and blocked shot.

Whereas there is always only one spot on the table to place the CB to make the OB go where you want regardless if the shot is blocked or not. Roll the CB contact patch over that spot and the OB will go where you want.

Basically, contact the dots......which are the CB/OB contact patches on the table.

In this shot, the contact points for blocked and unblocked maybe the same because of the angle off the rail to the 8 ball. But this is not always the case.
 
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Quote from duckie - The pros don't really know more, they are just more consistant that's all.

duckie.. You should write a book. Fold up the contact patch, wipe the contact point, and flush.
.
 
duckie said:
Below is a example of a rail first shot going for the 8 in the corner. This is also a example of indirect aiming.

If there was no blocking ball, either contact point or contact patch is usable, but when there is blocking ball, the use of contact point becomes complicated since there will be different CB contact points used for a unblocked shot and blocked shot.

Whereas there is always only one spot on the table to place the CB to make the OB go where you want regardless if the shot is blocked or not. Roll the CB contact patch over that spot and the OB will go where you want.

Basically, contact the dots......which are the CB/OB contact patches on the table.

In this shot, the contact points for blocked and unblocked maybe the same because of the angle off the rail to the 8 ball. But this is not always the case.
Click to expand...

Lets see a video of you making this all the while explaining exactly where the patch and point is.
 
Banks said:
No more than pool players shoot for the hole instead of aim. Same thing that artists do with canvas. They see, in their mind's eye, where things should be.
Click to expand...

If you just shoot for the hole then you must scratch a lot. Me, I aim at the OB with the intention of putting it in the hole. This is an aiming forum by the way, if you don't think you have to aim, why are you here.
 
Banks said:
No more than pool players shoot for the hole instead of aim. Same thing that artists do with canvas. They see, in their mind's eye, where things should be.
Click to expand...

Baseball players, the really good ones, are only successful 3 out of 10 times, I think I'll stick with PRO-ONE.
 
cookie man said:
If you just shoot for the hole then you must scratch a lot. Me, I aim at the OB with the intention of putting it in the hole. This is an aiming forum by the way, if you don't think you have to aim, why are you here.
Click to expand...

You said that batters don't aim. What are they swinging at?

I never said you don't have to aim. I said that you don't have to have an actual object to aim at. Ghost ball works just fine.

Besides, most don't "aim for the fences".

cookie man said:
Baseball players, the really good ones, are only successful 3 out of 10 times, I think I'll stick with PRO-ONE.
Click to expand...

I guess we're both better than baseball players. Perhaps Barton should take up baseball.
 
By your own logic in other posts, a ball has no edge. If a ball has no edge, how can it have an equator or contact patch? Please point them out. Thanks.
 
duckie said:
Below is a example of a rail first shot going for the 8 in the corner. This is also a example of indirect aiming.

If there was no blocking ball, either contact point or contact patch is usable, but when there is blocking ball, the use of contact point becomes complicated since there will be different CB contact points used for a unblocked shot and blocked shot.

Whereas there is always only one spot on the table to place the CB to make the OB go where you want regardless if the shot is blocked or not. Roll the CB contact patch over that spot and the OB will go where you want.

Basically, contact the dots......which are the CB/OB contact patches on the table.

In this shot, the contact points for blocked and unblocked maybe the same because of the angle off the rail to the 8 ball. But this is not always the case.
Click to expand...

I must be slow. Can you give a more definitive example of the contact "patch"?
 
duckie said:
Below is a example of a rail first shot going for the 8 in the corner. This is also a example of indirect aiming.

If there was no blocking ball, either contact point or contact patch is usable, but when there is blocking ball, the use of contact point becomes complicated since there will be different CB contact points used for a unblocked shot and blocked shot.

Whereas there is always only one spot on the table to place the CB to make the OB go where you want regardless if the shot is blocked or not. Roll the CB contact patch over that spot and the OB will go where you want.

Basically, contact the dots......which are the CB/OB contact patches on the table.

In this shot, the contact points for blocked and unblocked maybe the same because of the angle off the rail to the 8 ball. But this is not always the case.
Click to expand...
to me the contact point to make the ball HAS to be the same to make the ball regardless of how the cue ball got there
could you give an example when the contact point on the object ball would not be the same??
 
bbb/Larry,

Given the margin for error that the pocket allows there is more than ONE contact point for any shot. I don't know but perhaps that array of points or the array of points that the Ghost ball would sit might be referred to as a 'patch'.

Also, the position of the OB does not dictate ALL of the contact points that will pocket the ball. That is dependent on the direction of approach of the CB & what spin if any it is doing along with the speed of the approach. Hence a 'patch' of points.

We too often get lost in the vernacular.

A 3D sphere does have an edge by the definition of the word edge, IF the sphere is being viewed & discussed in 2D terms.

One can NOT actually see the center of a sphere, even though it is there, but one CAN SEE it's representation by the center of a 2D circle. Well...not actually, unless it has been measured & marked but one can fairly well estimate the center.

Perhaps, Duckie/Greg focuses so much on correct terminology for the reason that some words have been misapplied when explaining many of the systems.

I hope this is helpful in some way.

If not, then I apologize for posting it.
 
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What do the batters aim at?

The ghost of Babe Ruth?
th




Banks said:
What do the batters aim at?
Click to expand...
 
mohrt said:
By your own logic in other posts, a ball has no edge. If a ball has no edge, how can it have an equator or contact patch? Please point them out. Thanks.
Click to expand...

Best AnswerAsker's Choice

appleton_strings answered 7 years ago
An edge can be defined as a curve or line where the limiting tangent planes coming from different directions do not tend towards the same limit. For example, the flat part of a cylinder is ALWAYS at right angles to a tangent plane anywhere on the curved part, so the cylinder has an "edge" where the two portions meet.

At any point on a sphere, the tangent planes coming in from ANY direction all have the same limit - so a sphere has no edges. For this reason, a sphere is called a "manifold without boundary" (and cylinders and cones, etc, are called "manifolds WITH boundary")

e·qua·tor (ĭ-kwā′tər)
n.
1.
a. The imaginary great circle around the earth's surface, equidistant from the poles and perpendicular to the earth's axis of rotation. It divides the earth into the Northern Hemisphere and the Southern Hemisphere.
b. A similar great circle drawn on the surface of a celestial body at right angles to the axis of rotation.
2. The celestial equator.
3. A circle that divides a sphere or other surface into congruent parts.
 
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