Who hates slow players?

[vagabond]

Some years ago,in an International match held somewhere outside USA, "Kid Delicious" as usual played extremely slow,more slower than late Tabersky. Rules did not have any reference on slow play. It was my understanding that Michaela Tab pulled him aside and talked to him about his slow play. The viewers of stream were very disappointed/upset/lost interest/angry at "Kid Delicious"" and ridiculed him with their comments on the stream`s chat room.

After that incident I never heard about his participation in any major pool events.

I am wondering whether it was poor physical health or the insults/public ridicule he received during that match that made him disappear from the pool scene.
I do believe that Public shaming/ Ridicule will certainly have an impact on the slow Players.

I not only not play slow players but also avoid socializing with them or even saying hello to them. I don`t want them to be part of my life. If somebody was already a friend of mine and later learned about their slow play, I don`t unfriend them but I don`t play with them.

 

[pug1986]

I actually like slow players. I think its a great thing for the game.

 

[Inaction]

, and I don't believe anybody takes 4 minutes between every single shot or takes "38 practice strokes" before every single shot regardless of how slow they are.

I have seen a guy who would take 20 to 25 strokes on each shot, regardless of how easy it was. Even on a straight in 8-ball in front of the pocket and a foot from the cue ball.

He had a custom McDermott with an 8 or 9 mm shaft. It looked like a pencil.

 

[HawaiianEye]

Slow players are one thing, but people who don't pay attention to the game are another type of player that bother me. I don't think it is my responsibility to tell you "what happened when I was gone" every ten minutes because you weren't paying attention.

I have to constantly remind one guy that I play that it is his shot because he is never paying attention to the table. Then when it is his turn, he wants to walk around and instruct people on other tables, etc., etc., rather than get up to his table and take his shot.

Sometimes I give him a stern reminder or two that "there are other tables he can play on if he doesn't like the one we are on"...I'd prefer to practice by myself to keep chasing him around.

 

[Icon of Sin]

Sometimes 8 ball can take a long time without either player shooting slowly. Its the nature of that game.

KMRUNOUT

This was definitely their fault... not 8balls.

 

[KMRUNOUT]

Slow players are not intelligent. They don't understand the game and they have very little knowledge. IQ in the 80-100 range.

Wow...just...wow. This post is intended to show off your intelligence? This might be the best one I've seen in a long time.

KMRUNOUT

 

[fjk]

We have one slow player in town. I nicknamed him Cobweb 30 years ago and it stuck. He still plays very slow and that's why most people refuse to play any game with him. He's a nice fellow too and well liked. We've all seen this guy take over a minute on a hanging 9 ball while he chalks with two pieces of chalk and walks all around the table.
I can see a player being cautious in One Pocket and it may cause them to take their time, but it's a game where one poor choice at shots can cost you, so I grant extra patience with every player in that game.
A slow 9 ball player, I'll have him kicking most of the time when he comes to the table and chances are I'll refuse to play him in the future.
Nothing's worse than feeling you're trapped in a time warp in the Twilight Zone.

In our neck of the woods, anyone who takes an exorbitant amount of time on a no-brainer shot, we call it "Herbitizing". That's synonymous with saying "pick up the pace you retard".

 

[KMRUNOUT]

This was definitely their fault... not 8balls.

While your statement is *possible*, I have witnessed 8 ball matches that invalidate your statement. It is possible to take only 17 seconds per shot and have a complex bar table 8 ball game go 20 innings or more. Generally when the lay of the table is particularly complex, taking 17 seconds on *every* shot is likely to sell out the game. I don't think taking 40 seconds is unreasonable in a complex layout in 8 ball. One screw up could cost the set. That is the nature of bar table 8 ball among strong players.

Making your statement generally without any reference to a particular match sounds nonsensical.

Can you explain how "it was definitely their fault" if they didn't play slowly?

KMRUNOUT

 

[Icon of Sin]

While your statement is *possible*, I have witnessed 8 ball matches that invalidate your statement. It is possible to take only 17 seconds per shot and have a complex bar table 8 ball game go 20 innings or more. Generally when the lay of the table is particularly complex, taking 17 seconds on *every* shot is likely to sell out the game. I don't think taking 40 seconds is unreasonable in a complex layout in 8 ball. One screw up could cost the set. That is the nature of bar table 8 ball among strong players.

