justinb386
Banned
Yeah, I am very curious to learn some names of players who have done better (then SVB) in pool tournaments over the past 7 years (and 9 months). I am talking major pro tournaments.
Who will be Player of the Decade?
- Thread starter PhilosopherKing
- Start date
Yeah, I am very curious to learn some names of players who have done better (then SVB) in pool tournaments over the past 7 years (and 9 months). I am talking major pro tournaments.
justinb386
Banned
What about his back to back runner up finishes at the W9BC? Does that not count for much? He came very close to winning it 2 years in a row. Who else has done that?
justinb386
Banned
I repeat, he came very close 2 years in a row (beat by KO Pin-yi, and then by Albin Ouschan, the next year, correct me if I am wrong). That is really strong (back to back runner up finishes at the W9BC).
Player of the decade.
Decade = 10 years
Who has won more and been more consistent than Shane?
Shane has DCC MOTs in that mix...and other open titles.
Big Ko has won a sh*t ton; so has Albin Ouschan.
Yes, hence backing up my point, he has failed to deliver on the World stage.
That is typically how great sportsman are recognised, not by how well they did domestically (appreciate with US-centric sports it may be one and the same...but pool is no longer just a US sport).
Not many granted...but a few, which is all that matters...how many WORLD Championships has SVB won, zero unless I'm very much mistaken?
SVB could have a fantastic 3 years and be player of the decade, but as it stands he has failed to deliver on the WORLD stage and hence can not be featured in a debate for player of the decade.
Unless of course you're only talking about the US player of the decade, which is a different debate and not the question the OP seemed to be asking.
World championships are not the only important tournaments. In golf, you have 4 majors. I would guess you have 4 majors in pool also. I believe someone stated the China Open, World championship, US Open and DCC Master of the Table. Look at all 4 for the last 7 years, and tell me who has won the most. He gets my vote ( like I've got one)
In Golf and Tennis you do of course have the 'major' concept, however I believe all cue sports have a clearly defined World Championship for each discipline, which is the pinnacle so its not quite the same.
Do explain how coming in 2nd in two straight years is "failing to deliver"
Also, please give an exact answer to my question of who has been more consistent and won more tournaments?
All this talk about not winning outside of the US. Newsflash. There's only like 2 or 3 major events outside of the US, and everything else is played here.
Very good post, IMO...to take it to the extreme, if Shane won everything but a world title...
...he'd have to be called player of the decade.
Um...he failed to deliver, I'm not sure what's a grey area here, he has not won a World Championship.
No idea, its irrelevant, all that matters is who wins on the biggest stage when discussing the greatest player of an era/decade etc.
That said Neils Fjein and Darren Appleton are both multiple World Champions, so those two for a start, they have delivered on the biggest stage.
For the record I'm not suggesting SVB isn't consistently good, he may well have the most consistent win ratio out there (I have no idea), but its not relevant as he has failed to deliver when it counts.
Correct, there are only a few MAJOR events outside the US, they just happen to be the most important ones, i.e. the WORLD Championships.
Also...if you're going to count winning the US Open multiple times as the definition of greatness, would you not have to apply the same logic to the European Championships (less prize money, but very tough to win)?
Not really.
By definition if he hasn't been winning the World Championships that means other players have, hence they would have delivered on the biggest stage whilst SVB would have fallen at the final hurdle.
Its like an Athlete who wins everything and gets silver at the Olympics...are they ever considered the greatest? Does anyone remember their names...bar a few die hard fans not really.
justinb386
Banned
So, back to back runner up finishes at the World 9 Ball Championships is failing to deliver on the world stage (not to mention his success at the World Pool Masters)? Has any other players did that well (runner up finishes) at the World 9 ball championships 2 years in a row, within the last 7 years?
justinb386
Banned
So, you are basically saying that in order to deliver on the world stage, a player must get 1st place in the World Championships, and his back to back 2nd place finishes count for nothing. That makes zero sense to me.
I did not watch the finals of the Albin Ouschan match of the W9BC, but I do remember that he came within 2 games (or was it 3?) of winning the year before that against Ko Pin Yi. I imagine that it was a toss up, and it could have went either way in the finals of both those back to back years that he came in 2nd. All this stuff about 2nd place (at the World 9 ball championships) meaning nothing (and meaning that he still failed to deliver on the world stage) makes zero sense to me.
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If you were to ask any pro player whether they would rather win the World Pool Masters or the World 9-Ball Championships, 100% would say the latter.
The reason being, it is the pinnacle.
The World Pool Masters is a very difficult tournament to win, but it is an invitational, not an Open event for starters, so slightly different, also there are only 16 runners.
It is a great achievement to win and of course if two players were both World Champions and one had additionally won the World Pool Masters or another high profile tournament (e.g. the US Open) and the other had not, then of course that player would be considered to have achieved more.
Well yes, each year SVB lost someone else won...so Albin Ouschan and Ko Pin-Yi would be the obvious 2!
Again, ask any pro player if they'd rather be a multiple runner up or a single time winner?
100% will say the latter (you can apply that to any sport actually, not just pool).
It doesn't count for nothing, it means he is one of the best in the world.
It also means as he has never won, he can not be considered the Greatest.
Its crystal clear really, in pro sport 2nd place is a well paid loser...better than 99% of the world yes, but not the Champ, which is all that counts in the world of professional sport.
I agree with you that SVB is deserving, but there is another guy that has been absolutely steam rolling the opposition, if he keeps it up he will have a strong shot at passing SVB, his name is Ken Forfun I think, Im not exactly sure of the spelling of his surname. :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:
justinb386
Banned
I give up. It is too difficult to argue with your logic, and your way of thinking. In my mind, SVB has delivered on the world stage. He has had some pretty good success at the W9BC, with 2 back to back runner up finishes (in very tough fields of players, I imagine). You may have your own opinion (which I imagine that not 1 single person would agree with). I am done here.