The Greatest Players
- Thread starter Drop The Rock
- Start date
John Disque
Banned
Wanderone first started to gain attention by telling people he is the character Walter Tevis was writing about in the book/movie "The Hustler."
Tevis loudly and clearly stated, hundreds of times, that it was flat-out bullshit.
When Mosconi, who was friends with Tevis, publicly called Wanderone on his bs, Fatty took a major disliking to Mosconi and started bashing Willie to anyone who would listen.
This dingbat would come in Mosconi's poolroom and sit for hours and hours telling these crazy-ass stories to other people sitting there laughing and thinking he was God's gift to pool. Then he'd go in the back and play cards. Then he'd come out and sit for hours and hours telling more stupid stories to anyone who would listen.
The whole time, Willie would be standing there with a cue in his hand, his pockets lined with thousands of dollars and dying to play this idiot but he would never get up off his loud ass and play.
Willie toasted him on WWoS but all anyone remembers is this fat idiot running his lip about how he was the greatest player that ever lived - and you people bought it!
Tevis loudly and clearly stated, hundreds of times, that it was flat-out bullshit.
When Mosconi, who was friends with Tevis, publicly called Wanderone on his bs, Fatty took a major disliking to Mosconi and started bashing Willie to anyone who would listen.
This dingbat would come in Mosconi's poolroom and sit for hours and hours telling these crazy-ass stories to other people sitting there laughing and thinking he was God's gift to pool. Then he'd go in the back and play cards. Then he'd come out and sit for hours and hours telling more stupid stories to anyone who would listen.
The whole time, Willie would be standing there with a cue in his hand, his pockets lined with thousands of dollars and dying to play this idiot but he would never get up off his loud ass and play.
Willie toasted him on WWoS but all anyone remembers is this fat idiot running his lip about how he was the greatest player that ever lived - and you people bought it!
Last edited:
John Disque
Banned
One of the best pool players I have ever seen in person is Cisero Murphy, but things change throughout the ages.
I could sit here and name the best of each era, including today's, but my point is: Murphy should be remembered, because he was not only great but he volunteered his time money to build poolrooms and coach youngsters (for free) throughout the inner cities.
You don't know a lot about him because he was black and barred from playing in most US Pro-events.
I swear to God - he was incredible, every-single-time he got to the table!
I could sit here and name the best of each era, including today's, but my point is: Murphy should be remembered, because he was not only great but he volunteered his time money to build poolrooms and coach youngsters (for free) throughout the inner cities.
You don't know a lot about him because he was black and barred from playing in most US Pro-events.
I swear to God - he was incredible, every-single-time he got to the table!
Mr. Disque, You are the most opinionated blowhard I have ever seen!..You rarely make any sense at all!..True, Fats was not a great player, but he probably did more for pool, than Mosconi (or anyone else) ever did!..His colorful non-stop chatter, made him a popular guest on all the talk shows, where Mosconi couldn't even buy his way on!.
Anyone who really knew Fats, (as I did) and even those who didn't, enjoyed being around him. He was a one man party!.. No, he could never beat Willy at pool, but he was 50 times more interesting and likable!..Tevis would never admit he modeled his "Minnesota Fats" character after Fatty, because they were always in litigation over the fact..He also wouldn't admit he made up the "Fast Eddie" character after Ronnie Allen, for much the same reason.
PS..You need to work on your facts, as you are certainly not impressing anyone with your dislike for Fatty, or your knowledge of pool in general!
Last edited:
I'm sure you know
i assume you saw him play in Johnson city in the 60's. He looked like he played
pretty good. What did you think about the way he played when he beat Richie with
a ball. He didn't look pretty good to you? You do think Richie played pretty good, don't
you. i think he also finished 2nd in the one pocket division at the first johnson City
tournament. I didn't see that one I'm sure you were there, were they all APA 3s, I
guess so because you already said he never beat anyone
jack.
i assume you saw him play in Johnson city in the 60's. He looked like he played
pretty good. What did you think about the way he played when he beat Richie with
a ball. He didn't look pretty good to you? You do think Richie played pretty good, don't
you. i think he also finished 2nd in the one pocket division at the first johnson City
tournament. I didn't see that one I'm sure you were there, were they all APA 3s, I
guess so because you already said he never beat anyone
jack.
What they don't know is he busted Richie Florence (who was considered a top 5 9B plyr) in Johnson City when Fats was well past his prime
He was a top 5 bank pool player and a top 10 1P plyr
He hated 14-1
He would seed $$$ with lesser players in order to land whales, so, there are stories of joe blow, billy bob, etc beating him out of a hun or two...ask me how i know
You'll have to forgive my ignorance as I am only 22 and have only been around for a couple years in the pool scene. I also spend to match time watching one pocket and other games that are more popular in the US. Not much for 3 Cushion around here
You'll have to forgive the world's ignorance. It has never been into the pool scene and the small segment of it that has, played 8 ball for fun a couple times a year.
