They both might like to vaporize the recording of that game.
[And, as is not infrequent, they got the score wrong.]
The Hal Houle Post
- Thread starter Dan White
- Start date
They both might like to vaporize the recording of that game.
[And, as is not infrequent, they got the score wrong.]
Hi guys. Jasmine is really pretty when she smiles.
Carry on...
Carry on...
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this!!
Which also makes it very apparent why Hohmann won the championship.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yc_TRDv7GRw
It's soooo tough to keep the game sharp for years and decades tournament after tournament for anyone. Except Mosconi when it came to 14.1. But even he lost.
Agree completely about the rabbit hole and the "aha" moments. I keep thinking I have it nailed and then something changes and I'm back to experimenting again. I have noticed that some variables are more important than others. Meaning, whenever I get away from doing something a particular way, the results deteriorate. At the same time, there are other variables that I can change and it doesn't seem to matter as much. For instance, I have found that keeping the elbow as still as possible is very important for me and produces good results every time I stick to it. On the other hand, foot position doesn't seem to be as critical. As long as my upper body is in the correct alignment the feet aren't that important.
Now, if I solve all the other problems then maybe foot position becomes more important. Everything is intertwined and seeking perfection is a mess. I think in the long run finding those critical variables that matter puts us on the right path.
Dan, I have always felt that you cannot gain success by trying to do what you describe: something like keeping your elbow still.
IMO, everything -- stroke wise -- is an organic whole, and if you're thinking about something specific like that you are doomed to failure. Everything, IMO, is to be found further upstream at the starting point. You cannot be thinking of elbows or wrists or shoulders under the heat. BUT if your initial starting point is true, all that follows will flow in harmony.
Lou Figueroa
wax on
wax off
This is a difficult subject to discuss in a forum. Takes long time to express certain ideas. I have a particular shooting style or PSR that I have more or less settled on, but it is not something I have actively tried to ingrain through rote ala Tor Lowry type drills. I haven't done that because I'm playing too sporatically and don't feel like I should be ingraining anything yet.
Having said that, I have found certain attributes about my eye alignment, shoulder turn, elbow, fingers, etc. that when done together give me really good results. If I don't play for a week I may find that I'm not following that procedure 100%. I attribute that failure to the lack of spending the time to really ingrain that stroke as mentioned above, not because I'm doing something that isn't natural. When I get the elbow working as I think it should I do not think about "not moving it" on each shot. Instead, the stroke motion with the fixed elbow has a certain feel to it and that is what I try to make my natural, normal stroke. It becomes automatic, especially when you see the positive results.
Not sure if that addresses what you are saying.
I can't speak for Lou and I probably shouldn't be speaking for me either but...seriously?
"eye alignment, shoulder turn, elbow, fingers, etc"
Eye alignment, yes. But shoulder turn, elbow, fingers? I can't imagine what the etc includes on top of the rest.
I shoulda stayed out but this is mind numbing.
"eye alignment, shoulder turn, elbow, fingers, etc"
Eye alignment, yes. But shoulder turn, elbow, fingers? I can't imagine what the etc includes on top of the rest.
I shoulda stayed out but this is mind numbing.
What Dan and Lou are discussing is what I call.......going beyond technique. It is a transition into feel.......what feels right.
And this can not be explained as it is different for all players and some players never go beyond technique and therefore will never understand.
And this can not be explained as it is different for all players and some players never go beyond technique and therefore will never understand.
Not exactly.
What I'm saying is that the first thing in a sequence begets the second and the second the third and so on. So finding the first thing is the trick.
Lou Figueroa
Attachments
With the correct approach it all happens without thinking about it.
Lou Figueroa
No.
It's not what feels right -- it's what produces the best results on the table.
However, in a sense you are correct in that whatever the sequence is it should feel natural. When guys come up with strange little dances to get into shooting position, or twist themselves into odd positions that aren't natural for them, it's eventually going to break down.
Lou Figueroa
Despite what you think I know that you have a lot of pool knowledge. What am I missing? You and Lou talk about your wrist position and that's good but I talk about other aspects of play and that's bad? What exactly are you saying?
What are you missing? I'm guessing nothing because you seem to be thinking about and doing everything known to mankind before you shoot each shot as it is.
Exactly. Very well said.
There are certain techniques or instructions that you can show or demonstrate to people in order to help them learn or understand, but techniques and instructions are not skills... they're seeds.
Seeds can potentially grow into great skills if cultivated properly. It takes individual work. Eventually the seeds are no longer seeds. They grow into feel, into something you just know and do automatically without consciously thinking about it or trying to do it. No amount of seeds or instructions can magically give a player the feel of just knowing when his stroke is in tune. That is something that comes from experience and practice
It's sort of like learning to juggle. A master juggler could show you exactly how he or she does it. They can show you with their hands, or with drawings, the proper technique and trajectory of each toss, the timing of each catch and release. But these instructions, these seeds, won't grow into much without dedicated work from you. You'll never get a feel for it unless you work on developing your own feel for it.
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It’s not what feels right, but it is.......just to re word.
When things are feeling right....I’m shooting very well.
One of my little sayings when I’m start shooting poorly is..........Stop thinking.
What other people do is irrelevant. They haven't figured it out yet, and may never do so.
There are some very unnatural shooting positions. I can setup a shot that allows for the “standard type shooting position” and then just move the setup, keeping the same shot angle to a different part of the table requiring a unnatural shooting position.
Is sitting on the side of the table to get into position for a shot natural?
The shooting position has one requirement only........to allow for the right stroke to be used.......wether a natural type position or unnatural type shooting position.
Again, I'm not following you. Who said anything about thinking about all of those variables while shooting? Do you think about cocking your wrist before every shot? Have you cocked your wrist since the first day you picked up a cue, or did someone recommend it? When you started learning to do it did you sometimes forget to do it and realize that you needed time to burn it in to your approach so that it became automatic?
Hard to follow you without specifics. I'm still waiting on the book (and I'm not talking about that other guy's). :wink:
Ask Lou. I think you'll be more apt to accept whatever he has to say than me. Why? You've never listened at all to anything I've said about a certain subject for the last 10 years.
I think Lou had the same thought process that I did but he was more subtle with his initial response. Ask him to be more specific and lay it on the line especially in the area which you are focusing on and described.
He already said it. "Dan, I have always felt that you cannot gain success by trying to do what you describe: something like keeping your elbow still.
IMO, everything -- stroke wise -- is an organic whole, and if you're thinking about something specific like that you are doomed to failure. Everything, IMO, is to be found further upstream at the starting point. You cannot be thinking of elbows or wrists or shoulders under the heat. BUT if your initial starting point is true, all that follows will flow in harmony."
Have him embellish.
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I asked Lou to publish his book already (the one he might or might not have been writing) because saying something vague in 2 or 3 lines isn't much to go on, not that he was trying to lay out all the particulars.
Since you mocked my post I would have thought you had your own thoughts on the matter but maybe that is asking too much.