The true cost of hustling

People in the area for a limited time..... can kind of see their motivation to sandbag or hustle.

I have seen players join a league and dump their league matches to setup money games with unsuspecting league players.

Whether or not the amount of money they win is worth the bother, their reputation as a person or player is up to them. The people I see doing this don't seem to mind that they are disliked and not trusted.
 
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pool boomed when lots of people hang around the rooms and drank coffee ate and spent the day there. they didnt play much unless they had a game they thought they could win, but every day something was happening just not all the time.
lots of people always brought others as who wants to hang out in an empty room. so places made money.
nowadays not many gamblers, just funzies, so they do come and play and spend more than the average so called hustler. but they leave after they are done and the room is empty. no more money for the owner and no more draw for people to come in.
the pool room becomes like the empty bar. it only get lone drinkers and the social aspect of the room is gone.
card rooms are full, why because people do like to gamble and the ones that dont can stay home as they do, or find another pastime. the weak and foolish fall prey to the hustlers there also and in both scenarios the people that lose know exactly what they are getting into.

the holier than thou types sit around and think no one should be taken advantage of even if it is their wish or pleasure to be there. yet let them find an old lady selling her car for too low of a price and see who jumps on it and buys it.

or look at a few who have posted on here and how they are trying to get way the best of it when they buy a cue stick and take advantage of someone who needs the money or just is nice and wants to sell their stick to someone that may have fun with it. but thak's okay.
 
KissedOut said:
No, too often they are cesspits and decent people won't go there. And then we can have a long thread about how pool need to expand. Expanding while dissing the decent folks sounds like a great strategy to me. Everyone knows that the money that drives pool is the money that changes hands between con men and their victims.

The true cost of hustling is that the mentality permeates the pool world.

And did you read the part about how these guys will not bet high and risk getting busted by anyone who seems to know how to hold a cue?

Sorry to say, but the mentality you espouse is exactly the problem.
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How exciting ...a bunch of housewives shooting balls into the rails. Come on man, who the hell is going to want to watch that?

I'll play anybody in a fair game...I've given people the 3 and out in 9 ball. Rarely do I get weight, at most the 8 ball or a game, then I'm playing a shortstop. Most of the time I'm giving up more than I should, just to stay in action.

There are so many ways to adjust in pool....giving up breaks, ball in hand, called balls, games on wire...if a guy can't figure out how to get good games, then yeah they should stay out of action.

Pool is almost dead. Demonizing the action players is gonna save pool by making it G rated and family friendly. Biggiest bunch of BS I ever heard. Maybe they should dress thepros in cumberbunds and vests cause that worked so well in the 80's.
 
ctyhntr said:
It's always amusing to come across people who believe their pool subculture is representative of all pool players. Haters will always find something to denigrate, and blame, rather than take responsibility.
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It's always amusing to me that people don't realize groups are often judged by the actions of "some" regardless of IF it is a minority or not. Pool Hustlers must be the radicalized group in our 'religion'.

For those non-hustler players, we know what its like to be judged not for our behavior, but the behavior of others.

You're right, haters will hate and others believe ignorance is bliss when actually its just ignorance.

The subculture is a coat that every pool player wears. Any time a non-pool player finds out you play pool you so often get a statement about being a shark/hustler.
 
justaplayer said:
... Demonizing the action players is gonna save pool by making it G rated and family friendly. Biggiest bunch of BS I ever heard. Maybe they should dress thepros in cumberbunds and vests cause that worked so well in the 80's.
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I'm not so sure this is demonizing the action player but why not call out dishonest?

