CTE PRO ONE: Tyler is a champion using it... now what? discredit CTE more?

[Low500]

Professional Instructor Stan Shuffett says this....

Stan says.........."BC-21 couldn't be more wrong if he thinks curtain shots are limited to 5 or 6 angles. That kind of thinking just further exposes his ignorance about my work. CTE PRO ONE does not use the whole pocket as in slop pocket crap. There’s a zillion different shot lines on a 2:1 surface and CTE PRO ONE can use them all."

Low IQ says........."Yep, Stan is absolutely right".

 

[BryanB]

Maybe this will be a shorter discussion than I thought. Do you change the amount of pivot or the bridge distance depending on the shot, while using those 2 or 3 "angles"?

No. I try to maintain the same bridge length on every shot. That make the whole pre-shot routine much more fluid if you are always using the same stance a distance. Pivots are always the same, ending up at center ball before the shot. I do small lateral type adjustments if I want to use any spin.
I just find it easier to use 2-3 core shot angles for everything. Not saying I don't ever use some helping english if I feel the angle is between 2.
There was (and still is) trial and error. I am not a pro by any means. I found a system that works for me and I use it.

 

[BC21]

Stan says.........."BC-21 couldn't be more wrong if he thinks curtain shots are limited to 5 or 6 angles. That kind of thinking just further exposes his ignorance about my work. CTE PRO ONE does not use the whole pocket as in slop pocket crap. There’s a zillion different shot lines on a 2:1 surface and CTE PRO ONE can use them all."

Low IQ says........."Yep, Stan is absolutely right".

I am specifically referencing the 15 curtain shots. Anyone with eyes that can watch this video, and pay attention, will notice the same thing I noticed.

Just to prove I'm not making anything up, no ignorance or manipulation on my end, here is the video. Watch it yourself.
https://youtu.be/-1v49xzCKc4

There are 15 shots, but only 6 different shot angles are used, left cuts and rights cuts with the same angled setups.

Shots 1 and 2, same angle
Shots 3 and 4, same angle
Shots 5, 8, 12 and 14, same angle
Shots 6 and 9, same angle
Shots 7, 10 and 11, same angle
Shots 13 and 15, same angle

 

[BC21]

No. I try to maintain the same bridge length on every shot. That make the whole pre-shot routine much more fluid if you are always using the same stance a distance. Pivots are always the same, ending up at center ball before the shot. I do small lateral type adjustments if I want to use any spin.
I just find it easier to use 2-3 core shot angles for everything. Not saying I don't ever use some helping english if I feel the angle is between 2.
There was (and still is) trial and error. I am not a pro by any means. I found a system that works for me and I use it.

In bold is what matters most. I don't care what anyone does, and I don't ridicule them or throw out derogatory personal comments simply because they don't aim pool balls the way I aim pool balls. Good for you. Keep stroke'n em up.

 

[BryanB]

There are 15 shots, but only 6 different shot angles are used, left cuts and rights cuts with the same angled setups.

The pockets are almost twice as wide as the ball. One angle can work for more than one shot

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

Pool is not any easy game to learn, what I find is many people think its about aiming, a cue, or some gizmo trading aid, or equiptment. Pool is like most things in life, if you wish to be sucessful at. It takes work, practice, and time.

There is no magic wands, if you have no skill. A ___ Cue is not going to make you a great player.

Tight Woods could still play golf at a very high level, if he was playing with a cheap set of borrowed Golf Clubs. I mention Tiger as his work & practice ethic is what makes him a great golfer.

 

[BC21]

The pockets are almost twice as wide as the ball. One angle can work for more than one shot

True enough. Common sense tells us this, but Stan says the system does not use "slop". He says every ball connects to "center pocket".

 

[BC21]

Pool is not any easy game to learn, what I find is many people think its about aiming, a cue, or some gizmo trading aid, or equiptment. Pool is like most things in life, if you wish to be sucessful at. It takes work, practice, and time.

There is no magic wands, if you have no skill. A ___ Cue is not going to make you a great player.

Tight Woods could still play golf at a very high level, if he was playing with a cheap set of borrowed Golf Clubs. I mention Tiger as his work & practice ethic is what makes him a great golfer.

Good point. Ever see a player playing over his head for a while after buying a new cue? He thinks it's the cue, but it's really a temporary boost in confidence, a placebo. Soon enough he's back down to normal.

 

[BryanB]

Pool is not any easy game to learn, what I find is many people think its about aiming, a cue, or some gizmo trading aid, or equiptment. Pool is like most things in life, if you wish to be successful at. It takes work, practice, and time..

True true. Learning how to aim is only a small factor. Learning how to aim while using spin to get shape, doing the above while learning speed control,having a good stroke and the ability to see the patterns are all factors to be learned and practiced.
Learn how to do it and then hit balls using your arm wants to fall off...then repeat.

