efrens cue, dealing with scammers and edge hybrid shaft

[Allen Brown]

I might add that the OP is name calling and making the buyer look like a crazy guy that doesn't know anything. You don't just sit there and call people names unless you know that you are guilty.

After all guys it's an OB cue and not a Szamboti like the OP said. Why would you even say that? Just because the buyer is new to the forum doesn't automatically put him in the wrong.

Let it fly, but that's the way I see it and If I were a betting man I would bet the farm that I'm right on this one.

 

[Nick B]

I am not crazy, I am simply defending my self from the false claims...

OK I'll play. Why didn't you notice the damage when you opened the box? Assuming it's as bad as you say then it should have been obvious.

Nick

 

[Nick B]

Are you sure the buyer is crazy? I don't think he is and he should get a refund.

Not yet but the needle never fails me. Lets see what happens from here.

 

[sebroy9]

OK I'll play. Why didn't you notice the damage when you opened the box? Assuming it's as bad as you say then it should have been obvious.

Nick

Yeah I immediately tried the cue ran a few racks loved playing with it even though it had a hard tip on i thought i would just put a real playing tip on not a break tip. then I emailed him to say the cue was great. then I started to notice the dings with my hands holding the cue and I saw the bottom of the butt and how the joint was cracked with the shaft. Then I instantly emailed him the very same day I said I like the cue to tell him that I wanted a refund because of the condition the cue was in. I posted the pictures of the email I sent him asking for a refund, I gave him 2 days to reply to me and accept my request for a refund and if he did not reply in 2 days I would file a claim with paypal. Once he did not reply to me for 2 days I filed the paypal claim and as soon as he received the email from paypal about the claim then he started to talk to me again started to accuse me of beating up the cue on purpose to return it.... I would never do such a thing, I actually wanted the cue, I have absolutely nothing to gain from beating up a cue to get my money back.... I would make 0 profit from that so how can I scam like that? I even offered him to pay for the shipping for 75$ for him to refund me and send back his cue.

 

[cueaddicts]

Also, it says very good condition in the ebay ad.

Also from the auction...."Used: An item that has been used previously. The item may have some signs of cosmetic wear, but is fully operational and functions as intended. This item may be a floor model or store return that has been used. See the seller’s listing for full details and description of any imperfections."

Well, you bought a used cue with obvious wear. If you wanted a used cue that was in like new condition, hopefully you asked a lot of detailed questions beforehand or asked for better pics. From experience, very good condition is a **very relative term**. Heck, I've had people trying to sell me their cue that looked like this, claiming it was "mint". When selling, I try to always over-analyze and fully describe obvious flaws or issues. It's just the proper way to go about doing things. This is why.

That being said, if you bombard someone with a zillion zany, stalker-like messages, you can't blame a person for wondering about your sanity or what kind of person you are. Gifting a payment to someone you don't know at all is a terrible thing to do. This is why.

This may or may not be a TWO WAY SLIM SHADY, but it is a pretty good example of how desperate some sellers and buyers have become in our world of cheaply bought morals, no personal accountability, and lack of honor.

 

[Nick B]

Yeah I immediately tried the cue ran a few racks loved playing with it even though it had a hard tip on i thought i would just put a real playing tip on not a break tip. then I emailed him to say the cue was great. then I started to notice the dings with my hands holding the cue and I saw the bottom of the butt and how the joint was cracked with the shaft. Then I instantly emailed him the very same day I said I like the cue to tell him that I wanted a refund because of the condition the cue was in. I posted the pictures of the email I sent him asking for a refund, I gave him 2 days to reply to me and accept my request for a refund and if he did not reply in 2 days I would file a claim with paypal. Once he did not reply to me for 2 days I filed the paypal claim and as soon as he received the email from paypal about the claim then he started to talk to me again started to accuse me of beating up the cue on purpose to return it.... I would never do such a thing, I actually wanted the cue, I have absolutely nothing to gain from beating up a cue to get my money back.... I would make 0 profit from that so how can I scam like that? I even offered him to pay for the shipping for 75$ for him to refund me and send back his cue.

Don't give me blah blah about the tip. When you pulled it out and put it together why could you not tell it had extensive damage? Zero profit logic is meaningless. You don't like the cue anymore. Meaningless. You went outside ebay protocol....meaningless.

One simple question:
If it had extensive damage how could you not notice?

 

[sebroy9]

Also from the auction...."Used: An item that has been used previously. The item may have some signs of cosmetic wear, but is fully operational and functions as intended. This item may be a floor model or store return that has been used. See the seller’s listing for full details and description of any imperfections."

Well, you bought a used cue with obvious wear. If you wanted a used cue that was in like new condition, hopefully you asked a lot of detailed questions beforehand or asked for better pics. From experience, very good condition is a **very relative term**. Heck, I've had people trying to sell me their cue that looked like this, claiming it was "mint". When selling, I try to always over-analyze and fully describe obvious flaws or issues. It's just the proper way to go about doing things. This is why.