Maybe I'm not drawing the correct distinction but "hustling" = con/misrepresenting your speed is very different than an action game.
 
classiccues said:
I have been saying this for a long time, and it is true no matter where you are. The pool player mentality is a disease, and there is no cure. Its usual symptoms are short sidedness, T-Rex Arms, inability to separate quick cash, from the prosperity bought on by nurturing a business.
Its the main reason good pool halls are not run by ex-players, they are run by normal people that just find pool a fun hobby. A person with a business mind can make a go at a pool room, but talk to any player and you can shred their business plan, for a pool hall, in seconds.
When you have an up and coming enthusiast, the worse thing you can do is allow him to be massacred on the table by a "player". Pool is not a cheap hobby, if you want to get good. You need to play a few hours a day, which means there is usually a meal in there plus other incidentals. For an average Joe, this is a 20-30 dollar bill every time he goes to play. When you extrapolate that into a month at 20 times, 4-6 hundred. When they lose interest, after a beating, or it is no longer fun, you lose him / her and the related income. A player just sees that quick 40-60 dollars, at 20 a game, and doesn't care if this person stops coming into your business. He got his, and to him, that is the ultimate end result for today, he doesn't care about tomorrow.

JV
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JV,

When a poolroom has "players" & so-called "hustlers" in it they must be told by the owner of the room that the "squares" are to be left alone. This takes care of that problem.

I don't know how you would classify me, I've held a job for over 40 years but I've also gambled at pool since I was 16 and could walk into a poolroom. I've played many very good players and I received weight from some and I've given weight to guys who needed it. I have bet everything from $5 per game to $1000 per set and almost always bet my own since I had it to bet.

The guys you reference who walk around the room asking the square johns to gamble need to be kept away from them, that's true, but when one those square johns wants to gamble then it's nobody's business what happens. After all, he thinks he's hustling too even if he isn't. Only a person with larceny in his own heart can be taken advantage of by anyone.

Dennis (never asked a square john to gamble)
 
Nothing to see here. Hashed and re-hashed subject. There have been hustler's, scammers and dishonest humans since the start of time. They know who they are and have to look into a mirror at themselves.... every once in awhile.

There are also folks that like the rush of gambling and fools. Weather it be Pool, cards, casino action or a street corner 3 card hustle. It's your money and you choose how to spend it....or not.


Have a good day:groucho:

-Kat,
 
TCo said:
I'm not so sure this is demonizing the action player but why not call out dishonest?

Maybe I'm not drawing the correct distinction but "hustling" = con/misrepresenting your speed is very different than an action game.
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This had been gone over SOOOO many times and there will never be an agreement on some of the key parts. But how about this for some food for thought - In business a good, smart business man ALWAYS tries to have leverage. Amongst many other things a part of " leverage " is not showing all of your cards till you absolutely have to. This is also considered an art, much like many attribute to the pool " hustler ". These same principles are in play in so so many different facets of our everyday life, often going unnoticed. Someone in the business world who successfully navigates using these principles is considered a " financial genius ". Good, honest, hard working , Christians are falling all over themselves trying to " get in ", invest, looking for advice, etc. These people include Police, Fire, school teachers, mechanics, farmers along with any other deemed " respectable trade. These successful business men are given awards, put on covers of magazines , asked to give speeches to college students and so on. The difference as I see it is two things : the scale of the money in play, and the vehicle used.It's a capitalist endeavor.Now if you want to say your one of those people that do not believe in capitalism and truly are of the socialist or communist persuasion just say so, but don't be a hypocrite that's all.
 
KissedOut said:
Great, blame the victim. He selfishly wants a fair game while the other guy is intent on stealing his money. So it must be his own fault.
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There is a grain of truth in what he said.

These "victims", as you call them, were themselves looking to victimize someone. That's what makes them easy marks. They are trapped by there own greed.

We spend too much time trying to save people from themselves nowadays. If you wish to gamble, be prepared to lose it, or don't gamble.

I generally like to match up in games I'm supposed to lose. I post the money, and in my mind it's already gone, and now I'm playing for prize in the middle. I'll fight and slug it out, push myself to my limits; and sometime I win, and sometimes I lose.

With that said, I understand exactly what the OP is saying. The mentality that develops after years of "hustling" or road work, is not very attractive. It causes players to become "lock artists" and push every angle they can in order to come out ahead. If they didn't develop that mindset, they didn't last long on the road.
Some can overcome this mental process, many cannot.

You can't play fetch with a trash dump dog, he'll run off with your shit.:grin:
 
When someone tries to hustle me, I usually respond "You can keep your money, you might need it for something else" and surprisingly, it fires them up even more hahaha:D
 
....

For many years I was the guy you're describing...

There's a lot of reasons for it and a big one is: the cheesy movies, books, articles and rambling rumors of the players themselves. It (old-school hustling) has been defined and depicted as "cool" and the very issue you outline is what attracted these hustlers to this sport.

Pool welcomes the outcast, the loner, the misunderstood and the angry, because the player doesn't have to rely on anyone o go out there and do it. You don't look like a loser when you walk into a pool room by yourself - it's you against the world.

These people see the sport as an avenue to drop out of societal structure and abuse the structures of society and the people within those structures. It's a way to get revenge and tell society that you don't need them.

Perhaps these players would straighten up and fly straight if there was a pot of gold at the end of the pro-rainbow - but there isn't. All, but of a handful, of the pros are living in poverty and struggling to make it to the next tournament.

There's a whole lot more to all of this but I don't have much time.
 
I am actually not surprised by the mentality shown in the answers in this thread.

First, not all gamblers, are hustlers, but all hustlers, are thieves. (--Remember this quote...

The average Joe, may just be looking for a funsy game, for time, or whatever.. once you lay down the hustle, you are now stealing. Play someone your own speed. But the fact is hustlers are cowards, they don't want to earn the money, they need to steal it.

This is not for the good of the "player" / "hustler", this is for the good of the room. See the issue which is very clear in most the replies, is hustlers generally do not give a flying rats ass. what happens to the room. They just go on to the next one. So if the end result is loss of business to the owner, big deal.

Sure there is the exception to a newbie wanting to see where he is at. But once he catches on to the fact that he was fleeced, any number of things can take him away from pool, and quite easily.

When you say that "he is asking for it when he gambles (getting hustled)", my reply would be. OK so a used car dealer dresses up a junker and gets YOU to buy it, its YOUR fault?!?! and it should be OK, by the replies here.. We all know the real world doesn't allow this.

JV


Cowboy Dennis said:
JV,

When a poolroom has "players" & so-called "hustlers" in it they must be told by the owner of the room that the "squares" are to be left alone. This takes care of that problem.

I don't know how you would classify me, I've held a job for over 40 years but I've also gambled at pool since I was 16 and could walk into a poolroom. I've played many very good players and I received weight from some and I've given weight to guys who needed it. I have bet everything from $5 per game to $1000 per set and almost always bet my own since I had it to bet.

The guys you reference who walk around the room asking the square johns to gamble need to be kept away from them, that's true, but when one those square johns wants to gamble then it's nobody's business what happens. After all, he thinks he's hustling too even if he isn't. Only a person with larceny in his own heart can be taken advantage of by anyone.

Dennis (never asked a square john to gamble)
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Try This.....

Instead of seeing these players as someone intercepting your money and setting up their own business within yours....

Understand that this self-motivation and business savvy can be used to increase your business...

Many of these players never had a fair shot to do something productive with their lives.... so - give them that shot. (Offer them a job, let them run your tournaments, let them give other players lessons, sponsor them in tournaments, find out what they do well and utilize it for your own success).

When you bar them all you're doing is fueling their resentment and telling them that "the better you get at this sport the worse you're treated" -- prove that wrong and you'll be surprised at how many will make you proud.
 
John Disque said:
Instead of seeing these players as someone intercepting your money and setting up their own business within yours....

Understand that this self-motivation and business savvy can be used to increase your business...

Many of these players never had a fair shot to do something productive with their lives.... so - give them that shot. (Offer them a job, let them run your tournaments, let them give other players lessons, sponsor them in tournaments, find out what they do well and utilize it for your own success).

When you bar them all you're doing is fueling their resentment and telling them that "the better you get at this sport the worse you're treated" -- prove that wrong and you'll be surprised at how many will make you proud.
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lolololololol
 
I respect everyone's decision of either I gamble or I dont. That's fine, what really gets me are the libtards mindset of its all rainbows, flowers, and unicorns. Sounds like a real nice place, too bad it doesn't exist. I try to deal in the real world, where those ideals are just that - ideas. If you haven't figured it out yet, for whatever the reason, this is a dog eat dog world. These " hustlers " are not sticking people up with guns taking all their sheet. It is two people gambling, WITH BOTH TRYING to get the others money. One is better at it. Period. Look at life, all day, every day someone is trying to get your money. You are either the wolf or the sheep bottom line . And believe me there are places for both. Don't be so naive. Live in Utopia in your mind , but don't discount to the real world - if you can help it.
 