Making your statement generally without any reference to a particular match sounds nonsensical.

Can you explain how "it was definitely their fault" if they didn't play slowly?

KMRUNOUT

For shits sake man you werent there and im not an idiot... during 4th rack one of the players had ball in hand with three balls left on the table and nothing tied up or blocking a pocket... he took at least 3 minutes to set the cueball down and at least another 6-8minutes to run those three balls. This is big table also. Way less cluters and easier runouts. This was also a weekly open tournament that draws good players and was a semi final match. I was waiting for the winner of said match in the winners side final. This wasnt a bullshit APA barbox match between 2 skill level 3s. We have all seen those marathons.

Also, the main culprit in the pace of this match has a nickname, that I will refuse to post in case he reads here, that references his pace of play.

Finally, there is a scratch cup in this tournament (50 cents per scratch). 5th and 6th place play off for whatever the cup earned that night. Since this tourney generally draws over 30 players weekly, it can be a decent amount. The Scratch cup match is a race to 3 in 9 ball. The slow player i mentioned above had to play for the scratch cup. So I go hill hill and win the winners side final. I watch the next match to decide the winner of the losers side and I split the final with the guy who won the losers side since we agreed at the beginning and are friends. The two people playing the the scratch cup are still shooting their race to 3 in 9ball while 2 other matches started and finished and the rest of the tournament has ended.

And my original statement did reference said match, just one you didnt see with players you dont know. So it would be non-sensical to argue without having the facts.

Does that adequetly answer your condescending question and post?

 

[Busboy]

A guy i played takes too long before any shot. 3-4 minutes. damn. he goes down in his shot and stands up. repeat and go around the table like a ballerina every shot. can we have shot clocks on tournaments/gambling please???????

3-4 min is a lot I hate when players are like that I understand taken some time but 3-4 min is bit much

 

[Dockter]

I have seen a guy who would take 20 to 25 strokes on each shot, regardless of how easy it was. Even on a straight in 8-ball in front of the pocket and a foot from the cue ball.

He had a custom McDermott with an 8 or 9 mm shaft. It looked like a pencil.

Was this in a tournament or around here? I seen a guy with a pencil shaft at a tournament in Brookings that played like this although I don't know what type of cue he was using.

I have a ton of McD's but as anyone can tell from my video this isn't me because I shoot faster than I should causing me to miss more than I make.

 

[j_zippel]

With all due respect....yes, a curious statement. I'm sure there have been times when that phrase is used in which the person it is said to actually is due very little respect.



Anyway...while I appreciate you taking the time to read all of my *1000's* of posts, which I'm sure you must have done to make a claim about the vast majority of them, I disagree with your assessment of them. And my posting on AZ really has nothing to do with my skill as a player, nor my fighting capabilities (not sure why you would take it there??). I post what I think about topics on the forum.



My belief, based on 22 years in pool rooms and a lifetime of carefully observing and studying human behavior, is that on average the ones who tend to complain about slow players tend to be anxious impatient people. You are under no obligation to agree with me, or to understand me, or to *try* and understand me through dialog. Most people tend to defend their own beliefs reflexively.



As for any pedestals, talking down...I speak plainly, honestly, and openly. That will come across to some, and probably seem irritating to others. I make a strong effort to be polite about it.



I do agree that some players take an *unusual* amount of time to shoot obvious shots. However, it may be (and often is) the case that what is obvious to me is not obvious to someone else. This is also the cause of much challenge in life ;-) My solution is to let them shoot their shot, then shoot my shot as I like, and let the tournament director sort it out if it causes an issue. It doesn't particularly bother me. I guess the title of this post "who hates slow players" may have put me on the defensive as well. I certainly don't *hate* impatience. But I don't much like it either. Sometimes you just have to accept things you don't like.



KMRUNOUT

Don't flatter yourself thinking I've read 1000 posts of yours, the reason why I through in the "size" start is because you let me know that last year and I have a decent memory..

I understand where you are coming from, my point of view is subjective to what I've experienced and variables that's certainly aren't a direct reflection of what the OP stated. I don't 'hate' slow players but MY definition of one isn't someone hat is methodical approaching the table but one that purposely slows the pace of the game down and takes additional time, consistently on every shot in order to gain an edge. I'm not kidding when I say I've played matches with certain people that literally take 3-4 minutes on runouts playing 8 ball with no obstructions, a few balls left and have a ball in hand to start with.