 

[Dan White]

No. I try to maintain the same bridge length on every shot. That make the whole pre-shot routine much more fluid if you are always using the same stance a distance. Pivots are always the same, ending up at center ball before the shot. I do small lateral type adjustments if I want to use any spin.
I just find it easier to use 2-3 core shot angles for everything. Not saying I don't ever use some helping english if I feel the angle is between 2.
There was (and still is) trial and error. I am not a pro by any means. I found a system that works for me and I use it.

When you say you use 2 or 3 core angles are you referring to the ETA, ETB and/or ETC perceptions?

 

[Patrick Johnson]

The pockets are almost twice as wide as the ball. One angle can work for more than one shot

CTE defines 8 cut angles: 3/4, 1/2, 1/4 & 1/8 ball fractions times two (for "inside" and "outside" pivots). Even with 4 3/4" pockets (more than twice as wide as a ball) that translates to only half the needed cut angles for all 2-foot shots, diminishing rapidly from there for longer shots, as you can see from the graph below.

pj
chgo

 

[BryanB]

When you say you use 2 or 3 core angles are you referring to the ETA, ETB and/or ETC perceptions?

For me, for 90% of the shots I use, my angles are based of an edge to edge or edge to center then pivot

 

[BryanB]

Do you have a link to the 90/90 video that made it click for you?

I'm at work and youtube is blocked but try searching for Ron Vitello and 90/90 aiming ( I think). It may clear up things for you.
It could also be Neil Dryfhout

 

[BC21]

CTE defines 8 cut angles: 3/4, 1/2, 1/4 & 1/8 ball fractions times two (for "inside" and "outside" pivots). Even with 4 3/4" pockets (more than twice as wide as a ball) that translates to only half the needed cut angles for all 2-foot shots, diminishing rapidly from there for longer shots, as you can see from the graph below.

pj
chgo

View attachment 533424

It actually defines more than 8 cut angles. The perception itself is not a precise fractional line that remains constant for reference purposes, like fractions. In other words, place a cb and ob on the table and use a 15° perception (ETA and CTE lines) to get a " fixed " cb. Look straight through this fixed ccb line to where it lands on the ob. Now move the cb back or forward a few inches and use the same visuals to get another fixed cb perception. It will not be the same as the previous perception. So even though the system utilizes about 6 to 8 different shot angles for each setup, they are not always the same set of angles.

It can't be compared to fractional aiming because there is no set ob reference point for any given shot. The ob reference points are used to get a certain cb perception/visual perspective, and this perception varies depending on the shot, even when the same ob reference points are used.

 

[JC]

One of the greatest things about CTE is that those who know it -- use it, and those that play really well and don't know they are using it -- are using it too!

Yes I'm trolling.

Have a good day everyone.

If you choose not to decide to use it you still have made a choice to use it?

 

[Patrick Johnson]

[CTE] actually defines more than 8 cut angles. The perception itself is not a precise fractional line that remains constant for reference purposes, like fractions.

A "perception" isn't a defined cut angle - it's just another way of saying "you'll know it when you see it" (after lots of practice).

Actually, I was being generous - CTE defines only 4 cut angles (the fractions), which then are "adjusted" with undefined "perceptions" and pivots.

pj
chgo

 

[JC]

A "perception" isn't a defined cut angle - it's just another way of saying "you'll know it when you see it" (after lots of practice).

Actually, I was being generous - CTE defines only 4 cut angles (the fractions), which then are "adjusted" with undefined "perceptions" and pivots.

pj
chgo

This is and always has been the rub of understanding for me. If there's a perception it's not science, it's art.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

A "perception" isn't a defined cut angle - it's just another way of saying "you'll know it when you see it" (after lots of practice).

Actually, I was being generous - CTE defines only 4 cut angles (the fractions), which then are "adjusted" with undefined "perceptions" and pivots.

This is and always has been the rub of understanding for me. If there's a perception it's not science, it's art.

And I guess it has to be said again: this doesn't mean CTE "doesn't work" - just that its users mostly don't know how it works (hint: about like every other system).

pj
chgo

 

[BryanB]

Everyone perceives things in a different way.

 

[BC21]

A "perception" isn't a defined cut angle - it's just another way of saying "you'll know it when you see it" (after lots of practice).

Actually, I was being generous - CTE defines only 4 cut angles (the fractions), which then are "adjusted" with undefined "perceptions" and pivots.

pj
chgo

Honestly, and I'm not a CTE user, the perceptions aren't difficult, not mysterious. Well, except that bit about the same visuals supplying two different perceptions for two different shots when the distance between cb and ob is the same for each shot. That one is unexplainable. However, everything else in the system is explainable and falls within the realm of reality, just not in manner that matches up with words like "center pocket" or "connecting to right angles" or "two by one playing surface", etc... But as with many things in life, like religion and politics, reality is what you believe, not necessarily what is real.