That being said, if you bombard someone with a zillion zany, stalker-like messages, you can't blame a person for wondering about your sanity or what kind of person you are. Gifting a payment to someone you don't know at all is a terrible thing to do. This is why.

This may or may not be a TWO WAY SLIM SHADY, but it is a pretty good example of how desperate some sellers and buyers have become in our world of cheaply bought morals, no personal accountability, and lack of honor.

I did specifically ask him the condition of the cue via email.

Edit: Actually it doesn't matter because he used the wrong photo on his ebay ad and that is considered misrepresentation of an item and also considered fraud.

 

[sebroy9]

One simple question:
If it had extensive damage how could you not notice?

I believe I already answered this to you. I only noticed after I ran a few racks. I was more focused on playing the racks.

Go ahead and assume that I am crazy with your crazydar or whatever you are saying. I don't care because I know I'm not crazy heh.

 

[Nick B]

I believe I already answered this to you. I only noticed after I ran a few racks. I was more focused on playing the racks.

Go ahead and assume that I am crazy with your crazydar or whatever you are saying. I don't care because I know I'm not crazy heh.

No you didn't. Read this three times and then answer.

Why did you not notice extensive damage when you pulled it out?

Oh by the way I'm a bit of an equipment freak. I can feel a bing in a shaft through 3 gloves so same argument. Instead you send him positive feedback?????

 

[sebroy9]

[ Nick B , Fine, don't believe me. I know that I am telling the truth. your insults are not adding anything of value to this situation.

 

[Nick B]

[ Nick B , Fine, don't believe me. I know that I am telling the truth. your insults are not adding anything of value to this situation.

I couldn't help but notice you didn't answer....

 

[sebroy9]

I couldn't help but notice you didn't answer....

I did, you don't like my answer that's fine. It's the truth.

 

[skins]

I did specifically ask him the condition of the cue via email.

Edit: Actually it doesn't matter because he used the wrong photo on his ebay ad and that is considered misrepresentation of an item and also considered fraud.

ACTUALLY you can see the damage to the butt AND the shafts in the Ebay pictures if you look hard enough. The pictures posted in the add id bet WERE recent pics AFTER damage was done...

What I think may have happened is maybe you found out the same OB new isn't that much more than what you paid for this used one and you might as well spend the few bucks more for a brand new cue...

That said, if it were me I'd give the buyer a refund if he wasn't happy and the cue was returned in the same condition as I sent it.. But that's me...

 

[sebroy9]

ACTUALLY you can see the damage to the butt AND the shafts in the Ebay pictures if you look hard enough. The pictures posted in the add id bet WERE recent pics AFTER damage was done...

What I think may have happened is maybe you found out the same OB new isn't that much more than what you paid for this used one and you might as well spend the few bucks more for a brand new cue...

That said, if it were me I'd give the buyer a refund if he wasn't happy and the cue was returned in the same condition as I sent it.. But that's me...

Where exactly do you see the damage on the butt in this picture here?

I really don't see it at all.


Here is the real condition of the butt.... clearly a difference.

 

[sebroy9]

skins, I know the picture is older because the shaft in the picture don't have a ring of chalk under the ferule but the cue I received have a very distinctive blue chalk ring from the wrong way he chalked the cue by jamming the chalk in the tip and twisting it. That blue ring under the ferule would take a while to accumulate.

Also, no. I did not think the cue was too expensive because the OB new is 569$ US and I paid 425$ US for the cue then had to pay shipping and it came to 571$ Canadian. The OB new on the website would have cost like 738$ Cad plus shipping. I thought I was getting a good deal because the cue looked like new and the seller lied about the condition of the cue in an email. Trust me, I wish the cue was in good shape, I wanted the cue.... why else would I have bought it?

 

[Straightpool_99]

Straightpool_99's guide to buying stuff online (Ebay)

1. Look at pictures in ad. Read description, but don't trust it. Bad pictures=high risk.

2. If pictures are unclear, ask for a picture of the part you worry about. If the seller is unwilling, be careful.

3. Ask questions if ad is unclear. If the seller does not appear to know what he is talking about or being evasive, thats a warning sign.
(Save all communication. You can delete it later, if all goes well).

4. Always, always, always purchase with Paypal the proper way. If the seller insists on using the "gift" option, there are two possibilities: He's a scammer trying to f -you or he is a cheap son of a ..who's probably going to send the item the cheapest way possible, wrapped in old newspapers and snotty hankys. If you are still really hot for the item and the guy won't budge, pay the fees yourself. The paypal protection is worth the cost. And for heavens sake: use the Ebay system, otherwise you are not protected. Don't make shady deals.

5. When item arrives carefully inspect packaging (with costly items). If something is seriously damaged or tampered with deal with it when the item is delivered. If you have allready received it, and it is too late, take pictures of the package(s).