 

[Lonestar_jim]

If it is literally 3-4 min per shot, then yeah. That's hard to justify. I mean, super tough position shot to get on the game ball to win a big tourney...ok maybe then. But every shot that long is too long. Thing is, many people while sitting in the chair genuinely believe sometimes that 92 seconds is 3 or 4 minutes. I've seen it many times. One team in our apa division accused our team of playing slow because the matches with us often ended late. So I timed every shot of every match, all breaks, and times to put up players. Turns out they averaged longer than us to shoot a shot, and overall they took more time. It's amazing what's facts can do to perceptions.

But yeah 3-4 minutes, if that is timed with a stopwatch and not just a feeling, is way too long. Maybe on some big shot at a big moment. But every shot? No I agree that's too long. Still, I doubt I'd say anything about it unless there was some danger of the match changing as a result.

Point taken,

KMRUNOUT

So are you the type to lawyer up under a 45 second clock ?
I think 45 is reasonable in rotation and 8- ball.

 

[Inaction]

Was this in a tournament or around here? I seen a guy with a pencil shaft at a tournament in Brookings that played like this although I don't know what type of cue he was using.

I have a ton of McD's but as anyone can tell from my video this isn't me because I shoot faster than I should causing me to miss more than I make.

I don't know if he plays anymore. The last time I saw him was around 1986, before I moved to Brookings. His cue was heavy too, 23 or 24 ounces. Quite a character. He said once that when pretty girls are watching, he doesn't care if he makes the shot, as long as he makes the cue ball dance.

I have not seen his name on any league rosters near Mitchell, where I last heard that he lived.

 

[KMRUNOUT]

For shits sake man you werent there and im not an idiot... during 4th rack one of the players had ball in hand with three balls left on the table and nothing tied up or blocking a pocket... he took at least 3 minutes to set the cueball down and at least another 6-8minutes to run those three balls. This is big table also. Way less cluters and easier runouts. This was also a weekly open tournament that draws good players and was a semi final match. I was waiting for the winner of said match in the winners side final. This wasnt a bullshit APA barbox match between 2 skill level 3s. We have all seen those marathons.

Also, the main culprit in the pace of this match has a nickname, that I will refuse to post in case he reads here, that references his pace of play.

Finally, there is a scratch cup in this tournament (50 cents per scratch). 5th and 6th place play off for whatever the cup earned that night. Since this tourney generally draws over 30 players weekly, it can be a decent amount. The Scratch cup match is a race to 3 in 9 ball. The slow player i mentioned above had to play for the scratch cup. So I go hill hill and win the winners side final. I watch the next match to decide the winner of the losers side and I split the final with the guy who won the losers side since we agreed at the beginning and are friends. The two people playing the the scratch cup are still shooting their race to 3 in 9ball while 2 other matches started and finished and the rest of the tournament has ended.

And my original statement did reference said match, just one you didnt see with players you dont know. So it would be non-sensical to argue without having the facts.

Does that adequately answer your condescending question and post?

Icon,

My apologies. I didn't realize that you were referring to a specific experience of your own. I realize now that I replied to that, and then you replied to my saying "it was definitely their fault not 8 balls". Thing is, by the time I read that reply, I genuinely forgot about our previous exchange, and thought you were just making a general statement like "when 8 ball games take forever, it is the players fault not the games". Everything makes perfect sense and actually although, yes, you explanation is perfectly clear, it actually would not have been necessary if I had kept a more attentive eye on the development of this thread. I definitely do stand by what I said, that 8 ball can take a long time even with skilled players and even if both players play at a decent pace. It is the nature of that game, particularly on the bar box.

But yeah I do indeed apologize...I lost track of our particular exchange in this thread. My bad. And I respect that you continued and explained things further even in the face of what seemed like a kinda dickish post by me. So props to you.

Hope this clears it up!

KMRUNOUT

 

[KMRUNOUT]

Don't flatter yourself thinking I've read 1000 posts of yours, the reason why I through in the "size" start is because you let me know that last year and I have a decent memory..

I understand where you are coming from, my point of view is subjective to what I've experienced and variables that's certainly aren't a direct reflection of what the OP stated. I don't 'hate' slow players but MY definition of one isn't someone hat is methodical approaching the table but one that purposely slows the pace of the game down and takes additional time, consistently on every shot in order to gain an edge. I'm not kidding when I say I've played matches with certain people that literally take 3-4 minutes on runouts playing 8 ball with no obstructions, a few balls left and have a ball in hand to start with.

I think your memory might need a little polishing up. I have never, EVER, made a comment about my size in reference to any fighting or anything remotely related to it. I have never threatened anyone on this forum ever, nor challenged them in any way (bet, play a match, fight, whatever.) You may have me confused with someone else.

Everything in your second paragraph I agree with completely. I think some are just genuinely slow, not for any malicious reason. Others are slow because they are determined and methodical. I do indeed agree that some people play slow as a move, or to gain an edge as you say. I definitely don't like that. In fact, I pretty much detest all sharking, moves, etc. I try my best for sure to avoid it in myself. I guess no one is perfect though. Just last week someone quit a tournament on me because I was eating a bowl of soup and put my spoon down while he was at the table shooting. I was just in shock. I couldn't tell if he was joking with me or not. If he had asked me to be totally stationary like a statue 8 feet away from the table, I guess I would have obliged. If someone is aiming straight at me, I try to be totally motionless. This wasn't the case though.

Anyway, yeah, I think we are on the same page with the slowness thing, but are in two different universes on the size and threatening thing. I mean, it is *possible* that someone might have accused me of something, and thrown in the idea of "your probably very short so you need to compensate...etc...who knows?" If anything I might have corrected them, pointing out that I'm actually not too short. I am 100% certain though that this would have been only in a correction of facts type of vain, not at all in a confrontational or threatening one. Even still, I don't think that happened either, but I'm not ruling out the possibility that I may have forgotten, as I wouldn't have thought much about incoming comments like that.

Anyway, peace. Lets stick to the things we agree on. If you want to remind me more explicitly of some post from a year ago, that's fine too. PM me. I won't take it as an argument or anything. I'm actually curious now if there is something I might have forgotten about.

KMRUNOUT

 

[KMRUNOUT]

So are you the type to lawyer up under a 45 second clock ?
I think 45 is reasonable in rotation and 8- ball.

I don't understand the lawyer up comment.

But yeah I agree. 45 seconds should be ok in 8 ball. On a barbox, I can understand taking a bit longer. Particularly on those very complex clustered racks. Once the balls are open though it shouldn't take more than 45 sec.

In rotation games, 45 sec should be plenty. American Rotation might take a bit more at the beginning of the rack, but not really because your choices are pretty much shoot or play safe...there's no option what ball to take.

KMRUNOUT

 

[Ak147]

They give me additional focus to run out

 

[Lonestar_jim]

I don't understand the lawyer up comment.

But yeah I agree. 45 seconds should be ok in 8 ball. On a barbox, I can understand taking a bit longer. Particularly on those very complex clustered racks. Once the balls are open though it shouldn't take more than 45 sec.

In rotation games, 45 sec should be plenty. American Rotation might take a bit more at the beginning of the rack, but not really because your choices are pretty much shoot or play safe...there's no option what ball to take.

KMRUNOUT

Just a reference to post(s) within this thread where slow players have fought for their right to disrupt tournament play by employing legal counsel and the like.

 

[Icon of Sin]

Icon,

My apologies. I didn't realize that you were referring to a specific experience of your own. I realize now that I replied to that, and then you replied to my saying "it was definitely their fault not 8 balls". Thing is, by the time I read that reply, I genuinely forgot about our previous exchange, and thought you were just making a general statement like "when 8 ball games take forever, it is the players fault not the games". Everything makes perfect sense and actually although, yes, you explanation is perfectly clear, it actually would not have been necessary if I had kept a more attentive eye on the development of this thread. I definitely do stand by what I said, that 8 ball can take a long time even with skilled players and even if both players play at a decent pace. It is the nature of that game, particularly on the bar box.

But yeah I do indeed apologize...I lost track of our particular exchange in this thread. My bad. And I respect that you continued and explained things further even in the face of what seemed like a kinda dickish post by me. So props to you.

Hope this clears it up!

KMRUNOUT

All good. Thanks for the apology.