The IMO, there are only 3 contenders a the moment: pagulayan, Reyes and Blomdahl, in that order.
Anyway, what are the games? I'd say 10b, snooker and 3c.
And there you are again, wiggling your shit scented finger at others, while you do exactly what you call out.
You disque.
You disque.
very funny at the 1:20 mark, where he tries to grab the shaft of his cue and cant do it, classic stuff !
:grin-square::grin-square:
I like a lot of what you wrote, but .....
I'm inclined to disagree with the basic premise of this thread. At every moment in time, there has been a discipline that was main discipline in pool and which was used to determine the World Champion. It was straight pool until about 1980 and it has been 9-ball since. The lion's share of tournaments have always been in the main discipline and, for this reason, players focused on developing their skills in that discipline, because that was the discipline in which they could earn their living.
Greatness cannot be limited to those able to excel at all the games. Rotation games , chiefly nine ball, make up the core of the events on the world's pool calendar, and make up most of the events by which one attains their world ranking.
I admire those that excel at some of the other niche games, but right now, I'll measure excellence by who plays the best nine ball, because that's the only game in which every pro in the world is working on his skills. Those who excel at the discipline in which everybody is striving for excellence are the TRUE CHAMPIONS.
This is not meant to suggest that all-around play isn't something to be admired greatly, but DCC is a stand-alone all-around independent event in America and the Master of the Table competition may even be the best event on the American pool calendar. That said, however, it does consist of two disciplines which are played chiefly in America, one of which has a following in just a few states.
Let's hope Darren's new eight ball tour can revitalize eight ball at the pro level in America and make it one of the chief disciplines in American pool.
billinboston
Registered
Agree with SJD ! Fatty could play some good one pocket
According to Jersey Red, Boston Shorty, Ronnie Allen
And even Eddie Taylor ! He was a gambler .. and a real good gambler arlt that
That farce on WWOS in 1978 was a joke. Willie won sure
Big deal .. Fatty offered to play him 500 a game one pocket
He also offered banks.. when willie shook him off.. he
Also said... ok Willie... you want straight pool.. tell ya what
Lets play straight pool with every other shot being a bank ?
How's that... again willie shook him off ... Fatty acknowledged Willie
Was one of the best straight pool players ever, and wanted nothing
To do with him as far as that game went... but, willie would not budge
On gambling a nickel other than on straight pool
He even offered Fatty to finish out the match for money
But with willie already way ahead ... There is no way
He was gonna get into a banking match at 500 a game
With Fats ! Obviously Fats was not all that bad of a player
He has beaten Ronnie too with Ronnie giving up a ball in 1970 or so
way way past Fatty's prime. According also, To Freddie ( R I P ),
He has watched Fatty run his share of 8 and outs on Ronnie
According to Jersey Red, Boston Shorty, Ronnie Allen
And even Eddie Taylor ! He was a gambler .. and a real good gambler arlt that
That farce on WWOS in 1978 was a joke. Willie won sure
Big deal .. Fatty offered to play him 500 a game one pocket
He also offered banks.. when willie shook him off.. he
Also said... ok Willie... you want straight pool.. tell ya what
Lets play straight pool with every other shot being a bank ?
How's that... again willie shook him off ... Fatty acknowledged Willie
Was one of the best straight pool players ever, and wanted nothing
To do with him as far as that game went... but, willie would not budge
On gambling a nickel other than on straight pool
He even offered Fatty to finish out the match for money
But with willie already way ahead ... There is no way
He was gonna get into a banking match at 500 a game
With Fats ! Obviously Fats was not all that bad of a player
He has beaten Ronnie too with Ronnie giving up a ball in 1970 or so
way way past Fatty's prime. According also, To Freddie ( R I P ),
He has watched Fatty run his share of 8 and outs on Ronnie
Last edited:
There is one that stands out in your list, as Mosconi did in his generation, and that's Mike Sigel. Sigel was also a much more all around player (of the games) than Mosconi.
He shouldn't even be in the same room with the rest of these guys.
GoldenFlash
Banned
And how does anybody know whether or not any business was being done?
I didn't trust any of them...and still don't.
I think most of us have learned that regardless of how good or great any athlete, team or pool player
truly is, and this applies to even the legends of pool, each and every competitor in every sport that's
imaginable can have an off day, or not feel well the day of competition, or get screwed by the judges
or referees.....in pool, it's called rub of the green just like in golf. i.e., horribly bad luck.
History has proven, at least based upon team and individual stats, that the best team or competitor
does not always prevail. I think sports pundits have rationalized this into the old expression......
"On any given day, blah, blah blah."
Of course that's true and we all know that. I learned that lesson over the years losing a few wagers.