6. When item is unwrapped, carefully inspect it. Take pictures if something is missing/damaged.

7. If something is off, you can try to communicate with the seller, but be professional and civil. Make your complaint known in a matter-of-fact way. A gentle touch will often get you more than coming out, guns blazing, and sending crazy emails will make you look bad and unreasonable.

8. Feedback should be left the next day, so as to give you time to cool off and think.

9. Having documented everything and followed the correct procedure, you should be in a very good position in case the deal goes bad.

 

[sebroy9]

1. Look at pictures in ad. Read description, but don't trust it. Bad pictures=high risk.

2. If pictures are unclear, ask for a picture of the part you worry about. If the seller is unwilling, be careful.

3. Ask questions if ad is unclear. If the seller does not appear to know what he is talking about or being evasive, thats a warning sign.
(Save all communication. You can delete it later, if all goes well).

4. Always, always, always purchase with Paypal the proper way. If the seller insists on using the "gift" option, there are two possibilities: He's a scammer trying to f -you or he is a cheap son of a ..who's probably going to send the item the cheapest way possible, wrapped in old newspapers and snotty hankys. If you are still really hot for the item and the guy won't budge, pay the fees yourself. The paypal protection is worth the cost. And for heavens sake: use the Ebay system, otherwise you are not protected. Don't make shady deals.

5. When item arrives carefully inspect packaging (with costly items). If something is seriously damaged or tampered with deal with it when the item is delivered. If you have allready received it, and it is too late, take pictures of the package(s).

6. When item is unwrapped, carefully inspect it. Take pictures if something is missing/damaged.

7. If something is off, you can try to communicate with the seller, but be professional and civil. Make your complaint known in a matter-of-fact way. A gentle touch will often get you more than coming out, guns blazing, and sending crazy emails will make you look bad and unreasonable.

8. Feedback should be left the next day, so as to give you time to cool off and think.

9. Having documented everything and followed the correct procedure, you should be in a very good position in case the deal goes bad.

Yes thank you. :I have never had any problems buying online and this i the first time I ever buy money gift and will be the last time as well.

He did ship the cheapest usps service there was, charged me 75$ for that shipping but I did not know he was gonna take most of the money for him self and ship the cheapest way possible.

Honestly, his good ebay rep is what got me to trust him. I thought why would he try to scam me, he's got a really good rep. well money gift don't affect ebay rep so I guess that explains that.

I will follow your guide lines in the future.

 

[Celophanewrap]

So, if I understand correctly, you made a deal for a cue advertised as a used cue, you agreed on a price and you paid for and received a cue - the cue agreed upon, you played with it and loved it and said as much IN WRITING, and now it's several days (?) (weeks?) later and you decided it had some damage not shown in the photos and you no longer "love" it and want your money back.
You know, it was fine when you got it, you played with it and it was fine, so much so that you "loved" it. Are you sure you didn't do any damage? Why didn't you notice it was "beat to hell" before you played with it?
I dunno dude, your accusations all sound more than a little suspect to me.

 

[sebroy9]

So, if I understand correctly, you made a deal for a cue advertised as a used cue, you agreed on a price and you paid for and received a cue - the cue agreed upon, you played with it and loved it and said as much IN WRITING, and now it's several days (?) (weeks?) later and you decided it had some damage not shown in the photos and you no longer "love" it and want your money back.
You know, it was fine when you got it, you played with it and it was fine, so much so that you "loved" it. Are you sure you didn't do any damage? Why didn't you notice it was "beat to hell" before you played with it?
I dunno dude, your accusations all sound more than a little suspect to me.

Nope, that's completely wrong. I sent him an email asking for a refund the very same day I said the cue shot great, I had not originally noticed all the dings on the cue while I was focusing on playing some racks. It was not weeks it was 1 day.

The cue shot great except for a breaking tip on the shaft. and it rolls perfectly straight and I wish it was in good condition but it's not and so I don't want a dinged up cue with cracked joint and busted bottom butt.... There's no way I would even get one single dent on that cue let alone all the damage that is on the cue... I've had cues for years with no dings.... I don't beat up cues and I don't know how he managed to beat this one up this bad.

 

[Celophanewrap]

Nope, that's completely wrong. I sent him an email asking for a refund the very same day I said the cue shot great, I had not originally noticed all the dings on the cue while I was focusing on playing some racks. It was not weeks it was 1 day.

The cue shot great except for a breaking tip on the shaft. and it rolls perfectly straight and I wish it was in good condition but it's not and so I don't want a dinged up cue with cracked joint and busted bottom butt.... There's no way I would even get one single dent on that cue let alone all the damage that is on the cue... I've had cues for years with no dings.... I don't beat up cues and I don't know how he managed to beat this one up this bad.

Ok, 1 day, after you had played without it, is that correct? Did you play on the table in your house, or did you take it to a pool hall or bar?
I must be missing the crack in the joint, where is that?