Another thing To Think About....

Real pool players play 7 days a week.

To ask them to spend $30 each day = $210 a week - or $840 per month.

To maintain this type of spending they would have to get jobs and full-time jobs don't leave the player much time to play pool. Plus they become everything they hate.

On the other hand - the league banger is usually playing one night a week so blowing off $30 per week is no big deal.

THIS is how the player is seeing it and I fully understand that it's a serious burden to the room-owner but perhaps.... just maybe there's a common ground, you can work together and everyone can be happy.
 
TCo said:
I'm not so sure this is demonizing the action player but why not call out dishonest?

Maybe I'm not drawing the correct distinction but "hustling" = con/misrepresenting your speed is very different than an action game.
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I can watch a guy hit 3 balls and decide if he's worth a try. Not to brag, but I'm able to compete with 95 percent of players in a room , so its hard to matchup bad. Back when I played at a much lower level I took my losses as paying my dues.

Last superbilliards I put a pile of quarters on the rail and played anybody for 12hrs a day. I broke even with a young guy from Europe who came to play here for 3 months. Literally played anyone who I didn't know was a worldbeaters or real shortstop. Ultimately I went broke with guys I could beat. Out 1800, playing 100 to 400 a set. I won maybe 40 percent of the sets.: I was outta there in 40 hrs!

The year before I faired better. Made 2400. Played some real tough players. Its bar box pool so its not always under your cintrol, you learn to roll with it.

Real competition makes real players.

I don't gamble to eat. You gotta play for something IMO to bring out the best games of your opponent and yourself.
 
justinb386 said:
You should understand and know that the average Joe that goes to the pool room (and ends up with that $20 to $30 bill) is not going to be the type to get hustled (I do not think). I may be wrong though. Hustlers may actually target the average Joe types (that are not players, or even care to ever be players). The loss of the average Joe is not a loss to the pool economy though, because they really have no interest in the game (the sport of pool). I may be wrong. Maybe the average Joe type is the only thing that is keeping this sport alive, or the only thing that is keeping pool halls in business (that part is actually probably true, after thinking about it for a second). It is really sad though, to think that the only thing that is keeping pool halls alive in the average Joe (who has absolutely no interest in the sport of pool, other then maybe something to do while out on a date for example). I am forgetting about the league players though (that keep the pool halls in business), but most of them would probably never get hustled, unless they are really big headed (in which case, I think they deserve to get hustled).
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Hey justin, I get your point but the average Joe or those he brings, or those they bring another time will talk about it and some of them will be bitten by the pool bug and turn into serious players. Also, the average Joe needs to be interested in pool for big sponsorships of tournaments which would hopefully turn into more than just the mosconi cup being on tv.



Sent from my LG-H812 using Tapatalk
 
just break even

It's amazing how many people on here like to match up with the worst of it. I need
to start hanging out where they play. I've been hanging out in pool rooms for a
long time and that story about the poor innocent guy losing his hard earned
money to a hustler, who was sandbagging ( that word was for golf or bowling or
something, in pool it was called stalling or on the lemon) is just a urban legend
Everyone in the WORLD has heard that story, seen it on sitcoms, movies a
million times. People that have never even been in a pool room tell that same
stupid story of how the hustler lets the guy win and never makes a ball until all
of a sudden instead of playing for a cheese burger and coke they are betting a
thousand and then turns it on and leaves the poor innocent guy completely broke.
The poor fellow has never bet a quarter but that greasy haired,hustler with his
cigarette stained fingers ruined his life. I'm sure all of these wonderful people on
here that want the worst of it, or at the very very least a even match are just as
happy whether they win or lose as long as it was a good and fair match. And if
they happen to win, either don't take the money or keep adjusting the game until
they lose or at the very worst break even.
jack
 
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