Well, the same applies to any pool match today.......and a repeatable winning performance is truly
the best gauge and confirmation of durability, consistency and greatness. That's why the original
format of the U.S. Open in straight pool is the most fair measure of pool skills created and I miss it.
Regional competition to decide the field; thereafter, round robin competition until the last two standing to compete for the U.S. Open Championship (14.1).
It wasn't a single game, or a race to best of. Oh no, the legends were men of stamina, determination and greatly skilled players. Indeed, there's little doubt that
Willie was the best of the best. In straight pool, Willie had runs of 365, 355, 322, 309 and regularly ran 150 and out. Let's see today's players accomplish that
on any size table. Irving Crane said he feared Willie the most, even when Irving held a big lead because Crane knew that if he missed, the match might be over.
Irving felt he couldn't afford to miss because that's just how good Mosconi was. He'd just steam roll right over you to victory if he got the opportunity.
The original format of the U.S. Open allowed for the final two competitors to have a hot hand or even a couple of great games because it was a race but not to
a specific number of games. It was the first player to reach 2500 points and so the Open Championship was played in a series of cities across the U.S.A. Since
there wasn't any television or radio coverage, the results were available in the newspapers only or by actual attendance.
Yup, first man to reach 2500 points determines the winner seemed like the most equitable format to decide the best player since if you had an off day and were
blown away in one of your matches, even 2 or 3 of them, you still could control the outcome since there was a lot of road left to travel. In my opinion, that format,
while admittedly taking a lot a longer, provided the best venue for truly deciding the greatest player more than any other format. And in that kingdom, Willie wore the crown.
Matt B.
truly is, and this applies to even the legends of pool, each and every competitor in every sport that's
imaginable can have an off day, or not feel well the day of competition, or get screwed by the judges
or referees.....in pool, it's called rub of the green just like in golf. i.e., horribly bad luck.
History has proven, at least based upon team and individual stats, that the best team or competitor
does not always prevail. I think sports pundits have rationalized this into the old expression......
"On any given day, blah, blah blah."
Of course that's true and we all know that. I learned that lesson over the years losing a few wagers.
Well, the same applies to any pool match today.......and a repeatable winning performance is truly
the best gauge and confirmation of durability, consistency and greatness. That's why the original
format of the U.S. Open in straight pool is the most fair measure of pool skills created and I miss it.
Regional competition to decide the field; thereafter, round robin competition until the last two standing to compete for the U.S. Open Championship (14.1).
It wasn't a single game, or a race to best of. Oh no, the legends were men of stamina, determination and greatly skilled players. Indeed, there's little doubt that
Willie was the best of the best. In straight pool, Willie had runs of 365, 355, 322, 309 and regularly ran 150 and out. Let's see today's players accomplish that
on any size table. Irving Crane said he feared Willie the most, even when Irving held a big lead because Crane knew that if he missed, the match might be over.
Irving felt he couldn't afford to miss because that's just how good Mosconi was. He'd just steam roll right over you to victory if he got the opportunity.
The original format of the U.S. Open allowed for the final two competitors to have a hot hand or even a couple of great games because it was a race but not to
a specific number of games. It was the first player to reach 2500 points and so the Open Championship was played in a series of cities across the U.S.A. Since
there wasn't any television or radio coverage, the results were available in the newspapers only or by actual attendance.
Yup, first man to reach 2500 points determines the winner seemed like the most equitable format to decide the best player since if you had an off day and were
blown away in one of your matches, even 2 or 3 of them, you still could control the outcome since there was a lot of road left to travel. In my opinion, that format,
while admittedly taking a lot a longer, provided the best venue for truly deciding the greatest player more than any other format. And in that kingdom, Willie wore the crown.
Matt B.
Spot on! Hard to argue about rolls and all the other nonsense in a round robin.
Effren Play's balkline, like a pool player
From that video of his match with sir Raymond
Just noticed eddy leppens was the ref
Last edited:
I think you misunderstood what I said. I never said he wasn't great for pool and I certainly never said he wasn't good. If you think he could match even against Mosconi (14.1), Wimpy (9 ball), Ronnie Allen (1p) or Harold Worst (any game) then maybe I don't know anything.
When I say top players I'm not talking top 10 or 20. I'm talking about the top players, 1-3
*edit* On a side note why reply to a post that's a year and a half old?
Last edited:
PoolChump
Banned
Pool may be a lost cause
I don't believe anybody or anything will improve the popularity of the games of pool until the root problems causing its decline are rectified. :sorry:
One could argue that those who contributed most in growing the game and sparking interest among the masses are the outsiders like Fats, Newman, Cruise NOT the champions /pro players/HOF
I don't believe anybody or anything will improve the popularity of the games of pool until the root problems causing its decline are rectified. :sorry: